022 Switches and the SC-1 Controller

I suppose one simple experiment is to lower the fixed 19.5V and see if the problem persists.  

Hi Stan,

Where did you find that section on the SC-1/2. I have the manuals that came with the SC-1 and no warning about voltage--however the manual does state that you must use the constant voltage pin to power the switch (not track voltage).

I lowered the voltage to 14 volts and a couple of the switches twitched, but none 'switched' when I turned on the main power. The only problem with the lower voltage is that some of the switches don't throw very crisply/completely at the lower voltage-- even though I have tried to thoroughly re-condition all of them.

Do you think the problem is in the SC-1 or could it be the fact that most of the switches have the 'switching terminals' wiring in close proximity to the constant voltage wiring--maybe high inrush current coupling to one on the switch control wires??

Ken

I have the same thing happen at times with K-Line switches(K-275 & K-276) when powered to the aux inputs with 20v from a KW or 18+ volts from a PM-1. I's never bothered me... I think it's just the SC-1 finding where its state-of-readiness is... it does take power through the switch machine bulbs & coils to power itself in this configuration.

You can power the SC-1 with a dedicated supply, this might eliminate the issue.

From the O22 switch manual:

https://www.lionelsupport.com/...ents/72-4062-250.pdf

I'm not familiar with the interal workings of the SC-1 but following thread suggests possibly quirky behavior when using LED indicators instead of incandescent bulbs.

https://ogrforum.com/t...-1-switch-controller

Rob & Stan,

Thank you for the info. In my case, none of the current passes thru the switch machine bulbs since that path is disconnected and replaced with 12VDC going to the LED that has replaced the incandescent.

In looking at the 022 switch schematic, it appears that power to the either of the outside terminals (which go to the SC-1) is from the constant voltage terminal, through the appropriate half of the solenoid coil and then to the appropriate terminal. The lamp is powered from the constant voltage terminal, through the lamp to ground direct.

I don't have any problem operating the switches (but the voltage must be close to 18 for some of them to snap), it's just the random craziness when I power up with the constant voltage set to 18-19 volts.

Rob, you may be correct about the SC-1 finding their ready state.

I'll play some more, but any new suggestions will be tried and appreciated.

Ken

Gentlemen,

   Rob is correct as usual, power the SC-1 with it's own power supply, and use the LED bulbs in your 022 Switches.

PCRR/Dave

I can only tell you about SC-2's, but any issues that I had, went away by powering the device with it's own power supply and let the relays switch\control any power through them.

Powering these devices off of transformer power that is used for either accessories or track causes quirky-ness.

The SC-1 uses very small TO-92 triacs for controlling it's outputs.  They're the same ones that the Lionel R2LC uses for lamps and couplers.

Since the 022 switch lights the lamps through the solenoid, I suspect it's the characteristics of the triac that are the issue. I also think 19.5 volts is way too much voltage.  I usually run 022 switches on 14-16 volts for positive operation, but more than that should not be necessary.

FWIW, the SC-2 is a totally different animal, and really shares nothing in common with the SC-1, except a similar model number.

John, I have reconditioned a couple of the switches now and they operate at ~15.5 Volts. But, if you were to use the constant voltage terminals of a KW, you get about 20V.

Even at ~16V, if immediately applied at power up, some of the sw's change position. Even if I use a variable voltage and ramp it up quickly from zero, same result. At this point, the only solution I can come up with is to use a variable output and turn it up to 16 volts slowly.

Ken

I have little experience with the SC-1, I have several in my parts box.  I replaced blown triacs on them and got them working, but I decided that any switching I'd do would probably be better handled by SC-2 boxes.

Ken,

   Guns is giving you the correct skinny, do not use the KW Constant terminals for running your 022 switches, 20V is way to much power and will damage the switches.  You are heading down the correct path using the variable channels and increasing power per the number of switches you have on line, 16.5 should be plenty with your 022's, if you add some old 711's you will need to increase the voltage a might.  Use LED lights in the old switches to help keep the needed operating voltage down.

PCRR/Dave