Where are the Railking Imperial Steam Engines?

No facts to back this up, just speculation. I think there's more demand for low-cost fantasy schemes that circle the Christmas trees seasonally and on the other end of the spectrum for highly-detailed, 1:48 scale engines.  It seems to me that the mid-market that Rail King Imperial and LionChief Plus 2.0 target is the smallest and perhaps even shrinking, much to my chagrin since this is the market I'm committed to.

The Railking Imperial Steam Engines are the one I enjoy buying. For me they have good detail and a great price point. Also I run 0-36 track curves and had no problems with them.

I am patiently waiting for another run on 0-8-0 Railking Imperial locomotives in Pennsylvania RR livery.

MTH recently announced their imperial PRR 2-10-0.  Lots of fantasy schemes included

@Scott R posted:

MTH recently announced their imperial PRR 2-10-0.  Lots of fantasy schemes included

Scott,

I was unaware of the 2-10-0...so I did a search...the fantasy schemes are about as exciting as getting pajamas on x-mas morning! LOL! Thanks for the heads up about the product!

Sunrise

@raising4daughters posted:

No facts to back this up, just speculation. I think there's more demand for low-cost fantasy schemes that circle the Christmas trees seasonally and on the other end of the spectrum for highly-detailed, 1:48 scale engines.  It seems to me that the mid-market that Rail King Imperial and LionChief Plus 2.0 target is the smallest and perhaps even shrinking, much to my chagrin since this is the market I'm committed to.

The LC 2.0 products are way overpriced for what you're getting, The Imperial line could offer so much bang for the buck! Some extra details of the Imperial line with some creativity is long overdue for this MTH fan! Lionel is running the show...the team that they've employed are truly coming up with some fun ideas! The scale ACME tunnel paint tank car, the AEC set are some simple examples! The latest MTH Christmas and Halloween offerings are in my opinion an extremely lazy attempt for a growing section of the hobby! Not saying its all bad...but most if it is meh! There's a reason why Lionel has dedicated so many pages to this segment! They get it! Hoping MTH takes notice. Soon! Thanks for your reply! Only time will tell!!! All the best!

Sunrise

I'm expecting MTH's Railking Imperial models of the USRA 0-6-0 steam switcher to be delivered soon. They've also offered an RK Imperial version of their 2-10-0 Decapod for delivery later this year. I think MTH may have decided that Premier engines have gotten too expensive for many people and therefore believes the market is more promising for their Railking models upgraded to Imperial.

MELGAR

I am looking for New York Central road names or New York, Hartford, New Haven versions

@Sunrise Special posted:

The LC 2.0 products are way overpriced for what you're getting, The Imperial line could offer so much bang for the buck! Some extra details of the Imperial line with some creativity is long overdue for this MTH fan! Lionel is running the show...the team that they've employed are truly coming up with some fun ideas! The scale ACME tunnel paint tank car, the AEC set are some simple examples! The latest MTH Christmas and Halloween offerings are in my opinion an extremely lazy attempt for a growing section of the hobby! Not saying its all bad...but most if it is meh! There's a reason why Lionel has dedicated so many pages to this segment! They get it! Hoping MTH takes notice. Soon! Thanks for your reply! Only time will tell!!! All the best!

Sunrise

In the abstract, LC+2.0 seem overpriced but with no competition from K-Line or Williams/WBB and minimal from MTH, they can price as they want. Also, consider this: Lionel's MSRP on Traditional sized locomotives in 2002 when I got into this hobby was $350 - $450. That equates to $600 - $800 in today's depreciated dollars. LC+2 provides better features than the 20+ y/o TMCC yet is priced about the same (better lighting, 4 chuffs).

I've equated MTH and Lionel as follows:

• Premier = Legacy
• Imperial = Lionmaster
• Rail King (not Imperial) = LionChief Plus 2.0, previously LC+, previously Traditional w/TMCC
• Rugged Rails = LionChief

I agree with you 100% that Rail King provided more bang for the buck, especially the Imperial line. That's why I added DCS and 5 Rail King Imperial engines a year or two before Mike Wolf's retirement. At the time, Rail King was competing with LC+ and I saw no comparison (although I appreciate the simplicity of LC+). I wonder, though, if Rail King Imperial locos were such great bangs for the buck because they didn't generate enough profits.

