Another LHS Closing

Jerry,

   Unfortunately it does not surprise me, there are many businesses thru out the country that are closing up, the economy is really in bad shape, and hobbies like ours

are taking a major hit.  I really hate to see this happening.

PCRR/Dave

Yes its sad to see.But its not because of the economy.It's peoples buying habits.The people that have it....HAVE it.Guys on here can not wait to drop 2-3 grand on the anticipated Vision Line Big boy,other high end items and etc etc etc and so forth.80% of the people on here and in the hobby buy there trains from "the auction site"Money talks brother!It IS what is putting your LHS into extinction.

It's too bad but the mom and pop stores can't keep up with the big chains and online stores. Weather you have it or not people are not going to spend more than they have to for anything and will always try to get the best price possible. That's just the way it is; human nature. Small hobby shops can't survive on smaller purchases like some scenery material or paints here and there especially with what some retail rents are these day's.

Another factor is many owners of even the profitable LHS's are well past retirement age and are weary of working 6-7 days a week. They feel it's time to move on and who wants to buy their business and all the work that goes with it for little potential profit margins. It's easier to just have the fire sale and close shop.

 

Steve

 

Trains Ltd. in St. Louis is closing their doors today.  Retired owner is moving to Florida. 

My thoughts and good wishes to the LHS owner and employees. I'm sure the last turn of the lock will be a sad moment for them. 

I was talking to a good friend of mine a little over a week ago. He told me that he had bought a Lionel set to give as a Christmas gift to his grandson. And he was telling me that the owner was retiring from the business.

 

I wonder if this threatens as much the general LHS: radio control model cars, airplanes, ships, in addition to trains, as well as the three rail specific or even all train specific shops such as Denver's Caboose Hobbies?  I certainly know of several

that have shut their doors, at least three were three rail specific....I remember one

"tinplate" shop I walked into, with almost bare shelves, whose clerk/owner? was complaining about the sporadic way trains are made and shipped...he had orders,

but nothing to deliver.  (but as a kid I remember trains as a seasonal item, that you

could not find in Sears or Woolworth's before Thanksgiving or after the holidays, so

wouldn't today's year round demand by hobbyists make for a better, though smaller,  market?)

I am not surprised-I expect more to go out especially when the internet state tax comes into effect-there is little profit in selling trains-shipping costs have increased

a lot-it is really a seasonal hobby-I believe in the future we will be forced to buy

from the top 10 only-add where a lot of the trains do not work perfectly out of the

box and need repairs-try getting parts from mth and a response-who knows how long midge -who is a saint-is going to work-what then-add expenses-advertising-rent-electricity-etc..makes you wonder why we have any lhs at all-ho is saving most of the train stores-just my imput-I;ve been selling trains for 18 years and my overhead is fraction of what a lhs has-days when trains were collectable and making a profit

are over-manufacturers are remaking everything every 3 years-how many times has a big boy been produced-every time a new feature comes out it makes everything we have obsolete -the new electronics are out pacing what a store is selling .

these opinions are my opinions only. enjoy your trains-run them-collect them-enjoy

them for the pleasure you get and memories-joe

Indeed, Jim Rogers, the owner of Yorktowne Hobbies is closing for retirement purposes, not because of lack of sales. Jim is in his 70's and has had enough of working. Plus, Jim has had some personal issues that have possibly prompted this also.

 

Being a combination model plane and train store Jim always had a great supply of wood shapes and other items not usually found in an exclusively model train store.

 

I believe he said he had until Jan 15th to have the store cleared so the property owner can re-lease the space.

Thats too bad they are closing but a lot of places have it very tuff these days.

I have feared this for a long time, and as was pointed out above, it affects not only model trains, but R/C airplanes and cars (and watercraft).

 

I strongly believe that one of the culprits is the proliferation of the new ‘electronic’ games and gadgets, including the ‘i-devices’. I am all for technology, which has been my life’s bread and butter, but one of its unintended consequences has been its detrimental effect on traditional toys, such as the ones with which most 40+ year olds grew up: trains, airplanes, cars, erector sets, plastic models, chemistry sets (do they even exist?), etc.

