Marx 1590 Metal Switches

Can you post a photo of your switch? It sounds somewhat different from what I describe here. I think the indicator lenses are an added variation which mine don't have.

I'm using some metal Marx switches but I modified them and don't use the original solenoid switching mechanisms. The wiring is basic: center terminal is common for both solenoids, the outer terminals throw the switch points one direction or the other. They do not have a built-in non-derailing feature like some Lionel switches.

Unfortunately they do not have provision for manual throw either. The throw mechanism has a locking feature to keep the switch-points from drifting around, providing the solenoid moves to the end of its intended travel. 

These switches are not convenient to service because they are assembled with bent metal tabs. Over time they may get gummed up inside and the switch-points may not move all the way. The solenoids could burn out if someone applies power for too long. The pivoting switch-points rely on contacts to switch power to the movable rails to correspond to running rail or center rail according to which way the switch is thrown. If the contacts get messed up, the movable rails don't get power.

If your switch doesn't work properly when you apply power to the correct terminals, you need to take it apart for troubleshooting. I just leave the cover plates off the bottom of the switch assembly. Use your one switch as a learning exercise. Old switches may be problematic. If you can get them for cheap and don't mind servicing them, they will work well enough. When everything is in order they have the advantage of continuous electrical contact on all rails through the switch - no plastic rails, no plastic frogs.

Ace, it looks like this.

I think Ace gave you a pretty good description of the switches. I think your swivel rails were moving because they were positioned between the points that lock them in place switch the solenoids. Once you apply power to the switch, it may be working properly.

I use the manual version of those on my tiny Marx layout because the remote switches can't be thrown manually. I also like the switch stands they have:

J White

For what I plan on using them for, the manual versions would work fine and I'd probably be better off. Do the manual versions work well? Are there any issues with engines with roller pickups?

Mike, I have some metal manual Marx switches like this and they work well after cleaning and adjustment. Look out for weak or broken handles and targets, bent or binding linkage, etc. I had to adjust the contacts at the leading end of the swiveling switch-points. I modified one for power routing, so a siding doesn't need a separate electrical block switch. I haven't had issues with center-rail rollers snagging but you'll have to try your own equipment to check them out.

In the next photo, if you look closely, you can see where I added rail pins or solid copper wire in rail ends facing the swiveling rails, to help bridge the gaps for center rail pickups. These were electric switches I cut down for a yard ladder, now operated manually. I replaced the switch-points pivot-rivet with a machine screw and locking nut snugged up just enough to hold the points in place, but I can move the points easily with my fingers so I didn't need any additional manual throw linkage.

Marx also had plastic manual switches as in next photo, with sprung frog pieces that press down to accommodate fat wheels. These have more plastic rail sections and some Lionel equipment derails on the diverging route because they don't have guard rails to help steer the wheel-sets through the frog. Not recommended.

Regarding the switch you described in your original post, the indicator lenses can probably be removed if they are problematic.

I've had some of the manuals, and the remotes, and both work fine with my Marx and Lionels.

I have that plastic one, and on of the manual Marx ones. Never knew what they were til today

  Even my Marx derail on the plastic ones. Maybe its just the pre-war styles that do derail, but I find them "useless".

Lionel uncoupling tracks are also a fat wheel issue.

Though limited by placement,  a fat wheel kept only to the outside straight of  Lionel turnouts will allow one direction looping  (forgot arrow) with Marx tin.

(MS paint/ SCARM)

Well, this layout will be small. I have some fat wheel Marx, some fat wheel Lionel prewar, as well as postwar and modern trains. I would like to be able to run them all on this layout, It sounds like the best switch for me to attempt this would be the old Marx metal switches. I think I will look for the manual versions.

My Marx even like my Lionel 1121 switches.

I was originally thinking of 1121/1024 switches. I've had issues with these losing electrical contact and E-units dropping into neutral going over the switch. Never found a good fix for that.

I also have some 1024s, and no problems with those either.

Lionel 1024 switches look cool but the switch-points are all plastic. Some 4-wheel locos may lose electrical contact, especially if they have a traction tire, or if they are moving slowly. This is why I find the all-metal Marx switches preferable for some O27 applications. The metal Marx switches have essentially no center-rail gap through the switch, either.

When I was a kid of about eight my best friend and I had Lionel Trains. We both had 027 engines and cars. I had a pair of Lionel 027 switches but he had a pair of Marx. His always worked and locked in better than mine. Sometimes mine wouldn't go all the way to the stop and the train would derail. His seemed to always work right. Don

my Marx 666,999, and my Lionel 2-4-2s all have no problem with the 1024s

If you remove the lenses, do not throw them away. they have the same dimpled inside as the Marx steam locos and the lenses have not been reproduced.

