how to pick a good Z transformer?

Are you talking a Z or a ZW?  If you're talking about the Z, one basic test I'd do.  Make sure all four knobs move smoothly with no binding.  Since it's unlikely you can open it up, the only other thing is the cord and the general condition of the case and base.  If you have a way to plug it in with some kind of load, make sure all the outputs work and the voltages vary properly.

Check the operation of the control knobs. Lionel "Z" and "V" transformers have fiber gears on the voltage control shafts, which turn the contact arms. Sometimes those gears get chewed up. I am uncertain how readily available replacement gears are. At one time they were hard to find, but I have seen them around more recently.

This page from the Lionel Service manual, provided by Olsen's, shows the gears / mechanism.

chck condition, movement of control knobs, condition of power

cord. And lastly don't pay more than $100.

Ive seen them at shows over the past 5-10 yrs for $100 or less.

If you find one that's taged as $125-$150, offer $100.

thanks i will look carefully.  thanks for all of your input.   

The type Z by Lionel is very difficult to look inside, not like a ZW that you can take four screws out and lift the top to see the roller wheels.

The Z is nice for output voltage but has no whistle lever, most are rated around 250 watts.

To test one for voltages take a portable multimeter with you. You can buy one at Harbor Freight for close to $10.00.

Lee Fritz

Lee i pick up a multimeter at harbor freight for free today.  i had the coupon.  i am going to bring that one with me to the show.  

OK traindork,

if you are coming to the Syracuse show

a week from sat. when you find a "Z".

ask the seller if you can bring it to my

trainboard and Ill test it for you.

If you buy one, Ill give it the once over

for you at the show.

Thanks, see you at the show,

Malcolm (Popi)

IMO; spend a few more bucks and get a ZW. 4 screws and you can see the inside. The only problem that is not practical to fix is if the winding is gouged from having used with a worn out/ missing rollers.

  Most of the time a new rollers ( 4 total but one always seems to be worn the most) ,and maybe a new power cord. Occasionally  new whistle rectifiers and a crk breaker or the terminals may be loose.

  All of these are readily available and not very expensive.  Don

Traindork,

find me when you come to the show.

Ive got a dealer friend that thinks he may

have just what your looking for.

I can get it cleaned up for you, if it needs it

and have it up and running trains on my board.

thanks

Malcolm (Popi)

I helped a buddy of mine buy a ZW at a Greenburg show a few years back. We armed ourselves with a screwdriver, flashlight and pocked multimeter. We chose our target and asked the vendor if we could take it over to an outlet and check it out. We checked overall condition, burned bulbs, bad line cord, loose posts, smooth arm movement, roller condition, any scores on widings, voltage output.

The vendor was a little unhappy with us for pulling the hood off to look inside, but we made a deal and brought it home.

most dealers are willing to let you chck out their merchandise.

I have learned that if a dealer gives you hard time for

"looking under the hood", it's time to move on and find another dealer.

ZWs are very prevalent at shows and you can usually find anything

you want if you look hard enough.

In the toy train market there are lots of "games" in town.

You are the guy that  I would want to take transformer shopping with me. I might have asked the dealer to pull the hood, however. If he was unwilling then I'd just move on. I think a seller as a right to be somewhat concerned about somebody disassembling his merchandise. Experience has probably taught him that most people are not as competent as you. In this case, all is well that ends well.

popi i will be at the syracuse train show.  i am interested in the transformer you had mentioned that your friend has.  just would like to know the price of the Z that your friend has.  

worse case scenario,

a dealer should at least let you have

someone at the show test your purchase

on their train board. I have done that

many many times. hooked up transformers

to my tracks and run trains for potential buyers.

and in doing so, I have gotten deals from

dealers that are friends.

I scratch his back.........................!!

The dealers keep me in trains and up and running

at shows, and I help them sell merchandise, buy testing

for future buyers.

Ill let you know if my buddy has a Z.

and Ill get a good price for you.

he is a fair man.