 

I sincerely hope that the new move to operating trains via ‘i-devices’ does not further harm the hobby. In my humblest opinion, one of the most rewarding and educational experience with trains is the actual planning and building a layout; whether carpet central or a museum-style masterpiece, and I don’t see the more 'remote' way of operating the trains do anything for this. If we cannot figure out how to get the younger generation involved at the early stages, then I do believe the hobby is doomed.

 

This past weekend we had a number of visitors, and among them were three children, all girls, between the ages of six and nine. All of them went nuts over the trains and all the layout details. They were here for almost two hours, and never lost interest.

 

To make a long story short, I can recap my wonderful experience by one of the comments made by the six-year old. While showing all of them some of the details UNDER the layout, this six-year old (Adrienne) said, “Alex, let’s fix something now.” To which I replied, “But there really is nothing to fix right now.” And she came back with, “Well, then let’s build something!”

 

What was common among all three girls? Their parents made a point to note that they did not allow the girls to use i-phones, i-pads, or anything of the sort. Coincidence?

 

Have wonderful Merry Christmas!

 

Alex

 

David1 explains it well. The retail model is changing so rapidly that I predict that we can't even imagine what form it will take in the next few years. To me the prospects are exciting. We are a flexible people and our hobby is as well.

If I had to live in NYC on my salary without any cola adjustment, my income would already be disposed of for me.

 

Rusty

It’s not the hobby that’s in decline. It is more like the retail distribution model is changing and has been evolving for over 40-50 years and as time marches on it will continue to evolve. It has nothing to do with I-pods, I-Pads, computers, electronic games or anything else that’s part of the 21^st century.

 

 Starting in the 70’s & 80’s it was the proliferation of strip malls and the rise of the “big-box” stores that started the decline of the small-town center…the retail area where there were all kinds of small shops that provided all the goods & services that we all consumed, including trains and other hobbies, as well as providing a living for their owners, lots of jobs and a place for members of a community to simply gather. Today, most small retail stores that still exist in the town centers are part of a national chain and now the first thing I do when I want to buy anything (cameras, TV’s, CDs, DVD’s, trains, even shoes for God’s sake) because I have no loyalty to a national chain is I Google whatever it is I’m looking for.  Inevitably up will pop all kinds of offers for everything and anything where I can compare prices, make a decision and I won’t ever have to leave my house to get it. My son tells me that I’m showing my age when I say I want to buy a DVD. He says I should either stream it or download it. Remember as little as 10 years ago, Blockbuster was huge (and the guy who owned it was able to buy the Miami Dolphins?) Today Blockbuster is gone. Staples destroyed the small-town stationery store, Home Depot destroyed the hardware store, CVS killed the drug store and I could go on and on.

 

So unfortunately, that’s “Progress.” But fear not for our hobby as well as for RC airplanes, model rockets, stamp collecting and the thousands of others. They will survive because they will adapt. The companies that manufacture and distribute will adapt too.  

If the complete demise of the LHS truly occurs, then all of us will be the worse for it.  The LHS is my first resource for this hobby of ours, and I only choose to use the Internet after LHSs within a reasonable distance of me have proven not to have what I want and/or cannot get what I want.

On another note, this year my entire Christmas shopping was done online, it was amazing. No crowds, no hassle and everything showed up at my front door. According to my niece this how the new generation shops, they go online, compare prices, order it and they are done.

 

This is one of the reasons that Ups and FedEx missed so many deliveries in time for Christmas.      You can bet that some people will be fired over their miscalculations. 

 

Welcome me to to the new ways of shopping, I like it!!

And that would be a BIG shame!  The real fault isn't with UPS or FedEx, which have no control over weather/flight delays, and which could not be expected to know how many fools are going to wait until the last minute to do their Christmas shopping online because all they want to do is nickel-and-dime businesses to death.  How can they be expected to anticipate and plan for those kinds of things?

