First crack at this...

Six feet is enough for a small, stub-end yard if you put the yard lead off the track on the larger table. Two feet width is excessive, unless you work out some industry switching.

Go look for some ideas in the various micro layout designs (mostly N and HO) and scale them up.
https://www.carendt.com/micro-layout-design-gallery/

If you use fastrack I would suggest 031 switches distance is  3" between tracks. 9" overall outside to outside.  

Most engines and cars will run on 031.

Welcome. I have no suggestions, but like a lot of old timers, I am always happy to see a father getting his children involved. It's really the essence of the hobby. I still remember fondly setting up a layout with my kids.

Before you get too far, search for topics by KEN-OSCALE (Ken Hoganson (sp)).  He is a master at designing interesting layouts.  I started with a 5x9 and altered one of his designs into a 5x13.  The guy is GOOD!!!! 

Check out this site for ideas which can easily be expanded to fit your space:

http://www.thortrains.net/

-Greg

Welcome to the forum. You are certainly in the right spot because there is a wealth of knowledge here. I'm with Will, I just like that you are enjoying this experience with your son. The pic of him is totally priceless. Keep us posted with your progress.

Dave

Who are you kidding; an L, second tier, AND an elevated line 

Welcome 😎

Jushavnfun posted:

If you use fastrack I would suggest 031 switches distance is  3" between tracks. 9" overall outside to outside.  

Most engines and cars will run on 031.

Good tip, thanks! I was looking at O36 switches to keep things consistant but O31 will give me a little more use out of the space I have.

welcome,this is a great place.  One thing I recommend is trying other rail design programs like Scarm or RailModeller pro (not sure if rail modeller pro has a windows version), they have free versions and you can see if you can work with them. I had bought RR track software but I found it hard to use), I ended up being able to work with Railmodeller pro and design the layout. It makes it a lot easier to play around with configurations once you work out how to use them.

The other idea I have is use a piece of graph paper and do a rough sketch of a layout you like (so for example, using 4 boxes=1 foot, you can layout the table alignment easily (a 4x8 would be 16x32 box rectangle), then you can rough in the track using the known sizes of the track pieces (I did this with my layout, for curves I used a simple compass). Once you have a rough design, you can scan it and upload it here and people will give some darn good feedback on it. 

A 4x6 should be big enough for a decent yard, using the kind of track you are talking about, you could also probably have some industrial spurs there outside the yard area, depending on how big you make the yard. I also think using lionchief is a great idea, it is relatively easy to wire it, a lot of lionchief engines will run on O31/O36, and your son will love using it I think. 

Hi Laker80, is this what you are thinking about doing? This is just a 4 by 4 add-on to the 4 by 8.

When using either O31 or O36 Fastrack track switches leaving off the ¼-curve and then mating with (3) ¼-curve pieces shortens the switch and moves the parallel tracks closer together. This is an O36 example:

6⅛ inch center-rail to center-rail :

Here, I made it a 4 by 6 extension. I made better use of the space, and added a passing siding (almost a fiddle yard). I also added uncoupling and operating tracks because that is where the fun will come in on all of those sidings.

AtoZ Lewis posted:

Here, I made it a 4 by 6 extension. I made better use of the space, and added a passing siding (almost a fiddle yard). I also added uncoupling and operating tracks because that is where the fun will come in on all of those sidings.

I like that a lot!

Welcome'... In the start it's best to keep it simple'.  You'll enjoy O36 benefits over O31.  Lew's diagram above is an excellent idea.  You want to keep it interesting and fun for your son, and yourself.  Make it complicated and you'll loose him... As time goes on, you can become more sophisticated... Take a look at you tube O Gauge/O Scale videos, also Pintrest has some great layout shots as well..  Most layouts change constantly under construction, until the right mix is achieved....  

Good luck, have fun, and enjoy your build'.....

Does it matter what type of wire I use to make a bus wire? Will any 16 gauge double wire work? Would that be overkill for a layout this size? 

