I like a S-4 with a couple large (60') boxcars...
Tiffany posted:Hello guys and gals....
one nice thing about short trains is that it reduces the wear and tear on the engines pulling short train and fits perfectly on door size layout ,lowers the cost too. keep the pictures coming guys !!!!!!!!
Tiffany
Hi Tiffany, sometimes a short train looks better then a fifty car train when the scenery is right. That's the beauty of our hobby, there's a place for all of us.
gg1man posted:Tiffany posted:Hello guys and gals....
one nice thing about short trains is that it reduces the wear and tear on the engines pulling short train and fits perfectly on door size layout ,lowers the cost too. keep the pictures coming guys !!!!!!!!
Tiffany
Hi Tiffany, sometimes a short train looks better then a fifty car train when the scenery is right. That's the beauty of our hobby, there's a place for all of us.
"So let us try as hard as we can to enter God's place of rest. We must try hard so that none of us will be lost by following the example of those who refused obey God." "Hebrews 4:11" ERV (Easy-to-Read Version)
Hello gg1man..........
Very true to the word "short train looks better then a 50 car train when the scenery is right" There is a place for all of us !!!!
Tiffany
Tiffany posted:Hello Pennytrains
Have you seen the pictures of my layout ? I am trying to find some cloth material in green color to cover the space of 40 by 86 (to fold over the edges of the layout) something like green thin blanket and low cost , any tips ? I am sorry your 0-8-0 went to the concrete few times but still runs now that is one TOUGH engine you have !!!!!!!!
Tiffany
I'd say it would depend on what kind of "look" you're going for. But here are some suggestions.
- Woodland Scenics Ready Grass Mats are available in several sizes and colors with the largest being 50" by 100" and are a good foundation if you want a realistic look but don't want to do full scenicing. MSRP is 32.99 but you may be able to find them at a lower price.
- For a "retro look" you could simply paint the surface with green latex and sprinkle a bit of sawdust or fine turf on it while the paint is wet. Lionel used this technique on store displays, scenic plots, Scenic Railways and showroom layouts for many years.
- Felt. You can buy heavy felt in many colors by the yard at most craft or sewing stores these days. I've never personally tried it, but it could be used as ground cover. Lionel made tunnels and other land forms with heavy felt "dipped in fish glue" in the 20's and 30's.
- I doubt if it's a popular color, but you could look for a green bed sheet. Many discount stores like Big Lots, Dollar General and others carry very inexpensive bed sheets.
I originally just painted my 4x6 with forest green latex but after a couple of years I decided to upgrade it with a Spring Grass Ready Grass Mat. Then I decided to add ballast under the tracks (without removing them first). This year I decided to upgrade it again and glued down green fine turf, brown fine turf and granite sand and added extra ties made from popsicle sticks:
The small park with the Nativity was made using a scrap of the original Ready Grass Mat glued to a wedge of foamcore board to give you an idea of the what it looked like previously compared with the turf work I did a few months ago in the surrounding area. My roads are just pieces of posterboard with white sand glued on then they were painted a light gray with craft acrylic. This is a multi-use board so I need everything but the rails to be removable.
So the Ready Grass would be my first recommendation. It's made of vinyl so it stands up well to abuse. The turf can be scratched but if you buy a bag of the same color turf you can touch it up easily. It also cuts nicely so wrapping it around the edges is no problem. Lay it down overlapping all edges initially and cut out the excess later. I used an aerosol construction adhesive which I applied outdoors. (That could be an issue at this time of year.)
Becky
227 switcher with the 4 semi scale cars.
pennytrains posted:Tiffany posted:Hello Pennytrains
Have you seen the pictures of my layout ? I am trying to find some cloth material in green color to cover the space of 40 by 86 (to fold over the edges of the layout) something like green thin blanket and low cost , any tips ? I am sorry your 0-8-0 went to the concrete few times but still runs now that is one TOUGH engine you have !!!!!!!!
Tiffany
I'd say it would depend on what kind of "look" you're going for. But here are some suggestions.
