Building a Wreck/Service Train-Progress & Photos!

JoeyA,

Great job. Reminds me of what I saw as a kid when visiting my grandparents house that was across the street from the CNJ main line.

Hey, a question, if you don't mind. It seems that all the O scale Bucyrus-Erie crane models have a full cab for the crane, but just about every picture I've ever seen of a CNJ one looks like the "business end" of the cab is cut back to around where the door is on the model. Any idea if they ever had full cabs, or if they came the way they were often seen from the factory? I've seen (I think in a pic from around 1972) the exposed cab covered by what's probably a canvas tarp. About to start on a similar project of my own (though probably just the crane/tender) and am looking to try and find some details. Just the fact that you have color pics from '54 is amazing! I'm looking to model the South Amboy area from the mid-40's to mid-50's myself...

Wow, this OLD thread has been revived again...I can't believe it's been 6-1/2 years since I first posted this!

Magicland, I'm not aware of any Bucyrus-Erie 150-ton cranes on the CNJ having full cabs like the typical Lionel, MTH, K-Line O-gauge models have.  Maybe some Forum members with more knowledge about B-E 150-ton cranes can chime in regarding the cabs on the real thing.  Were they ALL open?

I fully realized the MTH crane I chose for this project did not have a prototypical cab.  However, this was my very first custom-building/detailing project and I didn't feel I had the skills at that time to cutaway ("open up") the cab and make it look realistic.

Yes, I have also seen photos of real B-E 150-ton cranes that show a tarp covering the open cab area.  I would guess they may have been used, if necessary, during the coldest months of the year.  Maybe someday when I find the time to complete this project I'll take a shot at modeling the exposed cab area.  I suppose if I mess it up I can always cover my mistake with a simulated tarp! 

What would be even better is if one of the manufacturers/importers would offer a model of a more prototypical, highly-detailed B-E 150-ton crane.  I know I'd be a buyer for sure!

Good luck on your project, and please share your progress with us here on the Forum!

Saw this thread a while back when I was considering whether or not to pick one up, and since I finally decided to go through with it, I figured I'd ask. Other than MTH, I don't think I've ever seen pics of one with a full cab, but then they weren't the most photographed of RR items even when they were in regular use. Counting the pics you posted, and discounting the recent Steamtown pics, I've only come across a handful of shots of the CNJ cranes in the wild. I'll have to take a peek inside and see if what's in there can be dolled up for a reasonable display (I know there's a big white gear that needs to be a good bit closer to black, but not sure if I can get it out, do the job, and have it still function afterwards). Not concerned so much about prototypicality (after all, there's a big 3rd rail which somewhat dashes that), but whether the end results will justify the effort to achieve them. 

My Progress so far. Picked up a MTHRRC crane cheap. After a bit of disassembly, I decided it would be possible to remove the end as on the prototype. Only problem was the posts that hold the top and bottom together. One will get mostly hidden behind what looks like an air tank, and the other will be partially obscured by the air brake equipment (or at least that's what it looks like in the photos I've seen).  Lowered the body slightly to bring it closer to the deck. Probably add a few static gears for decoration, and some railings here and there to get it looking a bit more like the prototype, but I'm not counting the rivets. Building #6, but I've only found ONE actual photo of the prototype. Testing logos, etc. for size prior to printing on decal paper. I'll post more once I've gotten a bit further.

OK, made a bit more progress. Going to call this "phase I". More detail will be added in "phase II", including the tie-downs, once I can find some suitable gears and such. The PRR gondola will eventually become a tender. Took some liberties with decal placement, as there aren't a lot of prototype photos available from the period I'm aiming for (mid 40's to mid 50's, late steam, 1st gen diesels). 

Awesome job!  I really like the open cab.  Leaves a lot of room for detailing.

You may have already thought of this, but I'm going to throw it out there anyway.  I suggest replacing the original roller bearing trucks with Bettendorf trucks.  This would fit the time period that you are modeling better. (Actually, I don't ever recall seeing a crane with roller bearing trucks.  At least four wheel trucks.)  I also suggest lowering the ride height. 

