Details on New Lionel SD40's

Mike,

Thanks for the pictures. Planning on ordering the Mopac's and maybe one SP

Joe

Thanks for sharing these details with us, Mike...it is very much appreciated! 

Thanks. Looks like the Conrail unit has the correct signal box detail on the front walkway on the engineers side and no rear e brake wheel on the rear porch.

I preordered 2 Chessie System SD40s and I must say that I'm extremely impressed with Lionel's attention to detail on these 2 particular models (B&O #s 7500 and 7593).

There are subtle differences with these 2 cab #s pertaining to brake cylinder placement on the truck side frames and location of the bell. They nailed it, dead on!

Awesome work!

Looks like I'll have to order one of these.  Love this engine

Thanks Mike Reagan, looks like I will need a CHESSIE SD40 Also. Lionel keeps our interest with all these new innovations. Thanks.

Looks great.....and I like that Lionel wants to share this early info.

I think the SD40 is a great choice even though I'll more than likely not get one....I hope I get to see them on friends layouts!

Thanks for sharing Mike.

So does this mean your Southern Pacific version will also have the L - shaped windsheild on the engineer's side of the cab to represent the as delivered up to early 1980's era?

Thanks Mike. Great to see the details ahead of time. Wow, fixed pilots and pivoting pilots!!! These are going to be a special treat. 

 

Grabbing a BN to head up my work train!

Looking at the catalog, Lionel's Southern Pacific model is of SD40 #7342. Here is a picture of #7342:

 

 

Just to be fair to Lionel, unit #7342 does not have the "L" shaped windows. 

OK but, just what is that awful color on the whole thing???

I haven't seen any pics of SP SD40s with anything but the standard rectangular windshield.

 

I guess be thankful that Lionel is using the paint scheme with the scarlet stripe along the long hood. 

How are the pilots fixed if they pivot? 

 

If they are truly fixed, why no full length railings?

 

"you will also have the ability to permanently fix the pilots to frames for a more prototypical appearance!"

Mike,

 

It is disappointing with the larger diameter curve requirement, my layout has 2 loops of 048 and 3 loops of 036 fast track curves.  So, larger curve radius engines will not work on my layout.  When the new catalog came out my son and I were looking for new engines, but the engines he likes will not work.  He likes the new ES44 in the Norfolk Southern and BNSF road names but we cannot order because of the larger diameter.

My son likes the new style engines that he sees operating, such as the ES44, AC6000, Dash 9.  He was hoping there would be a Canadian Pacific Dash 9 with beaver logo in the new catalog, similar to the Canadian Pacific Grain Train Set from 2004.

 

Please stop catering to a small part of the O Gauge world of trains, if they want their toy trains to operate and look like the real train, then they should buy a real locomotive.  I don't mean to offend anyone but these still are toy trains. 

 

If most of the Legacy engines are Built To Order, then maybe Lionel should offer both styles, pivoting fixed pilots and pivoting pilots similar to the ones on the American Flyer engines to navigate tight curves and look more realistic.  If you polled fellow hobbyists they would prefer 036 curve minimum requirement and you could sell more of these engines.

 

Just my thoughts from the snow bunker in the Metro Boston area.  Thank you

 

 

 

I sure do not remember the SP having a "scarlet stripe along the long hood". Any photos of that styling?

This picture of #7342 is like the one in the catalog.

 

Oh, that thing!  As I recall there were only two units painted like that, and that was for "special helper service" on the New Orleans Worlds Fair Daylight, back in 1984. Those two units were certainly NOT typical of SP freight power.

I have 048 and face the same dilemma. 054 is a diameter for tube track and 048 is a diameter for fast track. It turns out that the way these are measured are different. 054, I believe is outer rail to outer rail while 048 is middle rail to middle rail. The end story is that there is not, I believe, a big difference between 054 tube track and 048 fast track. Please correct if this is wrong. 036 is probably out of luck. 

 

I am taking a $520 risk for the #444 Santa Fe ES44AC. 

As Mr. Reagan said in the interview, Lionel is taking a risk in presenting some un-common schemes. If it sells, they will make more, if it does not then they won't. 

Mike, thank you for sharing this information and for the great cad pictures.  I think it's great that Lionel is providing this information to us prior to these shipping.
I'm very tempted to order one of these. 

Mike - is there talk about bringing this special pilot setup to any of your smaller diesels? Better yet, how about a FP45 in with this setup!

 

"As Mr. Reagan said in the interview, Lionel is taking a risk in presenting some un-common schemes."

 

You know, like the Daylight Cab Forwards.    

 

(If they can do non-existent, they can do uncommon.) 

Does any manufacturer even make a 6-axle locomotive that will navigate an O-36 curve? If they did I'm sure it would look awful funny.

 

There are probably more 3-rail scale enthusiasts than you give credit for.