@raising4daughters posted:

In the abstract, LC+2.0 seem overpriced but with no competition from K-Line or Williams/WBB and minimal from MTH, they can price as they want. Also, consider this: Lionel's MSRP on Traditional sized locomotives in 2002 when I got into this hobby was $350 - $450. That equates to $600 - $800 in today's depreciated dollars. LC+2 provides better features than the 20+ y/o TMCC yet is priced about the same (better lighting, 4 chuffs).

I've equated MTH and Lionel as follows:

• Premier = Legacy
• Imperial = Lionmaster
• Rail King (not Imperial) = LionChief Plus 2.0, previously LC+, previously Traditional w/TMCC
• Rugged Rails = LionChief

I agree with you 100% that Rail King provided more bang for the buck, especially the Imperial line. That's why I added DCS and 5 Rail King Imperial engines a year or two before Mike Wolf's retirement. At the time, Rail King was competing with LC+ and I saw no comparison (although I appreciate the simplicity of LC+). I wonder, though, if Rail King Imperial locos were such great bangs for the buck because they didn't generate enough profits.

The Rugged Rails & Railking get to be a bit of a grey area. I have several Rugged Rails engines that offer way more features than just LionChief.  For example Speed control, fan-driven smoke, 4 chuffs, elctrocouplers, variable smoke output, lighting control, diecast engine shells, better motors, and more sound options.

OTOH, I have some early Railking (non-rugged rails) that were LOCO-Sound equipped and were essentially Lionchief without the direct wireless features & simple command control remote. They still had speed control and fan-driven smoke but simple sound compared to LC as they would only chuff and blow a generic toy-sounding whistle.

I bought many Imperial engines for the very reason you described, the best bang for the buck and they still are when issued.  The last offerings of big boys from MTH & Lionel in Lionmaster/LC2 & Imperial had a difference in price of around $300.

Where does Railking Scale fit into your matrix? Some are not quite as detailed as Imperials and many others are.

Agree with everything you said above @H1000.  It's hard to do a 1 for1 match between Lionel and MTH. Since introducing LC+ and LC, Lionel has been selling 4 different control types: Legacy, LC+2/LC+, LC, and even some conventional. To my knowledge, MTH only sells locomotives with PS3.  While a Rugged Rails or Rail King loco may lack the details of a Premier loco, it still comes with the same advanced command system.

I know that Lionel is producing some locos from former MTH / RailKing tooling.  The RailKing train set 2-8-0 is actually a near scale-sized replica of a PRR H10, albeit with crude running gear and a lot of cast-on detail.

As far as I'm concerned, LionChief Plus 2.0 is very comparable to RailKing operationally, if less detailed.  Since "peak train" circa Y2K, some retrenchment has occurred in our beloved hobby.  With fewer manufacturers and --perhaps-- a shrinking demographic, fewer items are being produced.   Reducing supply and competition will inevitably lead to higher prices.  The good news is there are plenty of new old stock and pre-owned trains available.  If you have the skills or are willing to spend the money, you can upgrade or "cross-grade" between the different manufacturers' control systems, or even go to battery R/C aka Deadrail.

All of that being said, I sense that there's a strategy to "sunset" traditional O gauge, especially the locos that don't conform to a prototype.  For example, "traditional-size" freight cars in prototype road names have been almost absent from the last two catalogs.  If I'm reading the tea leaves correctly, in the future operators with sharp curves will have to choose from scale models of smaller locos like switchers, branch line power, and 40' rolling stock.  My $.02.

@Ted S posted:

I know that Lionel is producing some locos from former MTH / RailKing tooling.

I believe that the recent Lionel Legacy USRA 0-6-0 switcher was produced from tooling originally made by MTH for its Premier version of the model. However, MTH retained its Railking tooling for the USRA 0-6-0 and should be releasing an Imperial version soon. So, apparently, MTH sold the Premier tooling and kept the Railking version. That's why I say that MTH may think the Railking Imperial market is a better place to be than the high-priced Premier.

MELGAR