I modified a Railking crane a couple of years ago.  I also lowered the cab along with chopping the stack.  It made a toy look like a respectable scale model.

Can't wait to see your progress!

Tom

If I could find the correct trucks with pickups, I'd consider adding a smoke unit. The chimney is over one of the posts that holds the cab on, but I'm sure I could work around that. 

@Magicland posted:

If I could find the correct trucks with pickups, I'd consider adding a smoke unit. The chimney is over one of the posts that holds the cab on, but I'm sure I could work around that. 

Finding the trucks with pick-ups is an easy one, Magicland!  I purchased a pair of friction-bearing (Bettendorf-style) caboose trucks with pick-up rollers directly from MTH to use on my CNJ crane.  I added lights (from Evan Designs) to the front and back of my model—similar to the prototype—that are powered by the rollers and controlled by miniature push-button switches (also from Evan) mounted under the frame.  I've posted a few photos below so you can see what I’m talking about.

Also, there are plenty of photos of CNJ cranes available, but many of them are contained in books, and not available on-line.  One such book is “CNJ/LV Color Guide to Freight and Passenger Equipment” from Morning Sun Books...and another is “Classic Freight Cars-The Series-Volume 5: N.E. Railroad Work Equipment” by Paul Yurko.  Each of these books offer a side view of your CNJ “6”, one on the left and one on the right.  There are more, but those are the first two books that came to my mind.

Keep up the good work...and please keep posting your updates here!

@Tom Densel posted:

I suggest replacing the original roller bearing trucks with Bettendorf trucks.  This would fit the time period that you are modeling better.  I also suggest lowering the ride height. 

I modified a Railking crane a couple of years ago.  I also lowered the cab along with chopping the stack.  It made a toy look like a respectable scale model.

Tom

Really nice job on this, Tom!  I'm definitely going to lower mine someday...that looks so much better.  And I agree regarding swapping out the roller bearing trucks for friction-bearing ones and cutting down the smokestack to achieve a more-prototypical look!

For reference photos, I suggest BIG HOOKS and BIG HOOKS - TWO by Louis A. Marre (Withers Publishing)  These books have a LOT of photos of wreck cranes of different styles and sizes.  (CNJ #6 is actually pictured in its red scheme in book one)  There are many shots showing details of the open cab units.  

Tom

@CNJ #1601 posted:

Finding the trucks with pick-ups is an easy one, Magicland!  I purchased a pair of friction-bearing (Bettendorf-style) caboose trucks with pick-up rollers directly from MTH to use on my CNJ crane.  I added lights (from Evan Designs) to the front and back of my model—similar to the prototype—that are powered by the rollers and controlled by miniature push-button switches (also from Evan) mounted under the frame.  I've posted a few photos below so you can see what I’m talking about.

Picked up what I thought were the trucks you were talking about (got the part number from another post from you on here, DA-0200003). Unfortunately, the coupler arm is about 5/8 of an inch longer than the ones that came on the crane. They seem to be the T-section trucks, not the leaf spring Bettendorfs. I'd be OK with the style, but the length is a non-starter. No idea what to do now...

CNJ 1601...really like your work on the CNJ wreck train. In case you haven't seen, there is a 5 slide set for sale that shows really good color shots of the CNJ crane. One photo even has 2 CNJ cranes 'working' with boom lifted. I have no interest in the auction but thought you would like the shots for added detail to your kit-bash.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/2-Ori...3:g:CpUAAOSwy~JeuChe

Walter/RMT

@Magicland posted:

Picked up what I thought were the trucks you were talking about (got the part number from another post from you on here, DA-0200003). Unfortunately, the coupler arm is about 5/8 of an inch longer than the ones that came on the crane. They seem to be the T-section trucks, not the leaf spring Bettendorfs. I'd be OK with the style, but the length is a non-starter. No idea what to do now...