   I remembered an old post here, suggested to me at one time, for making the plastic ones useful by adding a guide rail. (I  think it was you Royboy )

 I spotted a fairly rare set of Sakai turnouts on "that one auction site" that might let a fat wheel pass(?). I have a 90° Sakai crossing that works well (but it must have an O ring placed over the round center for Lionel's with rollers, to stop "roller dive" dead stops and "pole-vaulting". Shoe locos, W/fat wheel, no problem. 

I don't have one, but I cant think of a reason for the lenses to flip unless they were painted green/red at one time, green=straight, red=deviation.(Do just the side lenses flip?)

    Are there any bulb mounts?  (I've seen a lighted one, red bulb?) .

    I think I would simply attempt to fix the flipping lenses in place, convex curve out, with a micro-dab of hot glue on an inside edge.(small dab to not foul the lens, and so it doesn't drip from bulb heat). Fairly easy for future historians to remove when that's the last one around (It can often just be "rubbed off"if not deep in a crack)   Since it doesn't seem to be the most numerous version of the turnout, why mess with removal if operation isn't an issue.

  I've noticed multi-dimpled lenses before on locos, but thought it was on the convex side. Are they the same lenses? Glass or plastic?

I took the cover off today to investigate the lens issue. Two were laying inside the housing, the third popped out. They are supposed to sit in a ring housing that is secured to the cover with two bent over tabs. I tried to put one back in, but as soon as you touch the lens from the outside, it pops back into the housing. Interestingly, they won't pop back in from inside the housing. You have to remove the housing rings to get them back in. I will look for some glue to hold them in their housing rings.

Heat the tabs with a soldering iron first to lower chances of breaking them. ("anneal" them with heat)

But if they came out, they can go back. Finding the angle is the trick.

Mike Donahue posted:

For what I plan on using them for, the manual versions would work fine and I'd probably be better off. Do the manual versions work well? Are there any issues with engines with roller pickups?

I had two Marx manual switches as a part of my childhood Lionel 027 Christmas layout, from 1952 through about 1963.  Never gave the Lionel any problems at all.

I still have the Marx manual switches -- and I buy more whenever I can find them -- to use on my Marx layout.  They work fine.  Only problems I ever encounter are with the contacts, which are sometimes dirty on switches that haven't been used for a couple of decades.  Squirting them with contact cleaner and working them back and forth gets them working eventually.

I have one plastic Marx O34 electric turnout in use. The wider radius is an advantage. To make it more reliable I added a guard rail (as previously mentioned) for the diverging route. I also super-glued the sprung parts of the frog which allow fat wheels to pass. I'm not running any fat wheel locos, and the fixed frogs work better for other equipment. I've done the same mods on one plastic Marx manual O27 switch.

On my secondhand 1590 switches some of the contacts were messed up from rough handling, but they can be repaired and adjusted with some patience.

Some old tinplate cars may derail in turnouts because they have very sloppy wheel gauge, often too narrow. Sometimes I fit slit plastic drinking straws on the car axles between the wheels, to help maintain better wheel gauge.

Bought a good looking pair of Marx manual metal manual switches off the bay today. Waiting for them to show up so I can check them out. Do the pivot rails lock on these, too? Anything I need to know that hasn't already been discussed?

Will need two pair. There was another pair on the bay that looked pretty nice, but I felt $35.00 plus $24.00 shipping was too much, so I passed on those.

yeah you really have to watch the shipping costs nowadays.

Mike Donahue posted:

Bought a good looking pair of Marx manual metal manual switches off the bay today. Waiting for them to show up so I can check them out. Do the pivot rails lock on these, too?...

Yes, the manual throw mechanism takes care of that.

Hello my friends, I also use the Marx manual switches on my small 4x8 layout. I find they work the best for me for Marx Trains. I always buy them when see them at Train shows and also Ebay too. To me they are very easy to clean and fix for you small layout. Thanks longbow57ca.

A good operating Marx 1590 switch should lock in straight or curve.  This keeps them from staying somewhere between curve and straight and that will derail wheels.  When one activates the switch it should snap in one direction or the other and stay there.

I have 28 Marx 1590 switches on 30 year old plus layout.  I have had to repair only one or two in all these years.  Repair is possible by grinding out two or three rivits and opening them.  The metal tabs on the solenoid cover can be bent out to get the cover off.  Often only a little oil on the slide lever is needed. 

The all metal 1590 is the best and the Marx plastic switches with plastic frogs are the pits. 

I got most of my 1590s for $5 a pair or less.  You may have to pay $15 or more for Lionel.  One guy gave me box full at a train show for free after I asked for them at train shows.  I paid the postage.  Ask at train shows or train meets if you have them around you.  They are out there but most do not think much of them.

 Charlie

I admit I once turned my nose up at them. Live and learn, eh?

(I still like the electrics best though )