I added some soundboard and a coat of paint

Would a gw-180 be good for a set up like mine if I added a yard and threw a couple accessories on it? I’d like to futureproof myself a little bit without going overboard and it seems like it would be a good fit.

Quarter Gauger 48 posted:

Welcome'... In the start it's best to keep it simple'.  You'll enjoy O36 benefits over O31.  Lew's diagram above is an excellent idea.  You want to keep it interesting and fun for your son, and yourself.  Make it complicated and you'll loose him... As time goes on, you can become more sophisticated... Take a look at you tube O Gauge/O Scale videos, also Pintrest has some great layout shots as well..  Most layouts change constantly under construction, until the right mix is achieved....  

Good luck, have fun, and enjoy your build'.....

I agree, we want a nice loop with a stop and a yard that I can mess around with when he isn’t playing around on the main line. 

16, 18, 20,  will all work the same.  I have all three and speaker wire, telephone wire, you name it... What you have on hand will work... """. Your track voltage will be 18 to 20 VAC... Your Accessories will be @22VAC max.  (most transformers)... With what you are showing now, I don't think you have to worry about busing... When you expand'... it will be something to consider'....

Welcome to the Forum!  Your layout looks great for your son at this time.

Wire gauge needed depends on distance and amps pulled across it. You want an AWG chart. Found all over the net   Oversized buss wire is o.k. and can be safer too. Look for soft wire too; some insulation is very stiff and a PITA if it needs to bend. The stiff stuff is great for runs, but not so much for pig tailing (drops, accessory power, etc.) 

(You can use multiple wires to equal a larger wire, yes.)

Fuse or breaker(I just say "fuse"; from work lingo... they do the same job) outside the transformer; before the run(s).  Wire size determines max fuse amps that are safe to use. (If the wire is big enough to handle all the transformer power at once, then you can almost skip fusing again. Fuses at that point would be at, and for protection of the individual things you run)

Transformer breakers are not designed to save the track and trains; they save the transformer. (they afford some protection to track, but it's not ideal and coincidence)

I agree with Adriatic.  To protect track and especially trains you need an inline fuse on the hot side and some folks put one in on both hot and ground side of the run to the track.  I also agree with his comments on wire size and stiffness.  You are doing great, Laker80!!

If you are thinking of getting 031 switches, this post was just revived

https://ogrforum.com/topic/49156381160094050

Brendan

I’m playing around with some switches. What type of screws do you folks use to secure them? I couldn’t find anything that small. I used some finish nails to tack them into place while I decide on how best to mount them.

Laker80, I know this might be a bit overly complex, but I had a go at seeing at what I could fit. Minimum curve O36. This layout gives you four ways to operate it:

1. Simple Continuous loop on the left-hand side, possibly with a second engine working the yard

2. Inverted Figure 8, going around the outside, straight opposite the yard, and through the crossing

3. Reverse Loops, going by the yard, turning opposite of it, through the lead track, turning left before the crossing and back

4. Going wherever just for fun 

Links in case Pictures didn't imbed/show: 3D, 2D, Parts List

So I got some additional material to make my expansion and I am playing with layout ideas. 

This is what I can up with. Extending the loop so the kids can run it simply and I'll have room to add terrain and structures but adding some switches for dad to have fun with. I cant seem to get the loop to connect. I messed with adding different length track but nothing seems to gel. Am I missing something? I'll try again after some coffee.

Is there anyway to fix or fudge this gap?

Hi Laker80, just another tip, especially when working with AnyRail or SCARM drawings, you will get faster answers if you include the drawing file in your post. I recreated your drawing in AnyRail, but I haven't upgraded my v6 license so I had to use the flex track trick to get under the piece limit. Mine came closer than yours, but it is still showing a small overlap. In my experience that type of overlap will work in the real world.

Thanks Mike! 
I got the bench for the addition started today. I just need to slap the side on and stain it and I’ll be good to start adding track.

Would I be able to get by with this small gap and a few overlaps? I am trying to narrow down reasonable options before I pull the trigger on a track order.

You can usually strain the track a bit to get them to fit.  What kind of track are you going to use.

