Modeling a Real Railroad

I originally free-lanced by modeling.   I came up with a name based on Beaver County where I grew up and Ohio where I was living - The Ohio and Beaver Creek.     After some time with that, I became interested in the PRR when I realized the tracks that ran by the house where my uncle lived and my dad grew up, were PRR.     I learned more about it and found a section that was single track but busy enough from Greensburg on the Pgh div mainline and Uniontown in Pennsylvania that had a lot of coal branches and connections and also connected with the Monongehela Division at West Brownsville.   

So I slowly migrated over toward modeling based on that,  unfortuantely it had to be very loosely.    But I used town names and some industry names and what not.

If you are familiar with the Pennsylvania RR they were famous for the 4 track wide mainline across Pennsylvania - the Broadway.    Well is very difficult to represent in any scale, especially O and larger.    Multiple track lines take up too much width when  you want to also include industries and switching an operations.     So that is why I searched for a single track line and found one that had a connection to my family.    Another good Pennsy single track line is the Elmira branch from Williamport PA to Sodus Point in NY state.    

One of the difficult choices to make is selecting a railroad or railroads to model.

For instance, although my focus at the moment is the Put, I also love the PRR, like PRRJIM, and I also love the New Haven. This is true for not just the trains, but also the scenery, topography, stations, structures, etc.

As a result, I expect that I will always have some features of all 3 of those railroads on my layout.

Some of us may love most or all of the fallen flag railroads, and decide not to have any focus on their layout. Arnold

When my younger brother Randy was about 11 or 12, he dipped his toe into model railroading for a while. He wanted to make his own model railroad, but when you're just a kid you don't have a lot of money to do custom cars. But he figured out a neat way to make a model railroad that was "his".

Here are the things that guided his thought process in building his railroad:

• At the time I worked for the Pittsburgh & Lake Erie Railroad, whose reporting mark was P&LE.
• We lived in Poland, Ohio,
• Lake Evans was in our back yard.
• Therefore, he decided to use P&LE decal sets and call his railroad the Poland & Lake Evans Railroad.

Smart guy...

Here's another thought. Maybe the answer is to modify the focus, if any, on the model railroad. That way, it evolves like a living, breathing thing. 

It is possible to have one's layout reminiscent of a particular railroad, ie. The Put, for a year or two, then change the focus so it has features more similar to another railroad, ie. The New Haven. Arnold

I always wanted to model the PRR from the Juniata yards to the summit at Galitzen I wanted a mushroom style layout with the 4 track main mostly on top and the Holidaysburg and new portage secondary on the bottom. I am slowly aquiring some pertinent structures. I have the signals and of course the trains.

BTW to see some good scale layouts of specific areas( such as the O.P. is suggesting) I highly recommend the Roberson Museum layout in Binghamton NY depicting that areas railroads and the Leigh and keystone model railroad club in Bethlehem PA. this  club/museum  the depicts the leigh Valleys heritage of railroads in scale. Both are HO.

My 10'-by-5' layout, completed in 2019, is freelanced with scenery and structures that look like a single-track branch line in New England. On that layout, I run locomotives and rolling stock of the New Haven, Boston & Maine, Boston & Albany, Amtrak, Metro-North, and Providence and Worcester. All these railroads operated in areas that look like the layout scenery. Thus, on any given day, depending on the locomotives and rolling stock, the layout can resemble any of them.

MELGAR

My favorites have always been SF, New Haven, and UP.  The trains don't model any particular real-life railroad or scene.  I just like the beautiful trains.

My two layouts are now completely maxed out but, I've said that before.  I'm at the point where I only buy what is most attractive to me, or, I make it myself.  I have to pass on a lot of great trains and buildings because I simply don't have room.  At least my overhead layout has enough track to enable me to add a few more cars.

All my mains are freelanced, and the layouts have been dictated by the shape of the available space.  I remember waiting three years for a gas station that was attractive enough to fill a particular spot on the table layout.