- Woodland Scenics Ready Grass Mats are available in several sizes and colors with the largest being 50" by 100" and are a good foundation if you want a realistic look but don't want to do full scenicing. MSRP is 32.99 but you may be able to find them at a lower price.
- For a "retro look" you could simply paint the surface with green latex and sprinkle a bit of sawdust or fine turf on it while the paint is wet. Lionel used this technique on store displays, scenic plots, Scenic Railways and showroom layouts for many years.
- Felt. You can buy heavy felt in many colors by the yard at most craft or sewing stores these days. I've never personally tried it, but it could be used as ground cover. Lionel made tunnels and other land forms with heavy felt "dipped in fish glue" in the 20's and 30's.
- I doubt if it's a popular color, but you could look for a green bed sheet. Many discount stores like Big Lots, Dollar General and others carry very inexpensive bed sheets.
I originally just painted my 4x6 with forest green latex but after a couple of years I decided to upgrade it with a Spring Grass Ready Grass Mat. Then I decided to add ballast under the tracks (without removing them first). This year I decided to upgrade it again and glued down green fine turf, brown fine turf and granite sand and added extra ties made from popsicle sticks:
The small park with the Nativity was made using a scrap of the original Ready Grass Mat glued to a wedge of foamcore board to give you an idea of the what it looked like previously compared with the turf work I did a few months ago in the surrounding area. My roads are just pieces of posterboard with white sand glued on then they were painted a light gray with craft acrylic. This is a multi-use board so I need everything but the rails to be removable.
So the Ready Grass would be my first recommendation. It's made of vinyl so it stands up well to abuse. The turf can be scratched but if you buy a bag of the same color turf you can touch it up easily. It also cuts nicely so wrapping it around the edges is no problem. Lay it down overlapping all edges initially and cut out the excess later. I used an aerosol construction adhesive which I applied outdoors. (That could be an issue at this time of year.)
Becky
Hello Becky
My goodness, you surely have plenty of GOOD ideas. I just want a simple toy alike layout like in 1950's using as much as motor type accessories like revolving beacon, bubbling oil derrick and others where there is action going on and few small buildings like yours and few cars on the road but with lots of lights. The layout has to be kind of tough to be able to be transported to take with us when we move out. Your layout is OUTSTANDING !!!!!!!!!!!! If you have more tips, please let me know 
.
Thank you Becky !!! 
My favorite shorty train is the one I grew up on - one locomotive, one passenger car, period.
There was also a hobby shop I once knew with a kit-bashed locomotive in the display case. The front was a diesel cab, the middle was a boxcar body, and the rear end was a caboose porch.
A green tablecloth; normally a bit thicker than a sheet. I used one in the Tiny TV layout.
And a fleece throw is on my tiny Christmas layout. The texture is more grass like. Before it became dedicated to the holiday, I planned on using thin felt like we used to cut out and paste down for art during grade school classes, to create roads. ( I also flame tested the fabrics to make sure they didn't "flash fire".)
Both are just wrapped, and stapled apolstery style. Holes get an X with an exacto after a day for the fabric to stretch fully.
Felt is an excellent sound deadener for the track to sit on.
Adriatic posted:A green tablecloth; normally a bit thicker than a sheet. I used one in the Tiny TV layout.
And a fleece throw is on my tiny Christmas layout. The texture is more grass like. Before it became dedicated to the holiday, I planned on using thin felt like we used to cut out and paste down for art during grade school classes, to create roads. ( I also flame tested the fabrics to make sure they didn't "flash fire".)
Both are just wrapped, and stapled apolstery style. Holes get an X with an exacto after a day for the fabric to stretch fully.
Felt is an excellent sound deadener for the track to sit on.
Hello Adriatic
A green table cloth......... I never thought of that !!!!!!!!!!!! What's the best way to put on the door layout by glue or thumb tacks on the sides ?
Thank you ,smile
Tiffany
Both. I used hot glue on one, white glue on the other. That, and a staple gun.
Pull it over glue side to side, tack it down. Clamps are nice for an even stretching with free hands.
There have been a lot of books written picturing the short lines of N. America. A ten-wheeler trundling a box car, a stock car, a coal hopper for the general store, and a combine or coach caboose off past the grain elevator and into the sunset is the image l want to capture. Short trains can go up from one car Mack railbuses and home built critters to logging articulateds towing out log buggies laden with "big trees".
