Lionel 8303

Liam: Don't own one, but here are my guess' to your questions; possibly metal body. These 2-4-2s usually have traction tires (no magnetrataction) and can motors (not Pullmors).

Your engine has a bit of history to it.

First, it is plastic, and it has traction tires, (no mangetraction), and the MPC creation,

"The Mighty Sound of Steam".

When this engine was first being considered, some at MPC wanted to brand it as "The Blue Comet". There is a B & W photo of the prototype in the TM book about the MPC era.

However Lenny Dean, the Service Manager, who stayed on with the new MPC management, lobbied to wait on the Blue Comet name until MPC had the budget to make an appropriate engine. A large die-cast version of the Blue Comet did come out in 1979.

During the early MPC years most prototypes were made at the Hillside plant, and Lenny Dean remained based there until they moved out in 1975. 

As for The Mighty Sound of Steam, it may, or may not work, as the electronics proved

to be fragile.  This topic turns up on a regular basis.

Enjoy.

Ken

Before you put this engine on the track remove the tender housing and check the foam mounting for the sound of steam board. Make sure that it is in good shape and not allowing the board to short out to the metal frame of the tender. The foam on these tenmders has been coming apart and allowing the board to short out destroing the board.

Al

thanks for the replies guys! Here is a link to the auction of the engine http://www.ebay.com/itm/140715...9.l2649#ht_500wt_948 Not sure why the seller said it had Magnetraction it kight have been a mistake but it seems like he said the sound of steam works and it smokes well. I thought this was a good deal because I love the color and because he said he cleaned it up and it smokes well. I am assuming it probably has a pullmor because he said he cleaned the brushes. I am thinking about adding an Led headlight and back up light to this. How would you suggest I do it? Thanks again, Liam 

I think he doesn't know what MagnaTraction is.  From the ad:  magne traction- tire is good shape

thanks for the tips on the sound of steam board. I,will make sure to,do that before putting it on the track. 

Looks like a great find.

One point of clarification: the engine does have an AC Pulmor motor.

DC can motors began appearing in the DC only industrial switcher sets (US Steel, Chessie, Republic Steel), and then in some DC only steamers around 1978. But I don't think they were used in any "traditional" engines (i.e., running on AC current from a regular transformer) until the early/mid 80s. 

Hi Guys

Thanks very much for your advise on the 8303 tender sound.

I have a problem/question.

I have a 8303 loco which I bought years age at a yard sale. I recently bought an "as-is" tender on eBay to go with the loco. Luckily I read your posts before powering the tender.

I opened it and found the speaker rotted and the circuit board insulation foam gone.

I replaced the speaker and foam. The board visually looks (no obvious burns,etc).

In powering the tender I found the following.

When touching the power wire to center rail, an load unpleasant AC buzz comes from the

speaker. When connecting the tender power line to the loco receptacle, and running

the loco, a rhythmic buzzing sound can be heard (the rhythm increasing with loco speed).

The sound does not sound like train chugging.

Is any of this expected? Can I repair the performance in any way?

Any help would be appreciated!

The chuff switch in the loco may not be working.  The circuit should only be powered when the switch is closed, sounds like it's always closed from that description.

Here is link to diagram of engine parts.

http://www.lionel.com/media/se...201-8005Complete.pdf

I'm not seeing any chuff switch in that diagram...

The parts brakedown referenced is for a 8005 engine, the one in question is a 8303. The chuff switch is part of the smoke unit. As to the problem it sounds to me as if the main filter capacitor is gone. Most of these boards are old and the capacitors can have deteriorated. The boards are easy to repair. Just replace the large capacitors.

Al

here is link to 8303  sorry about error.

http://www.lionel.com/media/se...ts/18042Complete.pdf

I guess the question is, if you just tap the tender lead onto the middle rail, do you get the chuff sound you're looking for?  That's what the switch in the locomotive is doing.

Thanks for all the replies I received the locomotivetoday and it runs great here is a video of it 

It seems that the seller already added apiece of cardboard under the boars so I could get straight to running it 

I looked and it appears there is no chuff switch it is just the smoke unit 

You'll have to add one if you want that tender to chuff.

Maybe there was one but I did not take the smoke unit all the way out of the shell but I have seen this type of smoke unit a lot and it just appeared there was one extra wire but I am not sure. I think the chuff switch must be connected to the bellow that puffs the air in the smoke unit. I guess there must be one working because it has been chuffing along happily 

From the picture in the parts list, it looks like the switch is internal in that smoke unit.