This is the latest, and could be the last, addition.  I waited another 2-3 years for a brewery and saved this corner spot for it.  I love Nathan's hot dogs, and quickly bought the new Nathan's sign, and the car to compliment it.  I used the tunnel insert from the brewery to fashion a makeshift store and a way to mount the sign.

My last thought is to say that when you run out of space, you can only go up.  I wanted more of the available great-looking trains, so I added two upper levels to the table layout, about 4 years ago.  It's far from prototypical, but, I now run 7 trains on 6 main lines, through three rooms, plus two trolley lines.  This agrees with the idea that your layout evolves over the years, instead of sticking to a set plan.  Also, we all probably have tons of materials left over from years of building layouts.  It's fun to put some of it to good use.  It's more fun to run bunches of trains, on multiple levels, all at the same time.

Jerry

The beauty of model railroading is there are infinite options on how to enjoy it.  I know people who will stick to a particular prototype come heck or high water, while others it's anything goes.

I'm a freelancer for the most part with my railroad set in 50's-60's Kansas and attempted to keep it that way.  Eventually, I started letting area prototypes on the railroad along with a couple of long shots.  I do try to emulate prototype practices, however.

It works for me for the most part, but I have to say it really comes together when I exile the prototype power from the layout and I just have my freelance power present.

And oh yeah...  Every now and then I whip out my GG1 for a spin.  I just say there's a Tesla tower nearby broadcasting power to the locomotive.

Rusty

All of them, Katie! PRR, B&O, P&LE, Wild Mary, Shawmut, Union, UP, Santa Fe, Espee, D&RGW, Burlington, they are all favorites.

However, what I model (loosely) is the contemporary Oil Creek & Titusville. That is to say, the back-story of the Plywood Empire Route is patterned after the OC&T. Titusvile was situated on a Class I Mainline (PRR, Pittsburgh-Buffalo) until the entire route was abandoned. In order to maintain rail service to their enterprises local businessmen got together and created a railroad by acquiring several miles of that abandoned railroad in order to connect to the WNY&P at Rynd Farm. The OC&T moves 1,000 cars a year (about three a day) making it an ideal prototype for a shortline model railroad. Even better, every train is a mixed train (passengers and freight). You see, the OC&T subsidizes it's freight revenue with ticket sales to tourists. 

I have found that a mixed train doesn't work for me because O gauge passenger equipment is under scale size (as well as being short Lionel and K-Line aluminum cars are slightly narrow and slightly low) by just enough to clash visually. Thus, tourist service on the Plywood Empire route is provided with a Dinner Train a la the Black Hills Central Railroad.

I say loosely patterned after the OC&T because most freight equipment on the Plywood Empire Route is Fallen Flags, which doesn't fit in a contemporary operation but hey, it's my Pike and it works for me. 

This is an interesting thread, a lot of the time when discussions around this theme come up, it usually is around accurately depicting a real railroad (obviously much compressed) at various levels.  I think what Arnold's original (and very useful) post points out is you can model real railroads via  'influence', and that is perfectly valid, too.  I would love  to model the NYC, especially around the NYC area, but I don't have the space to do that any kind of justice. In my perpetual planning (and sort of construction) phase, I have some general guidelines I am trying to use in getting something built:

-Trying to center it around the northeast railroads, primarily the central, where the modelling is more "influenced by" then trying to accurately reproduce it. I guess it is kind of like impressionism in art, it represents, rather than details. 

-I love urban railroading, and am trying to figure out how to incorporate an "urban" module. One way is to eventually build a second deck that has the city scene, that could have things like a rail ferry (or a suggestion of it), and maybe a version of the high line and street running in NYC. 

-The main level/first to be built likely will be more typical of many layouts, with towns and scenes many layouts have, representing town/rural areas. 

When I finally get around to buying new equipment, likely it will be focused on central equipment, I don't plan on creating my own road name (though that is a marvelous  idea). It won't limit what I run, if I want to run some of my post war stuff  I love, like Santa Fe F3's and or pennsy 671 turbine, or my C and O stuff with Chessie the cat on them, that is fine by me, too. 