A Marx, Marx based K Line or Buddy RDC car or two would make up a nice train!
Firewood posted:The front was a diesel cab, the middle was a boxcar body, and the rear end was a caboose porch.
I did something like that once. I tried to make a representation of a Cleveland Union Terminal P1-a using a scout type fixed door boxcar.
One of my favorites is a short train in an urban setting. switching a few box cars at a local factory
Hello guys and gals.........
I am still working on the layout s-l-o-w-l-y as a snail's pace (1/8 inch by 1/8 inch) at the time oh well. Mean while still trying to think of a siding to park 56 inch 5 car but not sure where to put the siding as wanted to put some buildings too.
"The Lord has made a promise with an oath and will not change his mind: You are a priest forever - the kind of priest Melchizedek was" Psalm 110:4 ERV (Easy to Read Version)
Tiffany
I like the Lionel bell ringing switcher that was issued early in the tenure of Richard Kuhn at Lionel. As for a consist, given my work with the National Steel Corporation in the downriver area in southeast Michigan, I enjoy running the hot metal cars.
I need to visit the Carnegie Science Center to see this consist in action in a highly detailed, massive Lionel layout!
hello guys and gals.........
I wondered if the postwar lionel bridge # 317 too big for the door layout as it is about 24 inches long and where would be a good place for it on the single siding with one switch and about 50 inches of straight ? Was there such a thing as a siding off the main line that has a bridge through it ? I have a #317 bridge that was almost destroyed by the Post Office due to poor packing and I spend a full day straighten it out ( pieces all bend or twisted out of shape) and had to drill holes in it to (bolt the pieces back together using 2-56 machine screws and nuts as the spot welds and folding taps were broken off ) it was a MESS. This was first time I worked with steel that was 60 years old. I think the metal was better those days. I wished to have it powder coated first........... before putting on layout. Any idea guys ?
"They were scattered everywhere, and in every place they went, they told people the Good News" Acts 8:4 ERV (Easy to Read Version)
Tiffany
Skip powder coating and do quality painting. Unfortunately for powder coating the metal must be clean, and raw, likely requiring dissassembly again too.. It fattens parts and your tabs would not only be unable to fit back in place, but once bent, the coating is likely to crack too.
Working with tabs, heating anneals them making the metal softer and less likely to break. Each bending hardens the metal (work hardened) making it a touch more brittle. Its not so much the metal was that much better, but more like they tended to use softer, thicker metals to begin with. Sometimes today's harder metals are more a result of speeding the process by quicker cooling. (Really just somewhat educated guesses on the metal, no research)
A good idea conveyed to me here on how to heat the metal before bending a tab was using a soldering iron vs flame that could attack the paint.
It doesn't take a lot of heat to "anneal" most metals. Aluminum can really benefit from in spectacular degrees. Research each metal type firsthand its not "hard". 
Adriatic posted:Skip powder coating and do quality painting. Unfortunately for powder coating the metal must be clean, and raw, likely requiring dissassembly again too.. It fattens parts and your tabs would not only be unable to fit back in place, but once bent, the coating is likely to crack too.
Working with tabs, heating anneals them making the metal softer and less likely to break. Each bending hardens the metal (work hardened) making it a touch more brittle. Its not so much the metal was that much better, but more like they tended to use softer, thicker metals to begin with. Sometimes today's harder metals are more a result of speeding the process by quicker cooling. (Really just somewhat educated guesses on the metal, no research)
A good idea conveyed to me here on how to heat the metal before bending a tab was using a soldering iron vs flame that could attack the paint.
It doesn't take a lot of heat to "anneal" most metals. Aluminum can really benefit from in spectacular degrees. Research each metal type firsthand its not "hard".
Hello Adriatic..
I forgotten to memtioned that I used the red locite for the screws and nuts so I guess that means it will be better to repaint it then ? It was repainted sloppy before from someone else but the bridge is much stronger when bolted together now. Wondering what's the best paint to paint at cold temps like 50 degrees outside ? I will have to strip paint off and primer it , oh its a messy smelly job to do !!!