Just for reference, I found some pics of the internals on line for those that are unfamiliar.

I currently have 3 Z's picked up for between $25 and $50 each, but I had no issues replacing rollers, cords, and binding posts.

They really are great transformers and allow a 2343 F3, for example, to really haul the mail

thanks very much popi.  

In my 35+ years experience, Other than whats already been posted, the extension arms that mount the pilot lamps are subject to zinc rot and warpage. Sometimes why the red/green caps don't fit is the #51 bulbs readily now are Chinese made and don't fit the same as USA made bulbs, they sit too high and the caps pop off. Use USA made bulbs in this application.

 Another note is the bottom rollers are hardly looked at, as it is difficult to reach. The only way to access them is through the bottom of the case, and the circuit breaker wires must be unsoldered, along with a couple others. Few people go through this trouble to replace the bottom rollers. Just a few notes of wisdom.

Good point Chuck!

Chuck is 100% correct about the Chinese #51 bulbs being oversize. However, often the caps won't even go over the smaller, correct bulbs, or the fit in the holes is so sloppy they won't lock in place. I had a conversation about this with a parts supplier the other day - he recounted an episode several years ago when he had a brand new Z in the box, never used, and the original caps didn't fit. He's thinking of getting a batch of custom ones made that will lock into the holes properly and maybe even fit over the Chinese bulbs. I encouraged him to go ahead, but I don't know if the market would really justify the cost of having a casting like this custom made. 

Dennis: What are the plumbing washers in the first photo for? I've rebuilt a couple of Z's, don't recall ever seeing plumbing washers. 

popi just a question on the floorplans map what are you put under?  i know you when i see you but i still would like to know what name you are under  

http://www.cnynrhs.org/Train_F...oorplan_10-18-13.pdf

try this roadmap.

Im under "Walker Model Railroad"

top right hand corner.

named my train board after my father-in-law.

He got me started in O gauge Lionels years ago.

He died in July of this year. I miss him terrible.

the plumbing washer just looks like

a cushion bumper of sorts.

or it could be to stop leaks!!

It is not 'original equipment'....probably added so the top would sit a little higher so the bulbs can clear the lens if a repo 6 volt bulb is used, that sit a little too high.

popi have you had a chance to talk to your friend who has the Z??

if he's got one, he will bring it.

look me up and if we have it, it will

be tested and ready to go.

otherwise, we will need to look for another

at the show.

If that happens, don't pay/buy until you come get

me and Ill talk with the dealer to see if we can

take it over to my board and put it up on the deck and test

it.

The Z is a great transformer for powering lights, accessories and running trains in a conventional manner only.  Please note S.W Hiawatha's  post wherein the writer stated that the Z puts out 24 volts.  The transformer should not be used to power TMCC through a Powermaster or with only a Command Base.  TMCC operationally is based on a power supply with a maximum output of 18-20 volts.  That is the operational range of the ZW.  While I can't cite a specific reference, I do recall several publications specifically imploring operators in the early days of TMCC, to never use a Z to power their TMCC systems.

Everything Goody says is correct, and good advice. I actually do run my Lionel Standard Gauge Hiawatha, which has TMCC, with the Z on our museum layout. I put a voltmeter on the rails, get 19 volts (the smoke unit causes a one-volt drop), and then inform the other members that anyone who touches that throttle will be killed on the spot. It's worked fine so far. 

Another solution is to glue a stop in place to keep the throttle from going too high. I have done this with one of the accessory taps on the Z, which I use to power the switches in the yard. I've got it blocked at 14 volts, and the stop is held in place with silicone so I can remove it easily if I ever want to. 

For years I used a "Z" transformer, mounted underneath my train table, to power lights and accessories. I liked being able to set the voltages as I liked. Since it was a two train layout that left the "ZW" transformers inner controls for the switches and uncoupling tracks  (switches on one, uncoupling tracks on the other)
As I usually do, each output, A through D had it's own postwar Lionel #91 electromagnetic circuit breaker, just in case