As a corollary question, are there people who, for whatever reason, intentionally won't model a specific railroad on their layout or in their collection ?

Since most of us are train lovers, probably few of us absolutely rule anything out. However, my impression is that most of us have our favorite railroads, and we are drawn to their trains and features. Perhaps our favorite railroads remind us of happy times during childhood.

I am finding as I get older that I focus more on a few favorite railroads than I did in my younger days.

Our modeling can include realistic detail, or the modeler can take a more impressionistic approach. 

IMO, model railroads can look great if they are down and dirty like the real world, or perfectly clean and neat like heaven or paradise.

Arnold

I thought, perhaps, there were some sports enthusiasts who wouldn't be caught dead with an engine or piece of rolling stock on their layout or in their collection bearing the name of their archrival sports city/state. 

When I ever get started on my 2 rail layout it will represent about 20 miles of the NY&LB that I grew up on circa 1953-1956 when my grandfather commuted on it.  I have most of the trains that are era appropriate with a few notable gaps to be filled.  Essentially CNJ and PRR in mostly commuter operations with short freight that served the few businesses on the line.

It will required a LOT of compromise and selective compression, but my idea is to make it modular in nature so I can build it up over time.  On the south end I will plan on having the Bayhead loop where all the morning's commuter trains were prepared for the daily commute to NYC.  It will terminate on the north end at Rahway, NJ where it connects to the PRR mainline.  I am thinking a hidden loop there just to turn trains and only modeling what is a 6 track mainline at that point for no more than 5-10 feet. 

The challenge is always what to leave out.  For me, since I regularly roamed the Red Bank to Long Branch segment, I'll likely put in something that represents that area.  South Amboy is a critical location however I plan on compromising with the concept that the PRR electrified to Bayhead.  Other elements I'd like to somehow get in is the cutoff at Red Bank to the CNJ Southern Division.  It doesn't need to go anywhere.  I'd also like to incorporate the Atlantic Highlands branch that originally crossed the Shrewsbury River into Seabright and ran along the Ocean before cutting inland and rejoining the CNJ Southern Division in Eatontown.

It is till obviously and over ambitious plan that will required quite a bit of space even compressed.  However, I've been dreaming about this layout in my head for nearly 25 years in HO, N and now O so I have had a lot of time to visualize.  The biggest challenge is will I ever get the time to actually build it. 

In some ways I don't think it matters if I ever build or not.  It is a really fun layout to operate in my head.

I have staged some photos that many of you over the years have seen to keep the memories alive but one day ... maybe. 

Bored yet?  I can keep writing.....

Richie C. posted:

As a corollary question, are there people who, for whatever reason, intentionally won't model a specific railroad on their layout or in their collection ?

Enter the freelancer...

Virginian & Ohio, Midland Road, Maumee Route, Gore & Dapheted, Alturas & Lone Pine, Utah Belt to name a few.

Rusty

Some of the best layouts I have seen have been freelanced. 

A friend of my dad who is a master modeler freelanced a fictional "Star Valley Lines" in the pines of north central Arizona. 

He scratch built most of the rolling stock and did some fabulous kit bashes like converting a Bachmann run of the mill 10 wheeler into a duplex with the second drivers under the tender.  Playful yet meticulously executed down to tools on the running boards. 

Born in Ottumwa Iowa. ---CB&Q

My sister retired from Union Pacific in Omaha

Grew up in Lincoln Ne---Burlington Yards

All great subjects to model.

