Here Comes the GP7 and GP9 from Third Rail

I need to know if these will be phase III geeps with the 3 48" fans or the blaze,blaze, 4/5 36" fans.

I suppose there are at least two dimensions to the interest here... the technically focused will worry about the physical characteristics of each unit on a given railroad. And rightfully so!

Another group consists of those starved for quality models from a given railroad. I'm in that group, delighted to see proposals for BAR and GT. I've reserved.

So if this is an election rather than an order, I've voted. Bring them on!

Jan

I placed my CNJ GP7 preorder and I hope more people do the same to secure the production run.

It's too early for me to place an order, without configurations and paint schemes!!!

Any chance for a late era NYC cigar band paint scheme?  No new die work as that is already shown in C&NW and SP&S.  Paint work can't get much simpler.

NHVRYGray posted:

Any chance for a late era NYC cigar band paint scheme?  No new die work as that is already shown in C&NW and SP&S.  Paint work can't get much simpler.

Email Scott,

He's open to it if he gets enough reservations.

FYI,

Drawings for the different road names are beginning to populate the reservation page.

I have sent an email to Scott asking if he will make proper Redbirds.

I have too, but, your photo has several mistakes!!! And, you need to quit promoting it!

The number boards being the most glaring. Should be black background w/white numbers. Background of logo should be black and a separate sheetmetal logo on each end.

L & N posted:

I have sent an email to Scott asking if he will make proper Redbirds.

Don't know where you came up with that photo but, it is definitely NOT a correct N&W passenger "Red Bird" GP9. Maybe that is a photo of the "fake unit" at the North Carolina Transportation Museum, in Spencer, NC. 

If Sunset/3rd Rail does indeed offer the N&W passenger service GP9, i.e. a "Red Bird", they better do it correctly, and NOT looking like that photo!

I have received a note from Scott that he has added the N&W ""Red Bird" passenger GP9 to the list. 

I would politely ask that you do not post those photos of INCORRECTLY restored passenger GP9's. You could be creating a problem in that the unknowing will start believing the mistakes are real!

There are photos for most of the railroads

Still no images for the ROCK ISLAND GP7 and GP9.

There are many paint schemes possible for the ROCK ISLAND GP7 and GP9.

How is the choice going to be narrowed down? 

Andrew

Non-powered units?

Here is a link to a great image of THE ROCK or Rock Island GP7 diesel locomotives after 1975.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/hunter1828/7321839766

Andrew

One month later and the rest of the GP7 and GP9 photos have yet to be filled in. I hope that does not cause a problem.

Andrew

I had asked Scott to consider doing the Maine Central in Harvest Gold and Green and sent him a photo to post. He said he would. This was shortly before York and I saw him there. He had not had a chance to post it yet but he did say that Norm, from Norm's O Scale had put in a sizeable order for them in the Green scheme. Atlas had already done that version. I also saw Norm at York and discussed with him about the order. Norm said he was undecided on the color? I have since seen that Scott has now posted a picture of the MEC GP7 in the maroon scheme? I also got an email from Norm asking if I wanted to reserve on of those. I told him yes.

I also emailed Scott (twice in fact, including photos) asking him to consider adding the Jersey Central’s as-delivered dual-stripe “toothpaste” paint scheme, but so far I’ve received no response.  

I’ve been patiently waiting to purchase my first Third Rail locomotive as up to this point they haven’t offered a diesel model and road name combo that fit my interests.  Finally the GP7 in CNJ!!  I so badly want to join the ranks of all the Third Rail locomotive owners out there, but I definitely don’t want to settle for the solid green (no stripe) CNJ version currently pictured on their website.

I’m sure Scott is a very busy guy, so I’ll gladly accept the advice from anyone with experience in successfully communicating with him on the best way to do so.  So far email hasn’t worked...for me at least.  Fingers crossed he will consider my recommendation!

Any time frame for these yet?  I would guess late 2020 or early 2021.  I may want to jump on board with either NYC or B&M.

CNJ #1601 posted:

I also emailed Scott (twice in fact, including photos) asking him to consider adding the Jersey Central’s as-delivered dual-stripe “toothpaste” paint scheme, but so far I’ve received no response.  

I’ve been patiently waiting to purchase my first Third Rail locomotive as to this point they haven’t offered a diesel model and road name combo that fit my interests.  Finally the GP7 in CNJ!!  I so badly want to join the ranks of all you Third Rail locomotive owners, but I definitely don’t want to settle for the solid green (no stripe) CNJ version currently pictured on their website.

I’m sure Scott is a very busy guy, so I’ll gladly accept the advice from anyone with experience in successfully communicating with him on the best way to do so.  So far email hasn’t worked...for me at least.  Fingers crossed he will consider my recommendation!

I completely agree. I think I ever put in my order for two CNJ GP7s before the art work was posted on the website. The CNJ GP7s had a unique look compared to many GP7 locomotives from other roads. I also haven't bought a 3rd rail locomotive before but I am excited by this one, both because of the chance to capture unique details and because look of the previous SD9 that was made. I might even order more CNJ or maybe NKP but I want to know more details first.

