Current O-gauge equipment guide?

Your quest is for the Holy Grail of model railroading, and you aren't going to be any more successful than Monty Python or the Middle Ages crusaders.  Over the years, price guides (and most agree that the prices listed are useless by the time the guide is published) have been printed for a few select (popular) manufacturers, but that leaves out a lot.  Some manufacturer's catalogs and/or production lists are available either on-line or through E-bay purchases, but a lot are not.

I have, over the last ten years, acquired info on over 40 manufacturers and/or distributors, but most of that is incomplete and includes some info from within that group which is not O gauge.  There are multiple fora that deal with model railroading, and I belong to several of them.  The best you can hope to do is read, learn and save the useful data to a computer for yourself.

Chuck

You can often find old manufactures catalogs at train shows like TCA and current catalogs at hobby shops.

Also try sites like Trainz.com and http://www.tandem-associates.c...ionellocomotives.htm.

In this case Google.com is your friend and you can not always say that.

Charlie

Both MTH and K-Line published a book detailing production in their early years.  MTH went up through year 2000 which leaves the last 20 years.  K-Line's book went up through 1998.  Generally their later catalogs are for sale on ebay.  I have had difficulty trying to fill in the gaps for k-Line production.  MTH, a lot of catalogs out there.  There are sites that list a lot of the Lionel production.  There is not  a one site answer all questions that I know of.

As Chuck pointed out, a comprehensive list of O scale trains is the Holy Grail.

Here are links to sources for the major O gauge manufacturers:

3rd Rail: Catalogs from 2004-2008 and 2011 and 2017 are online.

Atlas:  The web site has an all scales Archive that can be browsed or searched.

K-line:  Catalogs 1999-2005 and a searchable database of products are preserved at LegacyKline.com

MTH:  Their Product Locator is searchable database of all MTH products past and current.  It has advanced search features.  Also Catalogs from 1993 to present are on their web site (for now) .  A few years ago there was a vendor at York in White Hall who sold a CD with a complete inventory of MTH products.  I imagine he scraped the data off of MTH's website.  If anyone has knowledge of this product, please post.

Lionel:  Similar to MTH, they have an Archived Products searchable database.  It uses a very basic "dumb" search.    Be sure to check the Products tab and the Archives tab in the results. Catalogs from 2011 to present are online (2011-2013 are Flash pages - see below).  Here are Catalog Indexes for 2000-2014 where you can quickly scan all the SKUs and product names in individual catalogs. They are accessed by the links labeled "view as HTML" below the catalog names.  The SKU/Names link to each product page.  Many of the Catalogs linked from that page are Flash, so they no longer work.

Addendum: Since Flash no longer works, here are some PDF versions of Lionel Catalogs courtesy of M.H.M. (posting from another thread):

Weaver:  Fortunately The Internet Wayback Machine (archive.org) never forgets.  I have attached 2 spreadsheets  below that Weaver provided documenting its product history:  Ultra Line Production.xls lists 500 Weaver Locomotives and passenger cars (no freight) and Gold Edition.xls lists over 1800 pieces of rolling stock.

Here are links to 11 years of Weaver catalogs from Archive.org (be patient - they load slowly):

  Spring 2004  Fall 2004  Spring 2005  Fall 2005   Spring 2006  Fall 2006  Spring 2007  Fall 2007  Spring 2008 Fall 2008  2009  Fall 2009  Spring 2010  Fall 2010   Spring 2011  Fall 2011  Spring 2012 (attachment)  Fall 2012 (attachment) Spring 2013 Fall 2013  Fall 2014

Williams:  Williams by Bachmann catalogs from 2008 to present as well as a few older Williams catalogs are online.   Also the Parts pages lists most locomotives and some passenger cars and boxcars.

My son (who is a programmer) showed me how in about 30 minutes, he could scrape all the product data from a few of these model train web sites.  Others, notably Lionel, are much more difficult.  I have thought about compiling this "Holy Grail" master list, but there are unresolved issues such as ownership of the data and cost and logistics of making it available to other hobbyists.