I model a shortline, freelanced, but loosely based on the Great Western, which served sugar beet plants in NE Colorado. #90 now on the Strasburg is probably  GW power most familiar to York attendees.  No sticking to prototype for my terminal is fictional Front Range imagined between Denver and Pueblo on the Joint Line.  With much custom lettered Denver and Front Range, a lot of rolling stock is for the East Slope roads that ran in Colorado.  Other obscure equipt. to be seen on sidings is Mich. Upper Peninsula.  While a friend collects O   gauge  Pennsy RPO equipt., I carefully avoid any NE rolling stock, frustrated by its proclivity.  Not ignored are stray cars from smaller Chicago roads ..CGW, C&EI, C&lM.  So, yes, some roads are absolutely not allowed nor purchased.

Arnold, it was good seeing you at the club the other night, and I'm glad you joined as a member. I suspect you are going to get a lot of ideas if you spend some time at the club. We have some REALLY GREAT modelers.

Gerry

Here's my late contribution, Arnold. I grew up in Copiague, NY, a small town on the south shore of Long Island. We lived a few blocks away from the Copiague train station for the LIRR, and I can recall the departing whistles of the passenger cars. When I was young, there was even a flagman who came out of a track-side shack to warn vehicles of the approaching train at the RR crossing (just like the Lionel 145 Gateman!), then came a crossing gate (like the 252), then the RR build an elevated railway along the route. 

My intention is to model the elevated station (work in progress).  I have an MTH Railking passenger consist, and a K-Line freight consist on a separate line.  The freight consist includes several cars with local meaning: NY Yankees, Entenmann's bakery (makes best crumb cake on earth), Rheingold Beer, and Amityville farms (dairy in neighboring town; long gone).  Hope the short video can be seen.

Lots of fun memories.

Michael

Looks great Michael, and it appears that you are well on your way to accomplishing your goals.

IMO, by modeling something real, past or present, you can have something you love on your layout which, in turn, makes the layout very special for you. Arnold

Arnold, thanks for the encouragement.  Next phase is scenery - the area of my least skills.  Doing small practice scenes (mountain, pond, etc.) with the grandkids using learning modules from Woodland Scenics.  Great experience before I go big time on the layout. 

Thanks, Michael

Arnold, I have this concept and plan to model a portion of the Montana Rail Link and BNSF, on another thread.

Another publication mentioned the concept of "Layout Design Elements" in the construction of a model railroad. Basically, an LDE is a scene or area of the prototype that piques your interest. In my lifetime, I've lived near or regularly driven past a few interesting elements that I'd love to incorporate into a large layout someday and I enjoy trying to model them using RR-Track. These have included:

• Sections of the PE/SP/UP "Torrance Branch" including the street running in Gardena and the Torrance Railroad Bridge (appears on the Torrance city seal) . The railroad bridge could actually be a feature of a switching layout similar to the Gum, Stump and Snowshoe because it literally worked that way when the small steel plant was still in the area.
• The ATSF Redlands Loop branch that ran through the San Bernardino valley. Just about all of the track is gone, but the right-of-way and many of the buildings are still in place.
• The SP/UP Anahiem branch that included street running down Santa Ana Street and Olive Street, literally making a turn at the intersection. This branch is still in use.
• The UP Santa Ana River Viaduct in Riverside. It's a 900 foot concrete arch viaduct that's over 100 years old.
• The Riverside packing house district off the ATSF mainline (3rd and Commercial Street). The tracks are still in the pavement in some places. Sadly, the National Orange Company packing house burned to the ground back in 2001, but there are some very good drawings available from the Library of Congress. Special shout-out to Yesteryear models for declining my offer to purchase their H.O. kit to get the drawings and pointing me to where they got them.
• Shebogan Falls, Wisconsin. I have neither lived, nor been there, but I saw an interesting set of photos online and did some searching using Google Earth. The street-adjacent branch (west of Kohler) is being resurrected and had some interesting features.

Let's face it, none of us has the space to model a real railroad to a high level of accuracy in our scale, but you can definitely grab and model pieces to incorporate into a layout.

GG1 4877 posted:

When I ever get started on my 2 rail layout it will represent about 20 miles of the NY&LB that I grew up on circa 1953-1956 when my grandfather commuted on it.  I have most of the trains that are era appropriate with a few notable gaps to be filled.  Essentially CNJ and PRR in mostly commuter operations with short freight that served the few businesses on the line.

