Feedback issues

Are the trains both responding to commands at the same time? Any chance the are the same engine ID or were once part of a lash up? Try doing a factory reset (see owners manual) on both of them

thanks, for the quick responce. No, they both have separate ID's and the engine that started up was actually in a 4 engine lash up addressed to train one. The Engine that was running has an address of 918.

this is an electrical problem with track that I am certain. Can you open my attachment and see the track plan.

My switches are all ross with z2500's for machines. My only idea at this point may be an electrical current running into the switch that connects the yard to the oval track is reversing the signal

and causing some sort of feedback issue. but I am no expert.

Are they on separate blocks?  Could one engine as it rolls across the block cause the other to startup?  Although that doesn't explain it moving.

What are the 2 IDs in question because 918 isn't a valid TMCC/Legacy ID.

No. I never was told to try that at my local train store they think I need to rewire the entire lay out and that I may have feedback issues.I keep thinking how hard can this be? I mean it has to be a simple where to connect the power to the track issue. But it seems to be more complex than that. Can any of you see my diagram I attached. I have tried to move the power to different tracks but it throws a breaker. I have never ever set up blocks, and not sure how to do that actually.

I tried showing the local train store my wiring schematic and they are certified lionel repair and one of the largest stores in the northwest, but they did not clearly define how and what to do. If anyone would just say wire here. block there and provide me a simple drawing I would do it. Like I said I hope this is not that complicated, but I am stuck.

Im Sorry its engine 91, 918 is the full road number.

also the train that started up was in a 4 train lash-up, 70,83,75,74 are there ID's but the entire lash up started. it's ID is 1.

As long as the TMCC signal is good, turning power would not cause an engine to move. The other symptoms (blown breaker) could be out of phase power.

Please try the reset first (its easy) and set the ID's to any unused ID except 1 or 99

Looking at the track diagram you can want to run a second TMCC signal wire from the base to the other set of tracks or the Common post on both transformers

O.K. will do. But the issues are more than just that track and that one issue. I tried running everything off the 180 brick by only connecting it to the yard track and the oval track. get this.  power came on oval section. but power would not come on the yard track until I ran and engine across the section of track that connects them both. guess which track? The one we have been talking about from the beginning. So, again i ask how do I connect all tracks properly? I would like it if i only used the 180 brick. If anyone can look at my attached schematic maybe tell me how you would wire the layout. I know I will have to ad like another brick or a ZW to power fully all areas.

I really do appreciate everyone trying to help here. It's great to have you guys to turn to.

Hey, Great one! did not think to do that.  I only have the oval connected to the 

base, so run another one to the track with the issues? 

since your looking at my schematic. I have the 180 brick connected to only the oval attached via a lionel lock-on house that has a breaker. The power is run to a gargraves terminal track right before the number 16 switch on the oval. The MTH 1000 is connected to a MTH terminal and is located at the top right on the layout I then only powered to tracks with it. the track to the far right of switch 4 and the far right of switch 7 at the end.

with that said can anyone tell me why I cannot because I have tried to power all of this lay out with one transformer?

since your looking at my schematic. I have the 180 brick connected to only the oval attached via a lionel lock-on house that has a breaker. The power is run to a gargraves terminal track right before the number 16 switch on the oval. The MTH 1000 is connected to a MTH terminal and is located at the top right on the layout I then only powered TWO tracks with it. the track to the far right of switch 4 and the far right of switch 7 at the end.

with that said can anyone tell me why I cannot because I have tried to power all of this lay out with one transformer?

since your looking at my schematic. I have the 180 brick connected to only the oval attached via a lionel lock-on house that has a breaker. The power is run to a gargraves terminal track right before the number 16 switch on the oval. The MTH 1000 is connected to a MTH terminal and is located at the top right on the layout I then only powered to tracks with it. the track to the far right of switch 4 and the far right of switch 7 at the end.

with that said can anyone tell me why I cannot power all of this lay out with one transformer?

I mean I will buy a zw. But first I need to know a correct way anyone would wire this layout, until then buying more power is a waste of time. I know with running lash-up and several smoke units it will be the right thing to eventually do. And I want that.

Also, it is important to point out I think the MTH brick being 9 years old could be losing power. So, again if I get the power distributed correctly I think it may need to be taking off line and replaced either a zw 275 or another 180.

A single 180 should be OK to power it if you are not running a bunch of trains and lighted cars.

However you would want multiple drops. A 2-3 on the loop and a few scattered on the yard.

You might have a bad connection on the single track tying the 2 sections together, running over it may be enough to cause to to connect better

it seemed as though the 180 brick by itself could not run smoke units just the trains. I only run on 4 engine or two engine lash up at a time or one single engine. 

I do not run more than one train basically I'm saying. no lighted cars. I know that pulls down amps. hmmm, so I will see if I can get more feeders to the layout. Can I daisy chain together my gargraves terminals since I cannot pull directly from the 180? its plugged into the lionel lock-on house.

by the way they are gargraves terminals not switches, you meant terminals right? I have z2500's on ross track for switches.

The MTH Terminal would work

ok thx!

So, one last thing, you would totally disconnect the MTH 1000 brick, because it is failing I believe, then you are saying from the MTH terminal, feed the track in a spider web format

outward to all tracks. So, based on my layout, would you space those contacts 6' apart or 4'? I mean I want if the 180 can handle it to be able to run at least one 4 engine lash up over all parts of the track while running at least 2 smoke units in that lash up. And again I could just toggle switch off the portion of the layout or track Im am not using right? to cut down amps, Or, upgrade to a zw so I can leave all tracks on.  

And then run another data wire to the yard track from the legacy base.

I know I am jumping in late on this, but have you checked the phasing between the Lionel and MTH bricks?  If they happen to be opposite, you could get the behavior you are  experiencing.  If they are both putting out 18 volts, that is easy to do.  Without being connected to the layout, just connect the ground wires from each together.  Then get a volt meter and measure the AC voltage between the two positive terminals.  If it reads about 36 volts, they are out of phase.  If it reads 0, then you are in phase and the problem is elsewhere.

yea phasing is not it I totally disconnected the MTH from the layout and when I tried to run just the 180 it did this which below you can read what I posted earlier. Thanks for helping me though read below to see if you can make since of this.

 The issues are more than just that track and that one issue. I tried running everything off the 180 brick by only connecting it to the yard track and the oval track. get this.  power came on oval section. but power would not come on the yard track until I ran and engine across the section of track that connects them both. guess which track? The one we have been talking about from the beginning. So, again i ask how do I connect all tracks properly? I would like it if i only used the 180 brick. If anyone can look at my attached schematic maybe tell me how you would wire the layout. I know I will have to ad like another brick or a ZW to power fully all areas.