Goodbye theater, hello layout.

For whatever reason, the Gargraves sectional track doesn't always some in exactly on size like most other sectional track does.  I've heard from more than one source that the Gargraves sectional curves aren't always "exactly" the same length, which would certainly explain the issue.  I know that the Ross O72 sectional curves I have, Atlas sectional track, and any Fastrack track I've used in Anyrail come in spot-on to the plan.

Of course, unless you go to considerable lengths to make the flex track EXACTLY as you represent in Anyrail (or any other track layout package), that won't match up exactly as well.  Personally, I can't see how anyone lays flex to be EXACTLY like what you represent in in a layout package, but I'll bet it's a PITA to do if it's possible!  I just try to get it close and leave it at that.

Thanks for the reply.

I think part of the beauty of my somewhat neurotic plan is knowing and accepting going in that it will not be exact and having the ability to change it on the fly.

@RSJB18 posted:

It takes a brave soul to keep a Big Boy on the layout during construction.

You are making good progress so far David.

Bob

Thats the way I feel about running trains on any elevated track.... yeah, EVEN the little Marx 400... the train I named TIMEX "Takes a licking, keeps on ticking.....".

Beautiful, Simply beautiful!! (someday.........) Looks soooo smoooooth, and NEW!  lol

----(wait, What!!!?? No Carpet?)----> haha

Had to stay in Louisiana an extra day due to an emergency breakdown on a SW1 in Columbus Mississippi on Tuesday which pushed end of lease inspections back one day. Anyways, home at last and put a few hours in on the layout today.

Before I left I ordered a MTH double track bridge that I fell in love with and spent most of the trip deciding where to put it. I had a few ideas but needed to see it all in person to really decide. On to the funny part of the story...

Now I’ve never met this man, nor heard his voice, but somewhat like a ghost or knowledgeable entity, I kept faintly hearing Gunrunnerjohns voice saying “big boy”, and “mine put a hole in a tunnel”, and from another forum topic “it will remodel a coach car at will”. So I proceed to “kind of” listen and put the bridge where I think it looks good and cut a small section of a O86 Ross curve to lead into the 4 inches of straight before the bridge. Looks great and looks like plenty of clearance. I look over my shoulder as I swear I can hear him laughing from the kitchen. Instead of my typical power up test run for clearance, I decide to slowly push the big boy into position. Again he snickers as I can’t quite figure out how this monster of a locomotive has absolutely zero chance of making it on the bridge. However, being determined I’m good, I push it closer only to find out it will make it just fine as long as I take a sawzall and cut the entire top off of the bridge! Well that’s not going to happen so I tear it all back apart and start over.

This is where the beauty of flex track comes in because I made a much shallower approach with a curve of enormous radius and not only does it look better, but the big boy is nearly completely straightened out before it gets to the bridge. Used my longest passenger car down below and after probably an hour of tweaking and adjusting, I’m pretty happy with how it lays. I did not at all want the bridge just on a straight section and squared off to the room. Not sure why, but that was important to me visually. Currently none of it is hard wired or permanently fastened (as usual with my style of building) but you get the idea of how it will be. Was going to try 2% grade on the north side but won’t have room for the reversing switch if I do so I stuck with 3%.

P.S. if it’s preferred not to insert images full size please let me know.

The same logic works for turntables!

Love your Big Boy story had to do the same to my little Big Boy (RailKing) going through a tunnel and had the same problem with an MTH bridge - too short an approach.  Geeze - it worked for my little engines - why not the articulated - duh.  This is a great hobby, we can make mistakes, we fix them and nobody hassles us for it. 

@ScoutingDad posted:

Geeze - it worked for my little engines - why not the articulated - duh.  This is a great hobby, we can make mistakes, we fix them and nobody hassles us for it.

Well, the wheels make it through, it's just getting that darned boiler to jump over the obstructions!

Oh, Be Still My Heart, the Heart wants what the heart wants. 'Beautiful BRIDGE".

(And GunrunnerJohn sez: "THATS what you got out of all the Layout work?")

got to stay in my n00b-skilz-set....

Not sure if I should be proud or ashamed of the fact that I worked an honest 14 hours on this thing today. Probably won’t be able to walk tomorrow.

Building the crossover was interesting. Trying to align 6 pins at once with two hands and one eye was fun. Bought some nifty terminal blocks off of Amazon that worked surprisingly well. Still have more wire management to do though.

Took a small break this afternoon and built a dedicated camera car as well.

Quick question. the two loops will be isolated and on their own channel but should the neutral from each loop share a common connection? I’ve read numerous articles and can’t come up with a correct answer. If so, should they be common at each terminal block or just at the TIU? I have drops and terminal blocks every 10 or so feet and all wires are soldered to the rail. The 14awg surround sound speaker wire from the old theater came in quite handy and I have plenty of it.

This corner will be redone.