Bob Glorioso

Thank you all. At least I have some ideas to start from. And, I will just need to bring a pad and pen to train shows to write down what I see that I life for future reference!

RRDOC

Thank you for posting your extensive list of sources of catalogs and information on most model train manufactures products over the years.  I now know where to go to fill the holes in my stacks of old catalogs.

It would be great if someone would complete the train guides that Greenberg and Doyle did so well for Lionel and Marx for prewar and postwar trains.  For recent times it should include Lionel after 1991 and 2000, MTH, Williams, K-Line and others.  I would be happy with someone just scanning information from catalogs into an on line book for each manufacturer.  It could include just one scan for each item not a scan of the whole catalogs.

Charlie

As others have noted, there is no comprehensive guide to all O gauge manufacturers/production over the past couple of decades, nor is there likely to be one in the near (and perhaps distant) future. It would be a major and very time consuming--not to mention costly--undertaking for any individual or firm. Even if it was strictly an online publication, those same limitations would still hold true. In large part, that is because some manufacturers, in particular, have been very productive since around 1990 or so, and an accurate presentation of what has been made (and items that were supposed to be made, but never actually were) would encompass a huge volume.

My advice, if O gauge is your new interest, would be to decide on the specific roadnames and era you might like to model, and then to research those specific, and presumably more limited, items online on a manufacturer-by-manufacturer basis. That would certainly be a less intimidating approach.

Thank you all!

Ben,

Welcome.

From my experience a pad a pen is a good start, but you'll be graduating quickly to something much larger.

After a good 10 years away from this hobby I wandered back in in 2016 and found myself at an auction in a small town about 2 hours away.  The large collection of a long-time buff was being auctioned off after his passing.  I looked around the room and saw a few people like me, but I noticed mostly what I would call "serious enthusiasts".

A number of these folks were carrying 3" or 4" binders, which turned out to be books holding their wish lists and related details.  One fellow actually had two volumes for his.

Aside from being intimidated, because my list was a mere 8 items long at that point, I decided to find a more modern way to build my version of the binder/set of binders.

On that day, October 29, 2016 I started an electronic version with a single entry, using an application called Evernote.  As of this morning there are now 7125 more entries, and Evernote has come to consider me a 'power user'.  Yet I can access any item in my important items list from my phone, anywhere, and at any time, as well as my laptop.  There is now no need for me to carry any paper whatsoever.

In the middle of this screenshot you'll see a list of 10 of those 7126 entries, a short subset of the entire database.  To the right are the details for one of the 10, the highlighted one, including text and pictures.

Pay careful attention to the list in the black column to the left as it contains a special list of keywords, many more than you can see.  The secret to Evernote is the ability to add keywords to each entry (like most software), but it also carries the relationship between those keywords.  This is very, very powerful for finding things later.

I started this effort to make sure that I'd never forget anything anymore, and I now don't -- as long as I don't forget to enter it.  When I go to a train show, or an auction, or while surfing the web for deals, all I need is my phone.

Good luck with your new effort.  Being organized is helpful.  Whether you use paper or software O Gauge/Scale will bring you many hours, days, weeks, months and years of enjoyment.

Mike

I did a search of the Internet Wayback Machine and found 14 catalogs and a complete listing of Weaver locomotives and rolling stock.  The Weaver catalogs (and products)  were beautiful.  I added them to my compilation of O Gauge manufacturer's products above.  The Internet never forgets!

Bob Glorioso

Sweet!  Bob, you saved the day (or the week, or month, or year, or maybe the decade?)

I've been looking for the Weaver catalogs for ages, and only found three of them up until today.  IWM worked like a charm.  I found 19 in total from 2004 through 2014.  There were only two that I couldn't open (Spring 2012 and Fall 2012).

Thanks for the suggestion.

Mike

Great!

The Internet Wayback Machine is a little awkward to use and some of the catalog links were dead, but it is a great resource if you are persistent.   If you have actual links, post them here and I will add them to my post above.  If not, when I get a chance, I will search for additional catalog years.

