Is a BPC2 the same as a BPC

I think there is an internal electronic difference BPC2 as this works with the Lionel WiFi and IPad and Iphone operation.  I would think they wire in the same, not 100% sure about that. Good question. There is also an ASC2 now....

It's more of an On/Off relay control - right now I am thinking that 2 ports (2 hot feeds) would be required for each block if you have two ZW/TPC sets.

Both Off - dead track

1off & 2 On Command

1On & 2Off Conventional

Never used a TPC - is that a manual switch for fixed or variable voltage or can you do that with a TMCC command?

it's only the Hot wire that is passing through the relay.

Can't the TPC be left in variable mode for conventional running then dial it up to 18 volts for command engines and park conventional engines on dead sidings allow only one ZW/TPC set to be used?

Then, the BPC2 would only need one port per block or siding ON/Off and a voltage change to match what is running when on.

Original IC Controls BPC could take two input sources and do (4) track blocks.  You could switch from Source one, Source two or off.   The (12) track terminal screws are grouped in sets of (3).  Track#1, Power 1, Power 2

Track#2, Power 1, Power 2

Track#3, Power 1, Power 2

Track#4, Power 1, Power 2

The two BPC, pictured control (8) different track blocks.

Power source #1 could be TPC #1 set to Command mode.

Power source #2 could be TPC #2 set to Conventional mode.

Mike,

I forgot about your setup. That is a nice option. Here's page 21 of the BPC2 manual. Perhaps you can see a way to make this work like the BPC and help him out. Only 4 ports out per transformer.

The BPC2 is only a simple relay box now, on or off.  It does not allow for the different source selection of the old TMCC BPC.

I am definitely considering this to be deceptive! 

LOOSE-CABOOSE  do a search see if any of the older BPC's are available somewhere. I found some a few years ago and bought two one as a spare in case a failure happens.

I reread your post so you use a toggle switch to go from command to run conventional only so just wire a toggle switches to both 8 tracks to select command or conventional operation that should work for your needs still using the newer BPC2?

good luck and hope you can get all working again as you prefer and were both dinosaur's using bpc and or tpc's as most have moved onto apps and phones-tablets to run trains soon virtual reality will take over!

imagine paying $400-3000 for a virtual steam/diesel engine app to run on a virtual layout!

I will throw in my two cents.  Like MikeCT above I have the original BPC3000s from IC Controls.  Simply, one box will allow you to switch from TMCC to conventional on four separate blocks of track.  Using two power sources, one feeding variable voltage conventional power, one 18 volts TMCC.  In my case 2 TPCs backed up with 135 watt bricks.  I had two feeding my TMCC side.  The BPC3000 also toggled off power on/off to the blocks.  Like Mike CT, I had 2 BPCs and 2 TPCs, controlling 8 blocks.  I have all the original IC Control boxes.  They all work great.  ASCs for switches and accessories, AMCs for the gantry crane and log loader, and my favorite is the ARC.  I have both the IC Controls type and the second generation Lionel black box.  They are a bit different, but I like the black one better for functionality.  That is the action recorder, where you can play back recordings.  Now that is a fun thing to play around with.   To be honest, I lost interest in getting any further than this with technology in model trains.  This stuff works so well, why switch?  I built two Legacy equipped layouts for people and I like the whole TMCC stuff from that time better.  It was new, it was fun, not over complicated, and it still works great.  I use the TPC, a Cab1 and an ARC to run my prewar standard gauge trains now.  I miss having fun with that stuff on my old layout.  Legacy, you can have it.  Just a money grab.  Not a fan.  Why ruin a perfectly excellent idea/product like the original BPC?  Most likely so they can sell you something else.  Now imagine that... Have fun.  Cheers.

It was a somewhat shock to find the best function of the BPC was stripped out of the BPC2.  As I stated earlier I think it is deceitful on Lionel's part to remove functionality and maintain the name.  I did find an BPC on Ebay advertised as new for what I thought was, under the circumstances a reasonable price.  I surmise that the price on the older BPC's will go up in price. I am now considering another expansion but I may be rethinking this endeavor.

As a final comment on this post from me, I am quite surprised by the lack of distain from the group toward Lionel for taking away this great functionality and increasing the price of the BPC2. Is it Lionel's way to say good bye to easy conventional running with the Legacy Units? 

When the command control technology first came out it was new and exciting and a brand new way to control your trains and layout.  Once they had the basics figured out, the next train of thought must be, how do we make as much money as possible.  Just curious, what does a BPC2 cost?  I'm guessing $180.

William 1,

The Lionel price is about $110 for the BPC2. Charlie Ro sells them at about $97, where I bought the one that informed me that a BPC2 is not BPC.  And an outfit has them on Ebay for $150, which is totally outlandish. 

It has been many years, the original BPC's and ASC were about $30 each, which I guess was a lot then.  I was O.K. with $240, close to $800 would be a bit rough.  If I remember correctly the pitch was to do Command control, ( Command base and Cab 1 remote) for less than $100, late 1990's-2000.  Fast forward 20 years. 

Loose-Caboose posted:

As a final comment on this post from me, I am quite surprised by the lack of distain from the group toward Lionel for taking away this great functionality and increasing the price of the BPC2. Is it Lionel's way to say good bye to easy conventional running with the Legacy Units? 

Lionel doesn't even sell conventional locomotives anymore, why would it be a good idea for their business model to include conventional running?  But on the flip side, they do have easy conventional running using the Legacy system.  The ZW-L and Legacy PowerMasters both allow for the Cab-2 to control the tack voltage so you can run conventional locomotives.  Another question is if you are trying to run Legacy locomotives conventionally, "Why would you do that if you have a command set?" would be Lionel's thinking.  But if you want to, and you have a ZW-L, just unplug the command base and now you have 4 handles to run everything conventionally.  Me personally, I run all my command locomotives in command, and conventional locomotives by varying the track voltage with my command power supplies.  If I do want to run command locomotives conventionally I unplug the command base, or I pull out one of the several TMCC PowerMasters I snapped up just for this reason.

Loose-Caboose posted:

It was a somewhat shock to find the best function of the BPC was stripped out of the BPC2.  As I stated earlier I think it is deceitful on Lionel's part to remove functionality and maintain the name.  I did find an BPC on Ebay advertised as new for what I thought was, under the circumstances a reasonable price.  I surmise that the price on the older BPC's will go up in price. I am now considering another expansion but I may be rethinking this endeavor.

As a final comment on this post from me, I am quite surprised by the lack of distain from the group toward Lionel for taking away this great functionality and increasing the price of the BPC2. Is it Lionel's way to say good bye to easy conventional running with the Legacy Units? 

Jim, I understand and sympathize with your frustration that the BPC2 doesn't have the same functionality that the BPC1 had and that you expected.

On the other hand, I really don't think that Lionel was being deceitful or is deserving of disdain because the BPC2 is different from the BPC1. Lionel's description of the BPC2 accurately specifies what it does, and that description is distinctly different from the way the BPC1 was described. I don't know, but it might be that Lionel was trying to make the BPC simpler to implement for the way they envisioned most people would be using it. More generally, I really think that the folks at Lionel, far from trying to deceive or frustrate their customers, work very, very hard, day in and day out, at trying to develop products that will please us and help us enjoy the hobby. The last thing they want is for us to be unhappy with their products or their company.

By the way, I believe that the BPC1 can still be found for sale online at very reasonable prices.

Cheers!

Keith