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I'll try over here as I didn't get alot of traffic on that other board. I picked up a old Z this past weekend. I took it apart and cleaned out all the cobwebs, dust, dead bugs, etc., replaced the cord and rollers and put it back together, kept my fingers crossed and plugged it in. No problems! Turned up all the throttles and took a volt meter to it to see how much juice it throws out, 25 volts like the other 2 that I have, good! Now for the test of checking the C.B., I took a wire and shorted it out at the lugs, man did that thing spark big time. Bigger than I've ever seen before! The C.B. popped pretty quick, then there was a good puff of smoke comming from the C.B. area. I tried this twice with the same results. I haven't taken it apart yet to look at the C.B. to see if I really cooked it or if it's something else. Do you guys think that the C.B. is toast or might it be something else? I plan on replacing the C.B. anyway just to CMA, but want to get some second opinions on what it might be. Thanks
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quote:
Originally posted by Arthur P. Bloom:
Good Lord!!!

Why would you test a circuit breaker by putting a direct short across it? Who taught you to do that?????

There are two things that are necessary for testing electrical apparatus:

Knowledge and common sense.

So tell me Mr. Know it all. How would you test it for operation other than causing a short at the terminal posts? Please, enlighten me as I know of no other way!
I have several documents here that will prove to you that I am a know-it-almost about electricity and electrical controls.

You do not need to make the situation worse by name-calling. It didn't bother me in grade school, and it doesn't bother me now.

If you would look through the archives of the electrical forum, you would find several posts by myself and other people who DO know quite a bit, and to a man, we discourage people who know little about electricity to try dangerous experiments when the science already exists to do it in a way that will not cause your skin to burn off, your eyes to blow up, and your house to burn down.

quote:
Please, enlighten me as I know of no other way!


Now, to your question:

The answer is to put a load (not a short) across the output. The term of art is "load bank" and you can Google it. It can be a variable load, or it can be a load done in steps. The easiest arrangement would be a bank of several 40 watt light bulbs in surface-mount porcelain sockets, fastened to a 1 by 6 board, arranged in parallel, such that you could screw one in at a time, increasing the load. I have one here that I use to test telecommunications power supplies. The load would need to be monitored with both a voltmeter and an ammeter. Using Ohm's law, you would use a voltage of 20 volts (no need to crank the throttle all the way up) to do the math. Power (Watts) equals the product of amps times volts.

Current draw is arithmetically cumulative. A 40 watt lamp at 20 volts will draw around 2 amps. Add 2 amps when you screw in the next lamp. Watch the ammeter and see at what point the circuit breaker opens. Please be advised that this is an extremely primitive and simplistic approach, since lamps rated for 120 volts will not always behave according to strict rules when operated at lower voltages, but the principle is sound for this application. The key is to use an accurate digital ammeter.

Since toy train transformers, especially really old ones, might have components whose tolerance is wacky, I would take the advice of many other of my friends here, and use fuses instead of the 75-year old circuit breaker. Circuit breakers rely upon HEAT (and more importantly, TIME) to operate. In a cold room, with high heat dissipation, a circuit breaker will take longer to clear than in a warm room. There are several other variables, but that is the basic story.

You also need to acquaint yourself with a table of ampacities of copper wire, so that you do not inadvertently cause a test lead to become a fuse. That would also be dangerous and counter-productive.
Well...hard to say if you damaged the circuit breaker. Maybe since it worked after you puffed it the first time. A direct short is a bit drastic. In normal operation we usually trip them with an accidental short, but there are wires, connections, etc. which all add resistance to minimize the danger of damaging the circuit breaker, rollers, etc. You're right to consider a new circuit breaker just to be safe for normal use. Arthur's idea of a load bank is a good one I think for testing since it allows the circuit breaker a little time to heat up and open in a nondestructive way. When I trip the "old" ZW, with a car shorting the track it doesn't smoke...takes about a second to open up Smile.
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