Magic land, the long-shank (arm) coupler that came with the truck you purchased is due to it being used on a caboose where it needs to be long enough to extend past the end platforms of the caboose.  I used them on my crane, and yes, they stick out too far...but I knew I would eventually replace the lobster claw couplers with Kadees.  Just haven’t had a chance to do it yet!  It was a trade-off at the time to get trucks with pick-up rollers!

As for the “T-section” trucks you purchased, if they’re the ones I’m thinking of, they were originally used on just about all MTH cabooses until they started to improve/upgrade to more-detailed (and more accurate) caboose trucks.  Can you post a picture of the trucks you purchased?  

@CNJ #1601 posted:Yes, I have also seen photos of real B-E 150-ton cranes that show a tarp covering the open cab area.  I would guess they may have been used, if necessary, during the coldest months of the year.  Maybe someday when I find the time to complete this project I'll take a shot at modeling the exposed cab area.  I suppose if I mess it up I can always cover my mistake with a simulated tarp! 

 

FWIW, the tarps were mainly to protect the machinery when the cranes were sitting around waiting for their call to duty.  Steam cranes have running gear similar to a steam locomotive as far as the rods, crosshead, etc. along with all the clutches and gearing for the different functions and they are all rather exposed to the elements.  Since the cranes probably spent most of their "lives" sitting outdoors on standby, it was important to keep that stuff protected so they could be ready for service quickly when needed.

I unfortunately don't have any good photos of our Detroit River Tunnel Co. 120 ton Brownhoist crane with it nice new canvas tarps on it that we had made a couple years back to replace the tattered ones that had been on it for decades.  I did find this picture online showing it with the side covers in place while under Penn Central Ownership.  Aside from what's in this picture, there's also a front panel that covers up the space above the boom to protect the cable spools located in between the side curtains. The operators view is limited as it is without the curtains pulled shut plus they'd interfere with the machinery and the ability to maintain it during operation, so I highly doubt they were ever used while it was operating.

A couple other pictures and a video for reference purposes.  Obviously not CNJ, but the basic concept was pretty similar on many of the different cranes.  These are definitely cool and complex machines!  This one was built in 1914 for service in the railroad tunnel under the Detroit River.  It didn't have an onboard boiler though as it was designed to mainly be powered electrically through the tunnel's third rail system.  It still had steam cylinders and such so that it could also be powered that way using an external source of steam or compressed air, which is how it's operated in recent years for occasional demonstrations.

More or less the view of the operator:

Best photo I have showing some of the outboard mechanical components.

A video of it in action taken by a visitor.

Started working on the detail. Made myself the large gear that sits under the cab of the CNJ cranes. In theory it should clear the cab, but it doesn't feel like the back of the cab is sitting down as low as it did prior, so I'm going to have to see if I can trim the bottom of the cab for clearance. Also came across a bunch of gears that'll come in handy for faking the interior detail. 

What a helpful topic thread! As I need a crane for my CNJ.

Veering off topic just a bit ... did the CNJ own any of the larger, 250-ton cranes? All the photos I see are of the 120-150 ton variety?

Thanks, Jim

@CNJ Jim posted:

What a helpful topic thread! As I need a crane for my CNJ.

Veering off topic just a bit ... did the CNJ own any of the larger, 250-ton cranes? All the photos I see are of the 120-150 ton variety?

Thanks, Jim

Jim…to the best of my knowledge the CNJ never owned any of the larger (250-ton) cranes.  I’ve got quite the collection of books and photos related to the CNJ, and have spent countless hours scouring the web, but nowhere have I ever seen a 250-ton CNJ crane.

Keep up the great work JoeyA. This is a really cool project.

cnj#1601...I have a new/extra MTH RK black CNJ crane if you are interested.

Walter

I’m glad I found this. I’m currently working on my B&M wreck train. Only have one car done so far. So this gives me good motivation. Keep up the good work.