  Thanks for the 8303 help, guys.   To answer gunrunnerjohn's question, when I tap

the tender's wire  rhythmically to the center rail, I get a corresponding rhythmic AC buzz from the speaker....not a "steam chug" sound.  When the wire is attached to the loco and run, based on speed, I  hear a corresponding rhythmic clicking sound from the tender.   Hard to hear because of the noise from the loco wheels.   Does this mean the loco switch is working, but the tender electronics is shot?   What parts may be at fault?

    Even with the chug not working, what might be thought  a funny blue color looks good and fits in to the psychedelic 1970's!

Sounds like the SOS board is not operating correctly.  From that description, I'd say the engine switch works.  You should hear a burst of static each time the lead is powered, and it actually does kinda' sound like a steam chuff when they're working properly.

Here's what a properly working SOS board sounds like.

CNJ Hudson SOS Locomotive

Where do you find a "modern era" service manual?

Maybe my choice of names (Modern Era Service Manual) was poor.

Modern era Lionel continued to publish a service manual / parts manual for a number of years.

Lionel had really cut back in the 1960's. There were some parts lists by product, but not much in the way of diagrams or "tips".  MPC was a big improvement.

I purchased a factory set directly from Lionel.

A few years later, Lionel turned over the service manual to Greenberg, who republished the set, and started producing supplements. The supplements were available from Lionel, and from retailers.

Lionel put the manual on-line a while back, and added supplements from time to time. There is the basic set, and supplements going up to #47. supplement #47 is dated 8-2004. Here is a link:

http://www.lionel.com/Customer...e/service-documents/

To get the manuals, use the "Product Supplements" box on the upper left hand side. There is a pulldown to select which volume to download (Supplement 1-9,10 through 47)

As far as the printed manuals went:

The early Modern era ones were largely just parts lists (by product), bound in a white glossy cardboard-like binder. I think the lettering on the cover was either blue or green, and the pages were a heavy stock.

The factory set I referenced above came in red 3-ring binders. Some binders are imprinted. Other binders were plain, but Lionel made up stickers for the cover and end.

I know of three versions, more or less labeled volumes one, two, and three.

The Greenberg binders were black, with imprinted covers, and I think there are also three volumes.

The above description of the manuals is just from memory, and they have not been out in a while.  Please let me know if you want more details. I can get them out and be more specific.

I have all the Lionel supplements, I was thinking you were looking elsewhere.   I'm not looking to buy more old books, just thought I might have overlooked a resource on-line.

There were several variations to the SOS, including the size of the resistor and how the unit was powered.  Some from the tender with only the chuff signal coming from the engine smoke unit, and others had power come from engine.  CW smoke unit is the standard used, with a copper strip on the pump lever that makes contact with a jumper tab connected usually via the resistor.  Not all unit had a resistor.

When these are in good shape the SOS sound is not bad.  Not RS by any means but not too bad for a conventional starter set from the 70s.  G

I am very glad to see this post.  I recently acquired a Blue Streak Freight Set.

I took the tender apart after reading these posts on this subject and discovered 

that the foam padding had disintegrated. I could see  no apparent damage to

the board, so cut a 2 x 2&1/2 inch of poster board & a rectangle of 1/8th inch

and replaced the disintegrated foam.

Now, i need to do a lube & maintenance on the locomotive before I try it out.

thanks for the tips...

The Blue Streak Freight was my first Lionel train, headed by Jersey Central #8303.

I always liked the Sound of Steam.  Unlike the Marx sound-o-power, the chuffing and puffing of smoke are synchronized to the motion of the drive rods.  The body is plastic, but it has a heavy-duty AC Pullmor motor with a large diameter armature and more field laminations than a postwar 2034-100.  If you need a little more drawbar pull, you can add the front ballast weight from a Postwar #248 or 249.  This keeps the center of gravity low, and helps to prevent high-speed derailments.  A 3-position e-unit can be installed if desired.  Great, fun little engine and still useful on smaller layouts.

Over the years I also picked up a spare tender shell.  One of these days I'm going to cut off the top and replace those oil fill hatches with a proper coal bunker.  Blue coal, of course!  Keep on Chuffing!!