Stuck Horn

The non-stop horn is most likely a DCS signal strength issue. The remote horn got stuck because the engine never understood that you released the button. The is a common symptom of low or erratic DCS signal strength.

As far as the remote not turning back on, that's most likely because your batteries were't properly aligned. Once you resorted them, the remote could be turned on again.

Barry, 

Thanks, as always, for the speedy reply....at least SOMEONE gets this stuff (and I consider myself pretty good around a DCS remote). I'm aware that the signal strength is the cause for the stuck horn based on experience running on modular (Nat. Cap. Tracker) layouts.

My curiosity was the fact that signal strength was showing 10s and this was an very occasional occurrence which doesn't quite add up with a signal strength issue, at least in my mind it doesn't add up. I would've thought it would be a constant occurrence if the signal strength was the issue. Guess I was wondering if there was some other possible cause/solution. Just ran trains for about 10/15 minutes with a lot of horn/whistle blowing. Two PS3 engines, no issues. Everything ran like a top. 

Track topology or wiring anomalies can cause an occasional DCS "hiccup", even with a high signal strength.

Or, it could be due to "cosmic rays".  

Thanks Barry. Strangely enough, I ran trains this morning (new and old PS3) and the older PS3 engine, ran fine, until a press of the whistle and total  loss of control resulted and the stuck whistle. After finally pulling the plug, literally, I checked the area of track where it occurred and it was all 10s between 18 and 19 volts. Haven't had these issues before since adding this new PS3 engine the other day so that is the only cause I could possibly think of. Perhaps I'll have to call the dealer I bought it from. 

Various other operational quirks were present in the new engine during the time also. I stress all of this began when I added the new engine and seemed to stop when I took it off. Is it possible the new engine is causing all sorts of issues like this? 

I hoped this was about the old conventional Lionel horns. The relays seem to build residual magnetism and sometimes don't drop out. Is there an easy fix for that?

I guess I should have tried "search"; this has probably been discussed before!

Is it only the only the PS3 engines that's having problems, or are other engines hanging up on commands?

If it's just the PS3 that's having issues, it could be an engine problem. If not, it's almost certainly in the layout/wiring.

Does the PS3 engine show as strong a DCS signal strength as do your other engines?

Barry:

Haven't tried a PS2 yet but will this evening or tomorrow. So far, only the PS3s are having issues that have suddenly occurred when the new engine went on the rails. The layout is getting 10s all the way around. 

only the PS3s are having issues that have suddenly occurred when the new engine went on the rails.

If multiple PS3 engines are having issues, it's extremely unlikely that the new PS3 engine is the culprit.

Just tried two PS2 engines and everything ran as it should. I'll do more testing tomorrow after work to try PS2/PS3 out although I agree that if multiple engines are doing it, the problem isn't the engine. I wonder, if further testing shows continued issues, if a TIU swap may do anything. I doubt the wiring would be an issue as it is just two basic ovals (enlarged starter set ovals) with one feeder from the TIU each but that certainly doesn't mean there can't be an issue. 

I have been seeing this lately on my home layout with all engines ps2/ps3 and even lionel.  I have been wondering if the contact pads in the remote need cleaned.  

What Rev. is the TIU, and do you gave an 18 volt light bulb across the TIU outputs?

Dave - Have you just been getting the stuck horn or a combination of stuck horn and total loss of control despite the remote/engine reading 10 for track signal test? 

Barry - TIU is a new-ish (bought with remote in March 2014) Rev. L. I also have a Rev I that isn't in use now. No light bulb due to the Rev. L TIU. 

SJC my mth gp35 with PS3 was doing that as well and i talk to tech at mth. He told me to use 18 gauge ten foot wire. I tried that it does not do it now and tech told me wire not heavy enough and helps smooth out the signal. 

Jeff, 

Interesting idea. I'm using 20 gauge wire but I'm really baffled by the fact that it just started. I've been running PS3 engines since purchasing my first in February 2013. This is the first issue I've had. I would think if the wiring was screwy, it would've been so from the begining. 

Here is a rundown of what just happened:

I began running trains at 7:30pm, it is now 7:56 and stopped a few minutes ago. Two 3 volt PS2 engines were running. Everything ran fine for about 15 minutes until engine 1 had the stuck horn. Did not loose control and repressed horn to stop. Next loop around I stopped on the section of track where horn held on and did a signal test. 10. 

Did some stops and starts of both trains, including shut down/start up of engines and entire layout. On some occasions, start up would either (A) Not happen. Remote would say "start up" but nothing would happen. Push button again, everything starts up. Did signal check, 10. (B) Push start up, engine would start up with very low volume and the "maintenance required" message pops up, volume soon resumes normal volume. This happened a few times on the new PS3 engine. (C) Start up button pressed, everything works as designed. Remote/engine response would sometimes be slow, sometime normal. All PS2 engines have BCRs and are 3 volt engines. 