It will required a LOT of compromise and selective compression, but my idea is to make it modular in nature so I can build it up over time.  On the south end I will plan on having the Bayhead loop where all the morning's commuter trains were prepared for the daily commute to NYC.  It will terminate on the north end at Rahway, NJ where it connects to the PRR mainline.  I am thinking a hidden loop there just to turn trains and only modeling what is a 6 track mainline at that point for no more than 5-10 feet.

GG1, Your reminiscences and dilemma are both familiar to me.  I explored the area you are modeling, back in the early '70s, when GG1s still held sway and ex-PRR Es vied with CNJ power at the the Amboys to haul the cars south.

After years of dreaming, I finally settled on modeling the Chicago Great Western from Chicago to St. Paul - all in a room 12x40.  I wanted a terminal-to-terminal operation but 400 miles equates to 44,000 linear feet of O Gauge/Scale railroad, so, "compromise and selective compression" became very much the order of the day.  In order to accomplish any of my goals, I had to have my two terminals become one terminal with a split personality: Chicago/St. Paul.  With a run-through "Central Station" located between the two terminal yards, the plan will give me the flexibility to operate freight and passenger trains terminal-to-terminal, enjoy "looping" or both.

Your central point of interest is South Amboy, where all roads and power met and where most activity took place.  Therefore, perhaps a "dog bone" design comprised of the PRR, perhaps combined with the CNJ, forming the "northern loop" and the Bay Head balloon track forming the "southern loop", South Amboy would be the centerpiece.  Branches could be shoehorned into this scheme as space and inclination permit.  The Raritan Bay Bridge could be an interesting feature, too, and electrification could be done in stages, just as on the prototype.

Like you, I waited for decades before accepting my limitations, finalizing a track plan and beginning construction.  Having built the first module and made switching moves, I can't wait to build more and be able to run through trains, too.  I hope that you can begin to your realize your dream, you've chosen a fascinating subject.  Go for it!

There is terrific modeling of real buildings and structures in Schenectady, NY on the video of Don Klose's model railroad. It is one of the sensational model railroads featured on OGRR's 50th Anniversary 2 disc BluRay set.

Arnold

Like many hobbyists, I started out collecting and operating a smattering of everything. Why? Because I found all the real American railroads very interesting and charming, and still do.

If I had a basement the size of a gymnasium, like some of you folks, I would probably continue to collect, operate and model trains, structures and scenery of most of the real railroads from sea to shining sea throughout the history of our great country, and maybe other countries too.

Like most of us, I do not have a basement or attic the size of a gymnasium. I don't even have a full basement, only a half basement, for a model railroad.

Isn't space what we most covet as model railroaders?

For those like me with limited available space, there is still great opportunities to have a very rewarding model railroad.

For the past few years, and for the foreseeable future, I have been, and continue to, focus my model railroad activities on one real railroad: the Putnam Division of the NY Central (The Put).

There are numerous reasons why I focus on The Put, which I will share a little later. For now, I will share some photos and videos of my trains and modeling of The Put.

Patrick's "Dawn's Earliest Light" video yesterday inspired me to take this video this morning of my current favorite locomotive, this MTH Railking Proto 3 RS3 pulling a passenger consist reminiscent of The Put:

How about you? Do you focus on a favorite real railroad for your collecting, operating and/or modeling activities? If so, show us some photos and videos of it.

Arnold

Both of my model railroads were made to resemble New England - small towns, hills, creeks, small factories, short truss bridges, trestles and tunnels. That lets me run trains of all the regional railroads: New Haven, Boston & Maine, Boston & Albany, Providence & Worcester, New York Central, Maine Central, Amtrak.

