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Hi, after briefly getting back into the hobby last year, my wife and I ended up moving. Before the move I got to run a train around our Christmas tree and to build a table before packing everything up. Eight months later we're in our new house and I'm starting to think out what kind of layout I'd want to create.

I have a Lionel Super Chief LionChief set that I've added track and swapped out the included DC transformer with a GW-180. There's one more LionChief on pre-order (44 Tonner  2234100) and I purchased two steam locomotives (Williams Blue Goose  40301 and a MTH Dreyfus 30-1616-1) that should be arriving soon.

My questions pick up where my experience is lacking.

  1. Unless I was to upgrade the Williams to use either ProtoSound or TMCC, will it always be limited to conventional or is there other options? Setting aside issues of availability, upgrade paths for the it would be either ProtoSound (kit from MTH) or TMCC (kit from ERR)?
  2. Until I add a control system for the MTH it would also be limited to conventional. The available support for DCC seems more of an upgrade path for people who already have those systems. As I don't have one there would be no advantage for me to select DCC over DCS correct?
  3. Using the single GW-180 I know I can run at least two LionChief engines independently. I expect it would be impractical to run one LionChief and one conventional at the same time. Is this right, because lowering the voltage to stop a conventional engine would likely cause a LionChief engine to stop as well?
  4. I'm not completely sure how to describe my next question. Other to say if I had two main lines, each with their own transformer. I could run each line in either conventional or in controlled (DCS, Legacy, TMCC, LionChief) independent of what the other line is running under. My question is how would a crossing be set up to allow trains to move between them Would it be as simple as the track between the switches is set up as one or more blocks with SPDT switches? Allowing the block to either be unpowered, powered by the first transformer, or the second?


I know the layout will start with the single GW-180 with one main line and four isolated spurs or sidings. Allowing all four engines on the layout at the same time. And maybe include a yard or second loop to have both LionChief engines simultaneously.

And then "practical" upgrade paths after that I see…

Option one: Adding a second transformer powering a second track

Two independent lines, each with their own transformer, and some number of isolated sidings. This would allow me to run a single engine on each line simultaneously regardless if its LionChief or conventional. And when running a LionChief I could have both running on that line.

Option two: Adding DCS

This would allow me to power the line with the existing GW-180 and run any combination of the two Lionel and one MTH simultaneously, or running just the Williams in conventional. With the added benefit of having a control system that could handle other TMCC or Legacy engines.

Option three: Adding a second transformer and DCS

Two independent lines, each with their own transformer, and some number of isolated sidings. Each line could run either the Williams, now the lone conventional engine, or any combination of the LionChief or DCS engines.

The trade offs between being able to run any of the controlled trains on the same line versus running two of them (conventional or controlled) one two different lines stand out when comparing the options.

Other than the costs, anything else I might want to consider?

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Here's my answers to your questions; I am no expert.

1. TMCC or PS upgrade kits are expensive. Unless you have the skills to do it yourself, I wouldn't recommend upgrading. You could have a local hobby shop or a friend do the work, but it will cost you more money to pay for the upgrade.

2. If you have a DCS loco, use the DCS system. It's easier to set up and use.

3. An LC loco will still run at a lower voltage. If you turn off power to stop a conventional loco, the LC loco will also be shut off.

4. Running 2 tracks is easy. Step 1: phase your transformers; Lionel has a great video on how to do it, and why. Step 2: isolate the 2 tracks from each other by using an insulated center rail. Step 3: power each track from a separate transformer.

Option 1: This is a good start to an upgrade. Plus, MTH DCS locos will run in conventional mode. Once you have everything set up, adding full Command Control (TMCC, Legacy, or DCS) is a piece of cake. Just save some more money and add DCS later on.

Option 2: With your two transformers, you can have both tracks set up to run DCS, or you can still run conventional locos with the transformer handles, even through the DCS TIU. DCS will also run conventional locos through the variable outputs.

Option 3: A combination of Options 1 and 2. I suggest you budget the layout build. Do option 1, then save up to add DCS later on.



Here's a few other suggestions:

-For future expansions, you could add Lionel's new Base-3, Cab-3 App, and/or Cab-1L remote (or a Legacy #990 Set if you can find one).

-Legacy Powermasters and Power Adapter Cables (to connect your GW180s to the LPMs) are required if you want to run conventional locos with Legacy.

-The Base-3 will allow you to run your LC locos with Legacy.

-Have a loop of at least O60 or O72 curves so you can run big engines later on.

-Power your switches (if you are planning to add remote switches) with a fixed accessory power (like the accessory outputs on your GW180.

-Use the accessory outputs to power any accessories.

-An AIU from MTH will allow you to operate accessories and switches from your DCS system.

If you can get a CAB1 setup and add a powe master you're all set. Dylan mentioned this above. I have this setup and love running my postwar and williams via remote control.

This doesn't really address the MTH system, but I know nothing about that. If you have a PS1 locomotive they're not remote capable, only PS2/3. I run my PS1 dreyfus with my CAB1 but lose all sounds.

Last edited by PRRick

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