Or cut a piece of track to fit. (the "brown" one??)

Screwed down, the FT "click" together aspect isn't important. As long as the rails align and don't move, you are golden.  (not FT, but I have a few 1-pin track joints, and one 0-pin joint).  (trim the non-pin end to avoid having to pull any pins )

@Mark Boyce posted:

You can usually strain the track a bit to get them to fit.  What kind of track are you going to use.

I am using fastrack. How much of a strain is normally allowed before its an issue? Is there a generally tolerance or does it vary?

@Adriatic posted:

Or cut a piece of track to fit. (the "brown" one??)

Screwed down, the FT "click" together aspect isn't important. As long as the rails align and don't move, you are golden.  (not FT, but I have a few 1-pin track joints, and one 0-pin joint).  (trim the non-pin end to avoid having to pull any pins )

So cut the pins and secure the two track ends together?

Screws:  #4 X 3/4" Flat Head Phillips.  These are generally not available at a big-box store (Lowe's, Home Depot etc.) but you can find them at a local hardware store.  Or online.  I used a foam track bed under my Fastrack, and I had to go to 1/4 X 1" screws.

@Mike Wyatt posted:

Screws:  #4 X 3/4" Flat Head Phillips.  These are generally not available at a big-box store (Lowe's, Home Depot etc.) but you can find them at a local hardware store.  Or online.  I used a foam track bed under my Fastrack, and I had to go to 1/4 X 1" screws.

Ok thanks for the screw size. I planned on screwing everything down once I get the additional layout set because the kids tend to dislodge anything that isn’t fastened down.
I have the layout on soundboard now but I have foam insulation underneath because I didn’t know which one I would like more. I like the texture of the soundboard and it feels more rugged but it did start to bow up at the corners after I painted it. I set some weights on the ends and it seemed to cure most of the issue. If not, I can always flip it over and put the foam on top.

@Laker80 posted:

Ok thanks for the screw size. I planned on screwing everything down once I get the additional layout set because the kids tend to dislodge anything that isn’t fastened down.
I have the layout on soundboard now but I have foam insulation underneath because I didn’t know which one I would like more. I like the texture of the soundboard and it feels more rugged but it did start to bow up at the corners after I painted it. I set some weights on the ends and it seemed to cure most of the issue. If not, I can always flip it over and put the foam on top.

Any foam board will warp if painted, especially using a water-based paint.  You can minimize the warping or eliminate it by always painting BOTH sides. 

A closed-cell foam, cork, or PVC track bed will not warp and will give you sound-deadening qualities.  I used

"O" Scale Gray Sound Foam Track Roadbed" from an e-Bay vendor.  A 30" pieces is about $1 a foot.  It is grey in color, easy to work with etc.  But the Woodland Scenics  "Track Bed" (PVC foam) is more readily available, and also works well.   

First of all, were I doing this layout with RRTrack, I would measure the gap. If it is less than 1/4", you can usually squeeze things together. Otherwise, I would be looking at 1.75" or 1.375" fitter pieces. If necessary, drop a piece of 10" and replace it with a 5", 4.5", and then a fitter to get the gap to close.

@Laker80 posted:

I am using fastrack. How much of a strain is normally allowed before its an issue? Is there a generally tolerance or does it vary?

@Gilly@N&W posted:

First of all, were I doing this layout with RRTrack, I would measure the gap. If it is less than 1/4", you can usually squeeze things together. Otherwise, I would be looking at 1.75" or 1.375" fitter pieces. If necessary, drop a piece of 10" and replace it with a 5", 4.5", and then a fitter to get the gap to close.

Laker80, I have done exactly what Gilly suggests with Fastrack.  Follow his advice, and you should be good to go!!  

If you're talking about screwing the black FT controllers down, I use small 3/4" long roundhead brass standard slot screws from Lowes. They give a nice contrast to the black controllers. Also, the controllers "snap" together sideways to help keep them in line.

Also, you want to be careful about screwing down the FT, especially the switches, and not overtightening them. The way the FT snaps and stays together, I only lightly screw down the track about every three sections.