 

We are a spoiled and narcissistic society driven by rampant consumerism, and it will eventually be our demise in more ways than one.  Who cares if a Christmas gift arrives a day or two late?  That's not what Christmas is supposed to be about anyhow. 

 

All that "Oh, us poor consumers" stuff I see in the media ticks me off to no end!

Some say the economy has done LHS in. I agree to an extent.  Changing retail times,some of the Hobby shops are doing gang buster business, they are larger and more adaptable to the new online shopper and they are able to move a larger volume of goods For a cheaper price. " online is the old mail-order ". I am guilty of buying things online but I try to give my local hobby shop some of my business..

While this hobby certainly has more competition from new tech toys of all types, I disagree with Nick and others saying the LHS can't compete with the auction house.

I got 3 Train Items this year and 2 them came from the LHS. One came from a big box store.

Can they be found for a little less online? Sure, but how do you get it serviced if there is a problem?

 

Are numerous stores closing with no new owners to fill the hole? Yep. Do YOU want to do that job? I this Economy? There lies the problem.

 

Certainly, There are very pricey items out there that only a few of us can afford.

There are also many more affordable items if you are willing to save up and get them when they come out. My new #7 Galloping Goose w PS-3 was only $259 at the LHS. Less if you mail order (He is online as well) but the shipping will balance it out.

Personally I like to actually look at and handle something I'm going to buy and test it out if I can. That way if there's a problem it can be remedied then and there and doesn't involve me having to ship it back to somewhere and there's no chance of a UPS or Fedex gorilla busting up the package or it walking off before I get home. Plus since I always pay cash the odds of identity theft are nil. I do buy some things online but only if it's something I can't get local or is something special.

 

Jerry

"We are a spoiled and narcissistic society driven by rampant consumerism, and it will eventually be our demise in more ways than one.  Who cares if a Christmas gift arrives a day or two late?  That's not what Christmas is supposed to be about anyhow.

 

All that "Oh, us poor consumers" stuff I see in the media ticks me off to no end!"

 

Allan, thank you for having the courage to say that. And it's not just in the "media" but right here on all the train forums too.

 

Everyone I know who works in the service sector says people have become more impatient, more demanding and act like they are owed $2 worth of service for a $1 price. It's no small coincidence that many electronic devices start with "i" like iPod and iPad... it other words it's all about "me."

 

On-line shopping is a big part of the economy now. But it has drawbacks. Anyone else notice the threads asking if anyone has photos of the new train? And then the replies such as "Where are the photos?" and "Photos please." As if the person who took a chance and bought the product is now obligated to post photos so the others who want to mail order it can actually "see it" before they spend their OWN money, so they don't have to send it back to the mail order vendor, usually at their own expense.

 

Neil Young once sang "Nothing is perfect in God's perfect land." The sooner one accepts that as a motto in life, the better your chances of actually being happy.

It already has been done At FedEx. It is their job to know the approx. number of packages coming thru the system and to adjust to it. It will cost FedEx and Ups millions of dollars in refunds and bad publicity. Somebody has to be held accountable. 

Allan,

 

Nobody is ever fired for weather conditions and delivery times do not apply. 

 

But remember both FedEx and Ups promise delivery times when a package is shipped. Some may not like it but it is today's mode of business. 

 

You can bet that both FedEx and Ups will not let this failure to happen again. This screw up has cost them millions of dollars. 

 

 

I've been looking at the news online and don't see any stories about anyone at UPS or Fedex losing their jobs over this yet. Lots of stories about people who ordered things 2 days before Christmas and then being upset it didn't come in time. Why would you wait til 2 days before Christmas to order a gift for someone? If there's the slightest hiccup you won't get it in time. You're just asking for trouble doing things last minute and then to complain like it's someone elses fault is like Alan said, "Oh us poor consumers", you want everything your way and right now, the world don't work that way nor does it care what you want. If you're going to do last minute shopping maybe you should actually go to a real store and stop being a 21st century hermit. And don't buy things online (like toy trains or electronics) that have a track record of sometimes not working properly out of the box

 

Jerry

Don't worry, all the delivery problems will be solved when everyone starts using drones...