Bob

I have the Spring and Fall 2012 Weaver catalogs in PDF.  I have attached them for anybody that wants a copy.

I also downloaded the Weaver Ultra Line Production file from above, but it looks like many items in that list are linked to a group of related pictures.  Any chance those can also be linked here?

Chuck

Thanks Chuck.  You've helped me close out my search.

The page from the Weaver website (from Feb 15, 2015) that IWM pulls up, listing the catalogs, can be found here:

  https://web.archive.org/web/20...dels.com/catpg1.html

It has fully functional links for each catalog except for the two for 2012.  All the pictures are also present.

Mike

Thank you for posting the link to the catalogs. That is super helpful.

If looking at catalog covers, one sheets and other items from manufacturers will help or entertain you try phrankenstign.com and scroll down to the train section.  He has done a pretty good job adding covers to the list.

Great!  Now you've identified another source, but it only provides catalog covers (at least for Weaver).  So much more that I don't have; so much more to find!!  Thanks, Bill.

Chuck

Thanks Chuck and Mike.   I updated my compilation of O Gauge manufacturer's products above.  Now we have a complete set of Weaver Catalogs 2004-2014.  I could not find a live link for Spring and Fall 2012, but fortunately Chuck provided the PDF.

Bob

Since so much progress has been made with the Weaver materials I decided to revisit a more complex question that I had about Lionel catalogs online, between 2000 and 2008.  A number of folks have mentioned in posts over the last few years, on this Forum and others, that Lionel had changed to a new website at some point prior to 2010.  One result of this migration was apparently that catalogs for the years prior to the changeover were no longer accessible.  Having been out of the hobby between 2002 and 2016 I do not recall what earlier version of the site looked like, or how it may have hosted the catalogs.

A little digging over the last few days has provided some answers.   Back in September of 2016 I stumbled across a broken, and oddly-coded, web page that came to me in a Google search.  You can see this page here:

  https://www.lionelsupport.com/products/catalogs/

It turns out to be a partial list of Lionel's post-2000 catalogs hosted online.   Broken and oddly-coded because you enter the page in the middle, and there's no way to scroll up to it's top (the scroll bar won't let you).  Partial because, given what you are able to access, it's still not complete.  Years 2006 and 2007 are missing.

However it is a start for finding the contents of the 2000 to 2008 catalogs because, although everything is not there, you can click on what is there and it will take you to the previously missing catalogs, as long as the year is listed.

Here's the kicker -- what you will see is for 2000 to 2008 are not PDF copies of the actual print catalogs, but web representations of them.  In other words Lionel created a set of web pages, for each of its paper catalogs in that range of years, representing the corresponding catalog's contents so that it could be read using a web browser.  Each of these sets has a cover page, a table of contents, a "Letter from the CEO" page, etc., followed by web pages showing the products that are in that paper catalog, just like the corresponding paper catalog, but formatted for web browsing instead.

On the other hand, what you see for 2009, 2010 and apparently part of 2011 are links to the PDF format files we've become accustom to, and which are accessible elsewhere on the current site.

Lastly, more good news -- using Google's "Site Search" I was able to locate the missing web catalogs for 2006 and 2007.

Here are the missing links:

2006

  Volume 1

  https://www.lionelsupport.com/...05D-B71E34759BC76E19

  Volume 2

  https://www.lionelsupport.com/...5A5-9867DF780CEE5190

2007

  Volume 1

  https://www.lionelsupport.com/...7BB-605AF73EF3FFFDB8

  Volume 2

  https://www.lionelsupport.com/...05D-B71D2ABDCD39E6E7

  K-Line by Lionel Volume 1

  https://www.lionelsupport.com/...A0D-239EF3F064174F26

  K-Line by Lionel Volume 2

  https://www.lionelsupport.com/...05D-B76749AC1290C30D

Be aware that a small number of pictures are missing from the web catalogs, largely in the later years in the sequence 2000-2009.  These are generally not the product pictures that would be so important to each of us, but the ones on the cover page, the welcome page, and the "Guide to Product Features" pages.