"So let us try as hard as we can to enter God's place of rest. We must try hard so that none of us will be lost by following the example of those who refuse to obey God". Hebrews 4:11 ERV (easy to Read version)
Tiffany
Again heat is your buddy. Red thread lock will soften when heated.(if it is the kind that hardens fully with the candy look, others never fully harden. Red has a few different actual id numbers) Those small machine screws may not survive well, but will come apart. Using blue locker on the little stuff is normally enough for all but the most rigorous of 24/7 vibrations. Lock washers help more. And I suggest a warped lock washer (euro, spring washer) instead of split types. Thinner and can handle more tightening torque. Try to find grade 5 to 8 hardware too. Don't cheap out on 3 that's last resort stuff IMO.. Grade 10+ OK, but more brittle & overkill here. (Those washers will be grade 8 or higher though)(a euro 10 is closer to our 12)
Painting at 50° isn't the best plan period. If you do, clean, warm the object, paint outside, return indoors to cure asap.
Avoid Rustoleum, it takes forever to cure as is, let alone cold. Repainting over it can be a nightmare too as it contains oils (anti rust) and is very soft for an enamel.
Cold and /or moisture will cause a haze in glosses too. A milky look if severe.
Total stripping, might not be needed either. That has more to do with skill, amount and type of prep you wish to do, end result expected, present condition of metal, and what type of topcoat paint you use. E.g., they don't fully repaint every car with a door ding or bent fender.
If you do chemical stripping well enough, and allow a quick acid dip to clean the metal, a one color powdercoat on the assembled bridge is possible. In my experience, not really cost effective unless extreme abuse is expected. But I'm not up to date on pricing either.
I suspect past chemical reaction between paint types is what you fear and the reason for your justified thoughts on that. Simply put, some paints are volatile enough to affect the original under it, and what the new paint does while curing causes pulling or cracking, etc. Test on the bottom?
A good primer usually can act as a barrier to help, or as filler when you know everything is compatible. But even a primer can have a "hot" carrier base.
Lacquer is hot, thin (won't wipe out detail), dries very fast and pulls hard as it ties its best to lay thin, scratches. Enamel is cooler, thicker, hardest when dry, tends to chip more than scratch. Acrylics are cold, softer, thickest, and less apt to etch, bunches up when scratched like its still wet, has a plastic look. I'm sure this may help if you think about it. Do you use nail polish? Read a bottle or two and compare what you know from experience.
But this is all quick generalization, pro painting can be complex.
You are likely going over enamel, I'm not sure, it could be lacquer. Lacquer would be your best option at that temp, but the risks have been mentioned.
Sanding paint is about smoothing, but also leaves micro grooves for new paint to hold onto. A gloss is hard to stick to.
Removing oils, even from touching with a finger or bumping, is important too.(the #1 reason paint shops don't want you in the work areas )
Colorful glosses? Good durability? Enamel would be my choice.
Retaining detail, lacquer. (Wet sanding and polishing on large flats it has an incredible, deep gloss look that can exceed enamel IMO, but it must be worked to get there)
To throw a final wrench in it all, Acrylic and enamel are sometimes terms used together lol, (acrylic enamels). Just consider it as enamel so I don't have to write a whole book, lol. Its hard enough to write a page without info scattering while seeing only 4 lines of type on an android.
Most of what I know was trial and error, with a few totally successful rule breaking experiments too. Thin coats with incompatible paints. Clear gloss over flat paint = gloss color , etc.
I sure hope this can be read OK when I post it, lol.
Adriatic posted:Again heat is your buddy. Red thread lock will soften when heated.(if it is the kind that hardens fully with the candy look, others never fully harden. Red has a few different actual id numbers) Those small machine screws may not survive well, but will come apart. Using blue locker on the little stuff is normally enough for all but the most rigorous of 24/7 vibrations. Lock washers help more. And I suggest a warped lock washer (euro, spring washer) instead of split types. Thinner and can handle more tightening torque. Try to find grade 5 to 8 hardware too. Don't cheap out on 3 that's last resort stuff IMO.. Grade 10+ OK, but more brittle & overkill here. (Those washers will be grade 8 or higher though)(a euro 10 is closer to our 12)
Painting at 50° isn't the best plan period. If you do, clean, warm the object, paint outside, return indoors to cure asap.
