So once again it's been a while since I have posted but I have done some work in the meantime. I put in drywall, painted, and upgraded the electrical. In the meantime, my better half has decided that the amount of space allocated for the train was too much so I had to cut down on the track plan a little bit. My previous railroad had L-girder benchwork but I'm thinking for this one that L-girder my not be necessary since the track plan is basically one level, except for the red track which will dip down 2.5 inches then come back up. As discussed way back, I am a definite "looper" and even though I really wanted a multi-level plan, it was just too complicated so I think this track plan is right for me. I could always add a switch or two in the front part of the dog bone if needed. I hoping to start the benchwork this weekend so your thoughts are welcome. Thanks and keep rolling.
Vitto, sorry to hear about the space reclamation decree. Your plan looks nice with built in reversing. What are you doing with the space in the middle?
Jay
The space in the middle of the big square loop will be open so I can access all areas of track. I plan to have a lift up bridge so i can get in there.
I have started the benchwork using the Grid System. Major snowstorm came through and knocked out the power so we spent a Saturday playing Yahtzee. Once the power came back on today, I got through some of the benchwork for the dogbone. Biggest dilemma was deciding on the height of the layout. My son is only 5'2 so I decided to make it 43.5 inches and once the plywood and homasote are added, it will be just under 45 inches.
I was doing some bench work tonight and the better half comes downstairs but I don't hear her coming down. I then hear "OMG this structure is massive". I'm only about half way done. UH OH!!
I'm very hopeful that I should be able to finish the bench work this weekend and if I do, I'll post some pictures. Next on the agenda is to order the track. I'll be going with Gargraves flex track and Ross for the switches and curves. Are there any tips that I should be aware of when ordering track?
@Vitto posted:Are there any tips that I should be aware of when ordering track?
If youre ordering direct from Ross, and depending on how many switches you want, there may be a waiting period of several weeks+.
I ordered switches August 2022 and received them in late December. Be patient as they are worth the wait.
I called Ross and talked to Steve. He told me expect a lead time of up to 8 weeks. Wish I would have ordered sooner but no big deal. One thing that I forgot to even think about was uncoupling tracks. Any ideas as to how many and where I should incorporate them into my layout?
@Vitto posted:I called Ross and talked to Steve. He told me expect a lead time of up to 8 weeks. Wish I would have ordered sooner but no big deal. One thing that I forgot to even think about was uncoupling tracks. Any ideas as to how many and where I should incorporate them into my layout?
Well it depends if you can reach the cars or not. If you can reach them easily you can probably get away with a skewer stick and manually poking the uncoupling mechanism (thumbtack, tab or whatever depending on era and manufacturer of car). Or if not, for uncouplers typically you'd want them at the beginning of a siding - be sure to leave enough spacing so that when the car is uncoupled it doesnt foul the adjacent track - and on "the main" so you can uncouple from the rest of the train and spot the car(s) in the siding.
Of course I didn't get the bench work completed this weekend. All due to my miscalculations on the amount of the lumber that was needed. I am about 90% of the way done but I won't be able to do anymore work until maybe Friday at the earliest.
So I just made a run at lunch and picked up what I think is all of the lumber needed to complete the bench work. Still have to order the track, which I should have done a long time ago, but if everything goes as planned the bench work will be done this weekend. Only problem that I see right now is that nothing ever goes as planned.
I was determined to finish the bench work this weekend and I did. I still need to put down the plywood and figure out what I want to do with the bridge but the foundation is complete and I do have time until the track arrives.
Congratulations Vitto on achieving your weekend goal and a milestone in the development of your layout.
Jay
this weekend I am going to start putting plywood onto the benchwork. I've done some reading but I am still confused. I plan to have a bottom base of plywood with the woodlands scenic foam track bed. my question is, should I do plywood, then homasote on the plywood and then the foam track bed with track held in place with zip ties or can I eliminate the homasote since i am using the foam track bed?
Vitto, shortly you will have a plethora of advice. For my layout I used plywood and then topped it with foam board. The foam board is for landscaping purposes such as a ravine between the tracks etc. For purposes of sound deadening I use 16” centers with my foundation and then carpet padding under the rails. I would think that if you use homasote you won’t need the foam track bed.
Jay
Yesterday, my order from Ross arrived. It was a long wait (I ordered in March) but now that the track is here, it's time to start laying some track. Only problem is that summer is here and my pool is open so I need some rainy days. Slowly making progress.
@Vitto posted:Only problem is that summer is here and my pool is open so I need some rainy days.
Truer words never spoken! I'm about to be in the same boat!
Finally finished putting down the plywood on the benchwork. Since the Homasote is outrageous in price, my plan is to put down foam board on all of the plywood then lay the track on woodland scenics foam bed. I believe when referring to foam board, it is basically the pink insulation. If so, should I use 1/2 inch or 1 inch?