Many thanks to @rplst8 for pointing out the availability of, and syntax for, Google Site Search in his post:

  https://ogrforum.com/...4#154730474064924244

Go at it and have fun!

M.H.M.

Mike

That is a great find.  With the 2009 through 2015 catalogs you have an option of an actual catalog and "view as HTML." The HTML version is simply a page of links to the product page of each item.  Unfortunately, for those years Adobe Flash is required to view the catalog.   Flash reached end of life in January due to security concerns.  For several months users saw prompts to uninstall Flash when visiting a page with Flash.   I am not sure but I believe eventually many browsers uninstalled it for you.  You can no longer download the Flash Plugin.  I just tried Safari and Chrome and neither would display the catalogs.  

Bob

Hi Ben,

I think you will find that O gauge Hi-Rail is a lot more of plain fun, and a lot more forgiving in operation, than HO.  At least, that has been my experience.

Another way to see what is out there, is to go to the "Bay" website, and go to Model Trains, O-Gauge, and select locomotives, cars, accessories etc.  You can even select these items by manufacturer.

If you browse through the listings once a day, you will new and used products dating from 1920 or so, to last week.    Most engines and rolling stock items have several close up pictures, plus good descriptions.    Pretty soon, you are going to start seeing things that "catch your eye", and you'll be saying "Wow, I really want to get one of those."  And, you can write it down.

The prices listed are almost always too high, but they definitely give you a context for the price, especially if there are two or three sale listings with different prices for the same item in different conditions.   If you go to a small show and find the item for 10% to 15% less, then I think you got a good deal.  Is the lowest possible price?  No, but your goal is not to search for years for the lowest price, but to get what you want.

And, if you check the For Sale topic on this Board every day, you can also find good sales.

Also, if you really want a used item, at a fair price, you can always put it in the Wanted section of this board.  I have done this three times, and other Members with extensive collections have sold the items to me a very very fair prices.

I had to laugh when I read about guys at train shows with 3" thick notebooks containing there wish list.   My wish list is generally  3 items written on a single piece of paper.

On the other hand, if you are interested in getting into the O-Gauge hobby as a serious collector, and wanting to collect rare sets or items, then I think you are on a totally different "track" than what I have described above.  And, you will be destined to the joy of attending lots of shows, occasionally finding these things, and having to do some serious negotiations and laying out some serious cash (the same as with HO).

Hope this helps.

Mannyrock

I updated my post compiling all the manufacturers catalogs (5 posts from top) to correct some dead links and add links to PDFs of Lionel Catalogs provided by Mellow Hudson Mike.

Bob

Can you provide as a copy of Weaver catalogs from 1997-2003. I had a two page ad in one of those Weaver catalogs but I can't remember which one.

Jim,

The topic of Weaver catalogs just came up in another thread.

Go here:

   Links to Weaver Catalogs from Bob G. | Mellow Hudson Mike

Unfortunately they start at 2004.

Mike

Before Lionel redid their support site I was able to download some of the 2008 and earlier catalogs using a utility called HTtrack. Keep in mind these earlier catalogs are not an exact duplicate of the paper catalogs, as their format and layout is somewhat different.  The HTtrack utility basically copies all the required links and images and stores them in a project folder for viewing. If the original website changes or no longer exist, the projects from HTtrack will still work.

@ed h posted:

Before Lionel redid their support site I was able to download some of the 2008 and earlier catalogs using a utility called HTtrack. Keep in mind these earlier catalogs are not an exact duplicate of the paper catalogs, as their format and layout is somewhat different.  The HTtrack utility basically copies all the required links and images and stores them in a project folder for viewing. If the original website changes or no longer exist, the projects from HTtrack will still work.

Ed,

Although the old website has been gone for a long, long time the files containing the "earlier catalogs (that) are not an exact duplicate of the paper catalogs" were still there, for many years actually, up until quite recently.

That's precisely what the links in my post above (the "missing links" from 5/5/21) used to lead to.  I've repeated them here for convenience, but while they worked at that point in 2021 someone has found and removed the files they were linked to, so they no longer work now:

@Mellow Hudson Mike posted:

Lastly, more good news -- using Google's "Site Search" I was able to locate the missing web catalogs for 2006 and 2007.