I'm running all the neutral lines back to a common set of terminal blocks where my forest of transformers, TIU, and several SC2 controllers will be mounted.  For DCS, IMO, the best way is to have a separate neutral from the tracks and join them at the common junction.  The 3.27mhz DCS signal treats the wiring & track as an RF transmission line, and keeping the two sides of the signal path a similar length should be the optimal method.  That's not to say that tons of people that have just made all the neutral lines common all over don't run DCS just fine, I know a number of people that have wired that way.   I'm just being extra careful as I only want to wire this sucker once!

To be clear, all the neutrals should join at some point, my opinion is it's best at the output of the TIU at a common connection point.  In order to run TMCC/Legacy, it's mandatory that all the neutrals be common at some point.

Thank you.

You made a lot of progress during that 14 hours David!!

@Mark Boyce posted:

You made a lot of progress during that 14 hours David!!

Was a long exhausting day but I loved it.

Nice work David. Very neat. Good for troubleshooting.

John

So the Western and Southern portions are physically built and wired (except for the yard, but the lead is in). Starting along the northern wall and starting to think...

Originally I wanted this only around the walls and to leave the center open as to not crowd the room. The room has no other purpose though so I'm not sure why that was important at the time. Maybe to make this seem less evasive or permanent? I'm not sure. Anyways, I lay in bed at night and follow the track in my mind and the basic L got boring fairly quick so I added the eastern downturn. I still like that quite a bit as there can be trains on 3 sides of you but tonight I started thinking about this. I like the concept, but not sure how crazy I am about the gigantic 8x10 or whatever island in the middle of the room. Would be a great place for a turntable or shop, but there would be 4 foot reach to the center from either side and a hole in the middle would negate any advantage having this island or peninsula gives.

Would love to hear insight, thoughts, or suggestions.

Turntable tossed in for visual...

David, FWIW, I had the same thoughts, and suddenly to my wondering eyes did appear...

In case you're wondering, I think it's a great idea.   This gives me more places to park motive power, and adds interest to the operations.  Since there was a service loop around the area, I added two lead tracks so I can drive out going in either direction just by picking which lead track I exit on.

One comment, your lead track has a problem, a curve that close to the TT will be trouble.  Note that my lead tracks have at least 20 inches of straight track onto the TT, and the TT is only a 24" model.  You probably need at least 18-20" of straight track leading onto the TT in order for the locomotive to be lined up well enough not to hit the bridge/railings.  With a 24" bridge on the TT, I made my longest whisker tracks 30", I figure I can swing about a 27" overall length locomotive(24" wheelbase), so having more track in the whisker seemed pointless.  A larger TT would have been cool, but this will satisfy my TT itch.

@DoubleDAZ posted:

Since you only have a single reversing loop, you’ll then be going clockwise with no way to reverse back other than backing through the loop.

I read this part of the comment but at the time (what was that? 3 years ago it seems, lol) I didn’t give it as much thought as it deserves. This is on the verge of a critical oversight on my part. I have no issue backing into the yard but with only one reversing loop things will suck pretty quickly. I really need to search for somewhere to add another.

thank you very much.

@gunrunnerjohn posted:

David, FWIW, I had the same thoughts, and suddenly to my wondering eyes did appear...

In case you're wondering, I think it's a great idea.   This gives me more places to park motive power, and adds interest to the operations.  Since there was a service loop around the area, I added two lead tracks so I can drive out going in either direction just by picking which lead track I exit on.

One comment, your lead track has a problem, a curve that close to the TT will be trouble.  Note that my lead tracks have at least 20 inches of straight track onto the TT, and the TT is only a 24" model.  You probably need at least 18-20" of straight track leading onto the TT in order for the locomotive to be lined up well enough not to hit the bridge/railings.  With a 24" bridge on the TT, I made my longest whisker tracks 30", I figure I can swing about a 27" overall length locomotive(24" wheelbase), so having more track in the whisker seemed pointless.  A larger TT would have been cool, but this will satisfy my TT itch.

I agree completely and honestly just threw it in there for concept purposes. Will for sure find a way to straighten the approach lead if I go this route. Thanks.

TT 20” to the left would be an easy cure.

I think if you go for the TT, you'll be glad you did.  It's a cool accessory, and it also gives you a ton of parking for locomotives.   Besides, people just expect a TT on a train layout, right?

@gunrunnerjohn posted:

I think if you go for the TT, you'll be glad you did.  It's a cool accessory, and it also gives you a ton of parking for locomotives.   Besides, people just expect a TT on a train layout, right?

I think it’s a must have. I was on the fence until I saw yours.

bought a MP15AC that was delivered today and actually had fun switching a few cars around on the “completed” section. Wired in a programming track (switch to switch in the passing siding) so as to not have to remove any other locos to get it going. I love the “chess” aspect of it all, as in having to think numerous moves ahead to get something where you want it. After all, we can’t just pick the locos up in the real world when we want them somewhere else.

This has been a very fulfilling adventure so far and I thank all of you for the support.

Dave’s, if you pursue the peninsula for a turntable or just antra run time, you might add another crossover to give you that 2nd reversing loop.

@DoubleDAZ posted:

Dave’s, if you pursue the peninsula for a turntable or just antra run time, you might add another crossover to give you that 2nd reversing loop.