1" but there is a guy on ebay that sells sound insulating foam that works pretty well and is decently priced. I'll see if I can find his username unless someone else does first.
I’ll do a search on eBay too in the meantime. Thanks.
I have heard of folks using sound insulating board, but have never used it. Yes, Homasote is pretty high priced now
I have 16” centers and I used 3/4” foam board on top of the plywood. Deadening quality is very good. Plus, you can carve out the foam board.
What do you mean 16” centers ?
Just spit-balling here, but 16" on center usually means the joists supporting the plywood are spaced 16" apart measured from center-to-center of each joist.
Chuck
That’s correct Chuck, the joists are set at 16 inches apart. This also helps in deadening the sound from the drum like effect of wider centers. I also used carpet padding under the rails
Jay
Attachments
It's been a while but I am going to be putting down the foam board this weekend. If I am looking at the right stuff, it looks like my local Home Depot has two options.
R-Tech
1 in. x 48 in. x 8 ft. R-3.85 Insulating Sheathing
which is $13.48 per piece
OR
Owens Corning
FOAMULAR 150 1 in. x 4 ft. x 8 ft. R-5 Scored Square Edge Rigid Foam Board Insulation Sheathing
which is $31.32 per piece.
My guess is that the R-Tech is the way to go but can someone confirm for me or point me in a better direction.
Thanks.
So once again, I am thoroughly confused. I did a bunch of reading on what to put down on the table top surface and I was going to put down a foam top but now I am not so sure. My benchwork is all done and so far I have the top as plywood with 1/2 inch on some spots and 3/4 inch in others. My plan was to cover the entire top in 1 inch pink foam and then put the track on woodland scenics roadbed. I was also going to secure the track with zip ties that went all the way through the plywood. Now I am afraid of sound and warping of the foam. I have all day tomorrow to work on it so should I continue with my plan or rethink it? Please give your comments. Thanks.
Vitto, I have never tried styrofoam under the track, so I don’t know about sound. I know of people who have successfully used zip ties to hold down track, but I think that was on harder surfaces than foam. I can see there could be some warping of the foam if the ties are snugged down too tightly. I wish I could be more helpful and hope someone else with more knowledge responds.
Traditional top for sound deadening is homasote. Its available at the Menards in Lake orion.
thank you for the advice. I never think of Menards but we are on our way there.
Vito, I’m very happy with my plywood base and 3/4” foam board. Under the track I have carpet padding. Where the padding can be seen it has been painted black to coincide with the ballast; when I get to that point. I also painted the foam board brown; even though there will be other ground cover.
Jay
@Vitto Check out these forum links which discuss sound. You will have to make your own choice.
sound 1 sound 2 For what its worth, I screw directly into 1/2" baltic birch plywood. I've tried various noise deadening approaches and found they were not worth the bother. Reducing the plywood area (cookie cutter) to minimum does reduce noise but not eliminate. I understand solid rail (sans plastic roadbed) is quieter than rolled/tubular.
@Jeff_the_Coaster_Guy did a study around 2020 with a decibel meter showing results of different roadbed layers. homasote db test data This is a 2 page post with lots of interesting comments.
I find I use DCS to selectively reduce engine sounds while keeping other sounds at higher levels. Train running noise does not appear to be excessive to my ear, mainly because the engine sounds usually drown it out.
Jay, that sounds like a great option! There are so many ways of providing a base for track and scenery! I first used Homasote in the ‘80s. To me, it was certainly better than running on bare plywood like I did in my teenage years. I’d I didn’t have a used 12’x4’ (that isn’t a typo) sheet of Homasote given to me a few years back, I would have been looking at other options for my current layout, because it is hard to find in my area.
Vitto, I think Jay’s idea goes to show you that you can’t go wrong with any method. I think you have to try options and decide for yourself what you like best.
Mark, I concur. But I also wanted the foam board so that I can alter the terrain. For example, making a ditch between the rails or recessing some structures.
@Tranquil Hollow RR posted:Mark, I concur. But I also wanted the foam board so that I can alter the terrain. For example, making a ditch between the rails or recessing some structures.
That is a good point. It is easy to cut ditches, etc.
Thank you to everyone for the comments and insight. After reading the thread from Jeff the Coaster Guy about the decibel levels, I decided that homasote was the way to go. My last layout was on plywood and the noise was very loud. I also took the advice given here and headed to Menards this morning and 4 sheets were enough to cover all areas where the track will not be on an incline/decline. The stuff was a little messy but after listening to others, I was thankful that I cut it on the driveway. I still have to either glue or screw the homasote down, but all the cuts are made and the driveway mess is all cleaned up. All in all, a really good day. Thanks everyone.
Vitto, I’m glad you made a decision and have all the cuts made. This go round, I did not use glue to attach the Homasote to plywood, but used screws. That decision already proved useful in making changes. I do not know if that makes any difference in noise, but I’m happy with it!
The layout is looking great!