Here are the missing links:

2006

  Volume 1

  https://www.lionelsupport.com/...05D-B71E34759BC76E19

  Volume 2

  https://www.lionelsupport.com/...5A5-9867DF780CEE5190

2007

  Volume 1

  https://www.lionelsupport.com/...7BB-605AF73EF3FFFDB8

  Volume 2

  https://www.lionelsupport.com/...05D-B71D2ABDCD39E6E7

  K-Line by Lionel Volume 1

  https://www.lionelsupport.com/...A0D-239EF3F064174F26

  K-Line by Lionel Volume 2

  https://www.lionelsupport.com/...05D-B76749AC1290C30D

Be aware that a small number of pictures are missing from the web catalogs, largely in the later years in the sequence 2000-2009.  These are generally not the product pictures that would be so important to each of us, but the ones on the cover page, the welcome page, and the "Guide to Product Features" pages.

Many thanks to @rplst8 for pointing out the availability of, and syntax for, Google Site Search in his post:

  https://ogrforum.com/...4#154730474064924244

Go at it and have fun!

M.H.M.

You could at that point still use HTtrack, or other similar methods like Print Edit WE, or Adobe Acrobat, to grab them.

And the ones that were not listed in the quote box above could be found here (this doesn't work anymore either):

  https://www.lionelsupport.com/products/catalogs/

Alas, no longer.

Mike

One thing the catalogs or train shows do not tell you is the quality or issues with a particular engine or car.

Some are fantasy paint schemes or fantasy designs, some had metal issues or electronic issues, poor runners etc.

Those issues you can get answer to right here on the forum. Visit a club if one is nearby and talk and see what is going on.

Good luck in your endeavors.

To add to this, most of the results in google for lionelsupport.com are totally useless now since Lionel decided to trash their old site.

Yet another reason companies should be careful around decisions like this.  I’m not sure who’s calling the shots over there, but from my view they are phoning it in.

P.S. With some thoughtful consideration and a little design work, they could have totally kept the google results relevant.

@BenLMaggi posted:

I have been an occasional lurker on this site, though I currently model in HO scale. However, I anticipate switching to hi-rail O gauge in a couple of years. I have slowly been buying stuff I like, and read the odd O-gauge magazines, but can't say I am familiar with the scene.

I see lots of stuff I like at train shows, but then I go home and forget it. I would also like to know what has been made over the past 15-20 years by all the big manufacturers (Lionel, MTH, K-Line, Atlas O, Williams, WBB, etc). Does anyone publish a guide listing stuff that has come out? It doesn't necessarily have to list value, but engine or car types, road numbers, item numbers, and perhaps year produced would be really helpful.

Thanks.

PS: this is my first post, so if it is in the wrong place I appologize.

Unfortunately, the info you seek will have to be gathered as not one source/place has the info you seek.

• For K-line you have to get the K-line book. MDK wanted to write their own book and never gave permission to release their items in anyone else's book
• For MTH Their book "A Toy Train Story" is a good reference with all their production and photos shown up til 2000 ish?
• TM books and Video at the end of last century published a pocket price guide for all other 3rd rail trains [sans k-line]. but this stops at 1998
• The Train shop at Brentwood Antiques with additional MTH production up til 2010.
• Greenbergs price and rarity guide BOOKS [Not pocket guides] up till 2000 have some pictures.

The rest you will have to seek catalogs of the various manufacturers,

@rplst8 posted:

To add to this, most of the results in google for lionelsupport.com are totally useless now since Lionel decided to trash their old site.

Yet another reason companies should be careful around decisions like this.  I’m not sure who’s calling the shots over there, but from my view they are phoning it in.

P.S. With some thoughtful consideration and a little design work, they could have totally kept the google results relevant.

@Mellow Hudson Mike posted:

Ed,

Although the old website has been gone for a long, long time the files containing the "earlier catalogs (that) are not an exact duplicate of the paper catalogs" were still there, for many years actually, up until quite recently.