Lionel's SD40-2, for one, will operate on 0-31, so sayeth Lionel in their catalog. I know they run fine on O-36, and don't look bad doing it.

To the Judge:

 

Lionel made SD40, SD50, SD60, SD60M that will take tight radius curves between the years 1980 and 2000. They are toy trains. They are the toy trains that you want. You just have to look for them on sale at on-line hobby shops and train stores.

 

 

Andrew

I am going to order the GT Grand Trunk Western SD40 pair because there are not too many choices for Grand Trunk Western diesel-electric locomotives.

 

Andrew

Don't forget the SD80MAC! I have a Lionel SD40-2 from 2012 an run on both O-31 and O-36. In my opinion, I don't think it looks too bad on O-31, but it looks better on O-36 for sure.

I'm not a diesel fan and most of my equipment is transition or steam era, so I'm not really a prospective customer for the SD-40.  That being said, I just despise the look of swiveling pilots (always did), and I'm glad to see Lionel building more diesels without them.  Even the iconic postwar FM looked weird with its tiny, flangeless inboard wheels sticking out.  The ES44's are some of the best-looking 3-rail diesels out there, and Lionel needs to build on that momentum.

 

For consideration, I bought 3rd Rail's FP7 because of the fixed pilot on the front.  (Also the single-motor horizontal drive.)  I never intend to switch with this loco; most real RRs didn't either.  Elsewhere on this forum there's a member who has done a TON of work to Lionel's F-units to make them look as good as what I got out of the box.  I think he mentioned making and selling conversion kits.  But that's some way off, and the conversion looks complicated.

 

I have some 4-axle Weaver RS-3's with fixed pilots.  These will negotiate O42 curves, but the first car in the consist has to be an MTH Premier or similar with a sprung, self-centering coupler that swivels independently from its truck.  I never tried body-mounted couplers, and I'm not planning to go down that route.

 

Bottom line: O scale takes up a LOT of room, and a scale, or even near-scale SD-40 is not going to look right on O36 curves.  Some of the modern-era RailKing diesels look like carciatures IMO.  If folks really want a scale loco and are limited to 48" diameter curves, S-scale provides another option.  I love toy trains, especially the "traditional" generic postwar steam engines.  But if this is supposed to be a credible model of a real loco, the swiveling pilot is a glaring (and to my way of thinking, unacceptable) compromise.

I have a LEGACY SD40-2 and just realized that it will take an O-31 curve.

 

My tightest curve is an O-54 (I have one. The rest are O-63, O-72 and O-81.) and my SD40-2 looks kind of funny going around it. It kind of has a scissors-effect with the pilot going one way and the frame going the other.

 

Luckily, I have just one tight curve and it's hidden. It would look plain silly on anything tighter.

I saw the pivoting fixed pilot on an ES44AC, two weeks ago, and must admit that I did like this feature!  

 

The NS ES44AC in the 2015 catalog will likely become my first Legacy engine.  Hope that Lionel offers a B&O (not Chessie) engine in the next catalog.

 

Jim

I'd like to see a B&O, C&O or WM in their original (non-Chessie) colors, especially the latter in speed lettering.

No. 7342 with an somewhat different scheme as well, Daylight U-boats, No. 7399, work caboose, and some other shots of the SDs in Daylight dress.

 

See guys this was exactly what my post was about.  Getting some info before your order.

"The pilots will include mounting holes for scale couplers and you will also have the ability to permanently fix the pilots to frames for a more prototypical appearance!"

 

Now if we could just get them to offer 2 rail wheels the journey to the dark side would be complete...I wonder how hard they would be to 2 rail?

The issue would probably not be the installation of the 2-Rail scale wheel sets, but more about the internal electronics since the Legacy/TMCC system might not lend itself to a simple slide switch for 2-Rail (DC power) or 3-Rail (AV power).

Catnap 

Does any manufacturer even make a 6-axle locomotive that will navigate an O-36 curve? If they did I'm sure it would look awful funny.

 

There are probably more 3-rail scale enthusiasts than you give credit for.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

Williams by Bachmann made or makes a small varriety of 6 axle locomotives; conventionally powered.

Lionel has put Legacy electronics in their S scale engines that can run on AC,DC,DCC,TMCC,or Legacy. So they can do it if they want to. Perhaps some day?

 

Lionel could easily make the same exact models that operate in the same exact space but on 2 rail track. Only the long 3 rail history holds them back. 4 years ago I got into S because I thought they were going to give us Legacy engines on 2 rail track. They did, but then they gave up. I just wonder how long they can keep NOT offering 2 rail? The vast majority of younger modelers that I know are in HO and N. I've asked a lot of them why they don't consider Lionel and they almost always say that they think Lionel makes cool toys, but they can't take 3 rail seriously. As the Boomer generation fades will there still be modelers that want 3 rail trains? We shall see. I never would have thought we would see fixed pilots and Kadees though, so maybe there is hope.