Avoid Rustoleum, it takes forever to cure as is, let alone cold. Repainting over it can be a nightmare too as it contains oils (anti rust) and is very soft for an enamel.
Cold and /or moisture will cause a haze in glosses too. A milky look if severe.
Total stripping, might not be needed either. That has more to do with skill, amount and type of prep you wish to do, end result expected, present condition of metal, and what type of topcoat paint you use. E.g., they don't fully repaint every car with a door ding or bent fender.
If you do chemical stripping well enough, and allow a quick acid dip to clean the metal, a one color powdercoat on the assembled bridge is possible. In my experience, not really cost effective unless extreme abuse is expected. But I'm not up to date on pricing either.
I suspect past chemical reaction between paint types is what you fear and the reason for your justified thoughts on that. Simply put, some paints are volatile enough to affect the original under it, and what the new paint does while curing causes pulling or cracking, etc. Test on the bottom?
A good primer usually can act as a barrier to help, or as filler when you know everything is compatible. But even a primer can have a "hot" carrier base.
Lacquer is hot, thin (won't wipe out detail), dries very fast and pulls hard as it ties its best to lay thin, scratches. Enamel is cooler, thicker, hardest when dry, tends to chip more than scratch. Acrylics are cold, softer, thickest, and less apt to etch, bunches up when scratched like its still wet, has a plastic look. I'm sure this may help if you think about it. Do you use nail polish? Read a bottle or two and compare what you know from experience.
But this is all quick generalization, pro painting can be complex.
You are likely going over enamel, I'm not sure, it could be lacquer. Lacquer would be your best option at that temp, but the risks have been mentioned.
Sanding paint is about smoothing, but also leaves micro grooves for new paint to hold onto. A gloss is hard to stick to.
Removing oils, even from touching with a finger or bumping, is important too.(the #1 reason paint shops don't want you in the work areas
Colorful glosses? Good durability? Enamel would be my choice.
Retaining detail, lacquer. (Wet sanding and polishing on large flats it has an incredible, deep gloss look that can exceed enamel IMO, but it must be worked to get there)
To throw a final wrench in it all, Acrylic and enamel are sometimes terms used together lol, (acrylic enamels). Just consider it as enamel so I don't have to write a whole book, lol. Its hard enough to write a page without info scattering while seeing only 4 lines of type on an android.
Most of what I know was trial and error, with a few totally successful rule breaking experiments too. Thin coats with incompatible paints. Clear gloss over flat paint = gloss color , etc.
I sure hope this can be read OK when I post it, lol.
Hello Adriatic
My goodness !!!!!!!! that is a lot of GOOD information But the truth is that I don't wish to mess with the fumes of painting as I have asthma and knowing other forum members who paint also have asthma so I don't know how they deal with it. Perhaps I should to look for someone to do the painting or find a preproduction bridge if there such as thing ?
" I have learned the secret of how to live through any kind of situation-when I have enough to eat or when I am hungry, when I have everything I need or when I have nothing. Christ is the one who gives me strength I need to do whatever I must do" Philippians 4:12-13 ERV (Easy to Read Version)
Tiffany
Hello guys and gals..........(up-date 12/22/2016)
I received some more "solid" rail realtrax pieces last week from forum member Marilyn (thank you so much) and almost have enough pieces needed for the layout. I will need 4 031 switches to complete the track plan but have a question to ask, are the switches made now still use solid rails or MTH changed them to hallow rails ? I will have to at least purchase one switch at a time as money permits at 52 dollars a piece. What mods are need to be done to make the switches trouble free , does anyone might know ? Here are some more pictures but again its not much and I am getting there slowly !
"These are the things God told his people. 'I am the Lord your God. I am the one who freed you from the land of Egypt, where you were slaves. You must not worship any other gods except me." Exodus 20:1-3 ERV (Easy to Read Version)
Tiffany
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