That's precisely what the links in my post above (the "missing links" from 5/5/21) used to lead to.  I've repeated them here for convenience, but while they worked at that point in 2021 someone has found and removed the files they were linked to, so they no longer work now:

You could at that point still use HTtrack, or other similar methods like Print Edit WE, or Adobe Acrobat, to grab them.

And the ones that were not listed in the quote box above could be found here (this doesn't work anymore either):

  https://www.lionelsupport.com/products/catalogs/

Alas, no longer.

Mike

Mike,

I realize just until Lionel changed the lionelsupport.com website in the past month the catalog links as you mentioned were still accessible. Late last year I used the HTtrack utility to save a few of the earlier catalogs. Guess I should have grabbed them all while I still had the chance.

Ben

You have been doing the correct thing by "buying stuff you like".  By considering all manufactures of hi-rail O gauge gear for the last 15 to 20 years you are open to an over whelming amount of trains to learn about. Trying to learn about all the manufactures and all their trains is a daunting tasks as you have learned from all the above massive amount of information there is out there.

I think you need to prune down train list by examining your field of interest so you can develop a list of a few items you are targeting first.  Since your an experienced HO scale modeler you should have a good idea of what you like and what you can eliminate.  You should be able to decide whether you like steamer vs diesel for a start, what type of train control you want and what style of layout you will want to build.

Then you should study which manufactures make the most suitable gear for your needs.  You may be able to fine tune the manufacturer list to one but if not to two or three to considerate on.  You then determine where to find that train gear.  EBay will have the greatest selection and often the highest price due to bidding.  You often will find less selection but less competition on price at train shows, forums and some web sellers.

I would concentrate on getting a track plan and the stuff I would need to build the layout like track, switches, transformers, even lumber and other construction stuff you need to make the layout.  You will only need a few engines and cars to get started operating and continue to add more over the later years.

Charlie

@RRDOC posted:

Great!

The Internet Wayback Machine is a little awkward to use and some of the catalog links were dead, but it is a great resource if you are persistent.   If you have actual links, post them here and I will add them to my post above.  If not, when I get a chance, I will search for additional catalog years.

Bob

I was able to download all the catalogs on that web archive site EXCEPT the TWO from 2012.

I had to search for only of them that wasn't on the latest web archive site, but was able to eventually find it using the web archive and going back aways.

LCCA members have access to the HSL archives which has Lionel modern era 1970 to 1995 catalogs.  In addition there are pdfs of later Lionel catalogs from 1996 to 2010.

Ben

If you are like most of us and we will never be able to obtain every train item out there.  The old catalogs might be useful to as what was made in the past.  But all those catalogs will fill up all your hobby time.

Make a list of what you want or think your want or would like to have.  The enter that item and exact title in eBay and chances are it is for sale or was sold on the Completed or Sold Items list.  If you don not find it try a few days later.  These post of items will fully describe them and show pictures and prices someone is asking or better yet what price someone paid for the item.  This information will give all the knowledge of the item you will need to determine if you really want it and what you will have to pay for it.

Charlie

I  was able to find the HSL archives series on the bay for $50 each.

@Choo Choo Charlie posted:

Ben

If you are like most of us and we will never be able to obtain every train item out there.  The old catalogs might be useful to as what was made in the past.  But all those catalogs will fill up all your hobby time.

Make a list of what you want or think your want or would like to have.  The enter that item and exact title in eBay and chances are it is for sale or was sold on the Completed or Sold Items list.  If you don not find it try a few days later.  These post of items will fully describe them and show pictures and prices someone is asking or better yet what price someone paid for the item.  This information will give all the knowledge of the item you will need to determine if you really want it and what you will have to pay for it.

Charlie

I would suggest making more than one saved search for each item you are looking for. I've noticed some sellers appear to have no clue as to how to describe an item. If I know the SKU, then that's the first saved search. Then I'll use at leat one more search with the description of the item. Then maybe another with a less definitive description.

You have to be creative!