My next idea - could the TIU/Remote be screwy? That is the only other idea that comes to mind....tomorrow I'll dig out my Rev. I TIU and remote and see what happens. I just find it fascinating that everything began going downhill once a new engine was added and had run for a bit. 

I'm using 20 gauge wire

That's problem #1. You should be using, at a minimum, 16 gauge wire.

could the TIU/Remote be screwy? 

You could, possibly, have a loose transceiver board in the remote, TIU or both. That could cause these types of intermittent problems.

Try tethering the remote to the TIU by connecting a 4-conductor telephone handset cable (the curly kind) between the TIU's Remote Input port and the base of the TIU. See if things improve.

Barry - appreciate the help and input. 

Will put in 18 gauge (or 16 if I have it) and test. 

Will also tether remote and test. 

Just tried 18 gauge wire, one stuck horn, no control loss. Did not tether remote but will try that tomorrow then switch out TIU/Remote. 

If there is a loose board(s) in the remote and/or TIU, is it possible that it would take this long from purchase/delivery in March 2014 to now to show any issue? I would think not but then again......

If there is a loose board(s) in the remote and/or TIU, is it possible that it would take this long from purchase/delivery in March 2014 to now to show any issue? I would think not but then again......

They tend to, sometimes, work themselves loose over time.

If you have a copy of The DCS O Gauge Companion 2nd Edition, I suggest that you review pages 155-157 for a complete discussion of the "loose transceiver board" scenario and how to correct it.

This and a whole lot more is all in MTH’s “The DCS O Gauge Companion 2nd Edition", available for purchase as an eBook or a printed book at MTH's web store!

I knocked my board loose inside the remote by accident the other day. I hate to admit it, but if you just give it a whack in your hands, you'll pop it out.

There was a post about adding a piece of sponge insulation behind it to prevent this.

If you tether as Barry suggests and it solves the problem, then that's it. 

Ooops, Barry came in while I was typing. Yeah, they'll come lose over time. That's what happened.

 Just don't whack it when you forget to throw a switch!

Quick update. Getting ready to head out to work...short day today so more testing to follow this afternoon/evening. 

Just did a quick 15 minute run....tethered, no issues cropped up. Last 5 minutes I pulled the tether out of the remote and almost immediately, I got a stuck horn. Did not check for control loss but once tether replaced in remote, I pressed the horn to stop and no further issues. Appears the tether has worked but no 100% sure yet...will test more later. 

I'm back with not so good news....

Just ran trains (2 PS2 engines) for about 20 minutes with the remote tethered. No control issues but two stuck horns on one loop and double soft key commands on the other loop. Very frustrating, especially since everything was fine one day and the next day I had issues with no changes outside of adding a new engine. Any other suggestions? Time to swap remotes and TIU? 

Any other suggestions? Time to swap remotes and TIU? 

Is it one particular soft key, as well as the horn?

Some things to try:

• Try using a different remote
• Move soft keys around and see if it's always the same soft key that doubles-up, along with the horn
• Try spraying a plastic-safe contact cleaner around the buttons.

Otherwise, live with it or crawl all over your wiring.

Barry:

Thanks. The repeating soft key occurs on the whistle soft keys SFS, RS, XS, etc. Not every time but frequently. Never use any other soft keys so I can't comment on the rest. 

Will try your suggestions. Also had a suggestion of a total TIU/Remote reset from MTH tech support that I will try. 

Thanks again. 

Just an update for anyone that may care...

Tried resetting the TIU/Remote and even using an entirely different TIU and Remote....No change. Still getting the stuck horn. Repeating soft keys are a minor annoyance but something I can live with. Loss of control and stuck horn I can't. This has to be the most bizarre things I've ever seen in using DCS. No wiring issues, new TIU/Remote, one feed per loop on two starter set sized loops that have worked perfectly for months. 

Just tried running again, first no response. Nothing would respond to start up. Shut off power and Pressed start up and it delayed a bit but started up. Roll the thumbwheel to get inner loop train to standard 10MPH and it was delayed and intermittent (T) for tethered symbol pops up when it is not tethered. Also received TIU Error message. 

Wanted to update this thread - last night, for no particular reason, I added fiber pins in all three holes on my inner loop that would have the stuck horn issue and little repetition of soft key whistles. 

With the fiber pins, the stuck horn is gone but the softkey whistles often repeat. Anything to be concerned about? I also have the softkeys repeat on my outer loops with is just a basic oval with one feed on a 4x8. The inner loop is smaller but has 3 sidings with Ross switches. The repeating softkeys are an annoyance but don't seem to affect performance.