Some of the railroads do not have images above them to show the specific GP7 and GP9 version and paint scheme chosen. 

Is that because nobody has sent any opinions or images to Scott? 

Andrew

Hello Scott:

A very big YES for the CNJ GP-7 version with yellow stripes, long hood train lighting box, short hood high mounted bell, 'frog eye' marker lights with red/orange/yellow lenses and smoke deflectors mounted on roof each side of cab roof.

Most importantly from historic perspective...suggest use roadnumber 1526 this is original CNJ GP-7 as delivered roadnumber (and has NOT been made in this number by Atlas or MTH or Williams). After 1958 Newark Bay Bridge accident 1526 was rebuilt by EMD with new roadnumber...1526 became 1531. However had major bodystyle changes including moving roof mounted bell to long hood end and was then classified as GP-9M so do not do 1531. 

Additional 'vacant' CNJ roadnumber models are: 1520, 1527 and possibly 1528.

Run both roadnumbers. 

Thanks.

Walter M. Matuch

PS: Many times in my youth I actually ran many of the CNJ GP-7s when I rode along on CNJ's passenger runs...my uncle and grandfather were CNJ men and later I was one too!

Nice, but the copy says they run on O72 switches minimum (the way I interpret it).  That means they won't run on many of our layouts.   

According to the illustration shown the C&NW or Chicago & North Western GP9 diesel locomotive it will have the 1980 to 1990 Zito era "Safety Yellow" paint scheme. The road number are not shown on the side. The font of road numbers changed in the middle of 1980.

1980 to 1990 is the era paint scheme that I prefer for C&NW since the ATLAS O CNW Trainman bay-window and extended-vision cabooses are both in "Safety Yellow".

I am not yet sure if that is the case and the real paint color used will be the 1970's original yellow.

Andrew

Third Rail SD 7 or 9 a few years ago.  Click on the link.  Note that the wheel flanges are small, IMO.  This design is not a two vertical can drive.  A horizontal motor with belt drive to the fuel tank and drive shafts, to the front and rear truck.  O72 limit may be related to this drive shaft arrangement, there is a limit to the drive shaft bend, IMO.  ???If Third Rail uses the SD model design for the GP model???.  

I don't see the Reading RR represented, that's a significant omission, Reading had a number of GP7's.

Sunset 3rdRail has opted to put single motor drives in their diesel models.     I have quite a few and they ran great.    I still have some, and have sold some models with 2 vertical motor drives.    I personally do not like them.     Mine never run as smoothly as the single motor drive models I have - even the old ones from the 80s.      The most noticable thing is that they do not start and stop smoothly.    One motor always seems to start or stop before the other, and the loco gives a jerk as the second catches up.   The vertical motor drives have the gears along one side of the truck.    On the examples I have, the truck sideframes stick out way too far.    They are out as far as the sides of the body.    On real locos, the trucks are tucked in underneath.    Remember a real loco is about 10 feet wide and the track is only 4'   8 1/2 inches, so the wheels and sideframes are under the loco not out at the sides.

Another personal issue for me, is that the two motor units run way too fast.    They seem to be more like slot cars than locos.    I like my stuff to run slower, which the single motor drives with step down gearing do quite well.    Two motor drives could probably be geared differently to run slower, but the market does not seem to care.

Mike CT,

I agree. The drive train universal joints can tolerate a limited amount of  misalignment. I think that running on reduced-radius curves, like the O-54 on my smaller layout, may cause increased wear on the U-joints and induce higher stresses in the input/output driveshafts. One reason I haven't ordered a Sunset/3rd Rail GP-7/9 is that I interpret the website to say that the locomotive can negotiate O-54 curves but needs O-72 on the turnouts. If that's the case, it's not really operable on O-54 for me. Some clarification in this regard would be helpful.

MELGAR

Being able to handle 054 curves but not turnouts does not make sense.    Scott Mann (Sunset) answers questions readily.    although he is a business person, not an expert modeler, so he may not know.    but I suggest send an email and ask.   Reservations are still open.

After an e-mail reply from Scott Mann and a search for a photo, it looks like the C&NW GP9 will be in the 1970's Original Yellow scheme.

Andrew

Sunset/3rd Rail website says this about the GP7/9 models:

3R (O-54 simple curves, O-72 turnouts and switches)

MELGAR

@gunrunnerjohn posted:

I don't see the Reading RR represented, that's a significant omission, Reading had a number of GP7's.

I see a Reading GP7 shown on the 3rd Rail website.  It’s an illustration, not an actual photo.  I’m not a Reading fan, but it appears to be painted in what I’m guessing was the “as-delivered“ paint scheme...sort of a Pullman Green body color with gold or yellow lettering.

So it is, I glossed right over it.  Not the colors I was looking for...