 

Rusty

The firings are never made public. They left for other opportunities. This is the way things are done in corporate.  

 

Btw it does not matter if somebody orders two days before Christmas, if they pick two day air, overnight air or ground and it is in our stated area of delivery for that time promised then it will be delivered. If not, then there is **** to pay. 

All the wailing an gnashing of teeth about presents not arriving by Christmas...

 

It's amazing how folks in general have forgotten the lesson learned in "How the Grinch Stole Christmas..."

 

Rusty

Really?  They are going to have new hubs located and ready, and hundreds or perhaps thousands of new employees on standby, to cover for some major weather event or other disaster that might take place next December or in some future December?  Yeah...right...all contingencies can be planned for and covered in advance.  I sure would like to see the crystal ball they use, or meet the geniuses who are supposed to pull that off! 

"And that would be a BIG shame!  The real fault isn't with UPS or FedEx, which have no control over weather/flight delays, and which could not be expected to know how many fools are going to wait until the last minute...."

 

That was how I felt at first when I first read the story.  However let's be honest here.  The merchants and shipping companies are just as much to blame as the consumers.  The merchants could be honest and provide a reasonable cutoff date for the product arriving in time for Christmas.  The reason they don't is because they know apologies cost them less revenue than honesty.  The same applies to the shipping companies.  Like it or not the Amazons, UPSs and FedExs are just as responsible for this problem as the consumers.

I agree that all parties affected share in the blame for this unfortunate fiasco.  One of the problems is the "customer is always right" fallacy.  Merchants and shipping companies need to grow up and set reasonable and achievable goals for serving the customer.  The customer needs to grow up and deal in REALITY rather than the "perception is reality" myth.  To paraphrase Mr. Scrooge, every idiot who goes about with "perception is reality" on his lips, should be boiled with his own pudding, and buried with a stake of holly through his heart!

 You don't get the feel of Christmas when you do it all on line. I would much rather go to the mall and shop.

If delayed delivery of a gift "ruined" Christmas for some, as is being reported in the media and online, my feeling is those individuals don't have a clue as to what Christmas is really all about.

It is interesting, we hear of these stores closing and it is sad, no question.  But at the same time, in my hometown neck of the woods, there are a number of hobby stores that have been around for a long time and continue to, by all visible appearances, do just fine.  I am specifically thinking of Trainland / Trainworld, Nassau Hobby, and Willis Hobbies.  (Willis also does a lot of RC but they have a significant train component, tending towards the scale hobbyist.)  These are just three that jump out to me, but I wonder what they are doing right that other stores are not doing?  Maybe some of the other stores just aren't as well run?  I know that since moving to DC, other than driving a while to MBK or a fellow up in Gaithersburg, there really aren't any decent train-oriented hobby stores around, and the ones that are around are either grossly over-priced or they have lousy service. 

 

They sell thru the internet that is their secret as well as at the street level. Now what is the ratio of one type of sales level to the other for them is the question?

Some stores are doing just fine for a number of different reasons…probably too many reasons to list here (at least before I feed the pooch, take her out, and have some dinner myself).  There will always be "survivors" in this market, and we should all be grateful for that.  

 

But I suspect the main reason we're losing some retailers now is that these folks have been in the business for a long time, and the owners--many of whom are in my age group--simply are looking forward to enjoying some retirement time.  It's a bit more complex than that, of course, but I still suspect that is a primary reason.

 

We, like the real estate market and others, had our own "bubble" to contend with in the late 90s and the early years of this century (see the editor's column in the current TCA Quarterly), and even though the bubble has by no means burst, it is deflating a bit and will eventually find a new "normal" level to sustain it.

Well said Allen

 

 

Jerry

One upside of the postal package mess that I noticed while getting some stocking stuffers on christmas eve after work at a small specialty toy store was another harried dad whose last minute packages never came came in and spent $600 without blinking. He was in a hurry and got them wrapped and bought whatever the shop keeper showed him. He was in and out in 15 minutes. So this mess did benefit the little guy in the end.