MELGAR

Next stop, Yonkis, oops, I mean Yonkers, please watch your step:

LOL, Arnold

Dairy farm in Northern Westchester County, NY along The Put in the early 1950s:

Arnold

I’ve considered modeling a railroad museum with running rights to an adjacent railroad. You could have rolling stock from everywhere and every era on display and run whatever you wanted as excursions on the adjacent main line. Lots of opportunities for service facilities, a roundhouse and tourist attractions.

This topic is a good place to post photos, videos and comments showing and explaining features on your layout making it more like one real railroad or combination of railroads.

In my case, as recently shown on another active thread, I am adding features, over time, making my layout more like the Putnam Division of the NY Central (The Put).

The Put ran NY Central ten wheeler steamers, NY Central RS3 diesels, 2 or 3 car NY Central heavyweight passenger cars (probably Pullman green in color), and mixed freight trains of a few cars oftentimes including oversize loads requiring wide clearances.

Here is another video of a passenger train reminiscent of The Put:

Arnold

Ten Wheeler early morning passenger train along The Put:

Arnold

Pittsburgh, west, Montour bike trail, (Montour RR), an idea of what a coal hauling railroad was like.  Top of the 9 mile grade before the trail levels-out, is where the Champion coal wash tipple was.  Today, it's hard to picture what was there.  The Westland  spur has been rebuilt, a great adventure, the Product today is  gas,  instead of coal.   Lots of ideas, Bridges and tunnels always an eye-catching part of any model railroad.

Montour main file.

Montour  Lower end beyond I79.

Montour Westland spur.

@Arnold D. Cribari - A year and 3 months ago, when I started my O Gauge endeavor, I took a slightly different approach to the modeling aspect.  Instead of modeling an entire railroad, I wanted to model individual "scenes", such as the CSX Intermodal Station in Baltimore, MD, or a rail crossing in Harrisonburg, VA.  Unfortunately, I'm not always given access to the areas I want to model and I can't get good perspective photos or measurements (yes, I'm surprised someone hasn't called the law on me), so that does make it difficult.

Anthony

Arnold- try Google maps and “street view”.  Very useful for modeling prototype scenes. JohnA

@AGHRMatt posted:

Let's face it, none of us has the space to model a real railroad to a high level of accuracy in our scale, but you can definitely grab and model pieces to incorporate into a layout.

This is what does me in.  I start off with the idea that I could selectively compress a portion of a real railroad to make an interesting model railroad.  Once I have got it on paper I then try to imagine how I would be operating trains on that design.  I rapidly come to the conclusion that if I added a certain industry it would make for more interesting operations.  Except that industry wasn't located there or wasn't located on my railroad.  So I bend my rules.  Then I see some cool building/industry that some manufacturer has come out with.  So I bend my rules some more.  Then there is that model of some building from a previous layout that I have fond memories of and want to incorporate it into my layout.  So I bend the rules some more.  At what point do I cross the line from being a selectively compressed portion of a real railroad to being something which vaguely resembles one (or more) real railroads?  That is without considering the locomotives I am are running.

Compared to a random collection of scenes that interest you it takes serious discipline to model a real railroad.

Great topic, Arnold. I guess I’m in this camp, recreating scenes/places that I remember from my youth on the layout and modeling the MTA on my subway and elevated lines and the LIRR on my mainlines, with a focus on the subway cars and Diesel engines I rode/watched back in the day. However, there’s always room for small LIRR steam and military equipment on my pike

Bill N,

My layouts resemble real places but do not look exactly like any particular place except for structures such as a station, factory, house or store. If one chooses to model a region such as New England - as I do - the layout does not necessarily have to be a model of a specific place. It can just resemble the general characteristics of the region. For example - New England has small towns, small factories, hills, trees, rivers, creeks, tunnels, short truss bridges and wood trestles. Those features are sufficient to create the scenes that I want (and have room for) on the layout and then populate them with trains of the New England railroads. For most people, space limitations preclude exact modeling of multiple scenes on a particular railroad. That is certainly the case for me and, especially, O gauge/scale.

MELGAR