Yea, that area is about the only one that makes sense. Although I'm somewhat back and forth on it now as having just one would just require more strategy in operation. Final decision will be made when I get to that section probably.

Defiantly find a way to keep the turntable in the design.  John is right, about us expecting a turntable on a layout.  I would love to have more room if for only one other thing would be to add a turntable and roundhouse.  We work with what we have, but in your case, you have the room.

Worked today until I ran out of wood and track. Got the crossover in, the northeast corner, and started on the peninsula. Spent a little more on nicer wood this time and boy am I kicking myself for not using it from the beginning.

Also just ordered the atlas 6999 turntable for 225 from Trainworld. Kind of seemed too good to be true but we shall see I guess.

I used Baltic Birch multiply for my benchwork, and I never regretted the extra few dollars for good decking, a good choice.  The 11 ply 1/2" sheets are very rigid, and made the job considerably easier than using low grade plywood.

David, you have really accomplished a lot on the layout!  I noticed how you laid the cork roadbed for switches and like it!  I learned how to do it from old Kalmbach books back in the late '60s and have done that method ever since, including the roadbed and track I just finished this past fall.  They had you run the edge of the cork along the diverging route, then slice it at angles at the switch frog.  I always found it awkward and as I get older, I find it more awkward.  Mike looks bad until I cover it with ballast.  Are you going to slice away the extra cork to keep it parallel to the tie ends on the diverging rail?  That would be much easier than the method I have always used.

@Mark Boyce posted:

David, you have really accomplished a lot on the layout!  I noticed how you laid the cork roadbed for switches and like it!  I learned how to do it from old Kalmbach books back in the late '60s and have done that method ever since, including the roadbed and track I just finished this past fall.  They had you run the edge of the cork along the diverging route, then slice it at angles at the switch frog.  I always found it awkward and as I get older, I find it more awkward.  Mike looks bad until I cover it with ballast.  Are you going to slice away the extra cork to keep it parallel to the tie ends on the diverging rail?  That would be much easier than the method I have always used.

I’m not entirely sure what I’ll do in the end with the switches. I knew I wanted cork down for sound but I haven’t decided the final roadbed setup.

David, best to leave it alone until you decide!  I sometimes make cuts that I regret later.  It's like the old barber who cut my hair when I was growing up used to say, "I can cut more off, but I can't put it back on".

Peninsula is done other than the triangle pieces that will go in the corners to “round” it. I knew it was going to be big but holy cow, it’s basically taken over now as the main part of the layout!

I'm using the foam roadbed, and there's a lot of extra around the switches right now.  I've slowly been going around and trimming, but there's still more to do.  I waited until all the track was down to start cleaning that up.  Like Mark says, you can cut it off, but it's harder to cut it on.

Turntables take up a lot of space.

Having a little trouble with the second reversing loop and have a question. How bad is it for the normal flow of traffic to be through a switch? The second loop becomes quite a bit easier if I can put a switch in a curve and let normal traffic flow through the switch when thrown instead of through the straight section. (As a railroader you would think I would know these terms). If it’s not advised then I will probably go without the second reversing loop.

@David K. Simpson posted:

Having a little trouble with the second reversing loop and have a question. How bad is it for the normal flow of traffic to be through a switch? The second loop becomes quite a bit easier if I can put a switch in a curve and let normal traffic flow through the switch when thrown instead of through the straight section. (As a railroader you would think I would know these terms). If it’s not advised then I will probably go without the second reversing loop.

When you think about it, if you have any capability of ever getting the train off the mainline onto a branch line or siding, it has to go through a switch, right?   I have several curved switches on my mainline in the normal flow of traffic.  AAMOF, I have two double-slip switches, several curves, and three straight sections on my normal mainline.  As long as the switches aren't causing an issue, it's pretty normal to have at least several of them on your mainline.

@gunrunnerjohn posted:

When you think about it, if you have any capability of ever getting the train off the mainline onto a branch line or siding, it has to go through a switch, right?   I have several curved switches on my mainline in the normal flow of traffic.  AAMOF, I have two double-slip switches, several curves, and three straight sections on my normal mainline.  As long as the switches aren't causing an issue, it's pretty normal to have at least several of them on your mainline.

Good to hear. This is basically where I'm at with it. Benchwork is built and just need 1 more switch and a bunch more track to make it happen. Track is quite hard to come by right now though. Spent the week in Houston and couldn't even find any there. May have to hand bend the rest of the curves. The long extension off of the turntable is to park the Big Boy. I know I can never spin it, but it will at least have a place to park. Let me know if you see any huge mistakes. Thanks.

Might move the turntable lead up a little which may let me add a small yard below it. Would be fun to transfer cars from one yard to the other I think.

can’t figure out how to draw the table in anyrail.

Cool that you could fit the long track in for the the larger engine.  I have two turntable leads, but the opposite whisker track didn't have enough length for anything huge, I was hoping to be able to park a couple of large engines as well.  I'm going to go a different way and create some parking for large steam on the other end of my layout off one of the inner tracks by adding a switch or two.