Switches on grades

    Chooch From what I have read on the OGR forum they say that you should keep the switches level. Choo Choo Kenny

The problem with a switch on a grade is that the track turning out is going to be tilted as it is going sideways on the grade.  The problem is how to get the turn out track level again.  The more the grade, the bigger this problem becomes.  If there is room, it might be better to drop the grade where the switch is, then the turn out track will be level.  It the turn out track is going to return parallel to the main track, maybe no problem at all.

Thanks Kenny, that is what the scarm software requires also, and it makes perfect sense when the diverging track changes grade.  Thank you too David your answer would be exactly correct in that same situation. In that situation where the diverging track changes grade is it enough to just have the switch stop the climb or should the track be level both before and after the switch? 

 

The second scenario involves both the original track and the diverging track continuing the same grade on parallel courses. On this grade, unlike a bank, is there a problem. The amount of grade would be just over one quarter inch per foot, almost level. These changes would occur in the middle of a long climb.

From my experience switches on grades are  BAD NEWS.

This is based on 50+ years of trying,,,,,,, something is always derailing.

 

I had fun trying though.

 

Rod

In general, as NROD alluded to, turnouts on grades is a bad idea. That said, the turnout and a sufficient section (about 12 inches each) of the approaches need to be in the same plane. This means no twisting of the turnout area. This will prevent trains from derailing on the turnout. Any changes in grade need to be eased onto the approaches to make thing smooth as Tom Tee alluded to.

 

We have a turnout with a grade on one of the legs on the club layout (Ross #8 curved turnout). The turnout (which is pretty large) is level and the graded track has a very soft transition from level into a 1.5% grade. It's part of a more complex turnout arrangement which includes a crossover from the secondary main (on the left at the grade crossing) to the primary for access to the yard. The grade descends on the far right. While everything is in the same plane, we had to adjust it slightly because of a slight kink in the secondary main approaching the crossover turnout. The whole thing works with scale-wheeled equipment, which was the ultimate test.

 

 

tmb train club had a few switches on inclines however our grades were 1% and all curves were minimum 6ft radius. these switches  were feeding sidings so it was always slow going when turning out. Our new layout has all switches on level surface

Steve

Good evening

I put my main line crossovers on grade, works just like level does. Now a curved turnout that is super elevated needs some work but can be done. I also have a #6 turnout on the level but the diverging route drops down into a industrial area. That works also, however it is gradual.

 

Clem k

Thank you all Dave, Rod, Matt, Steve, and Clem, I imagine between you there may be a couple of hundred years experience so I really appreciate your advice.

 

Sorry for the late reply, it was a very busy weekend,and then. I have been working on some, no, on a  lot of changes in the layout I have been trying to design since reading your replies.

 

I have a 155" section of track that is almost straight in the switching section, it includes three ross 11 degree wye switches. If I use the rule of a level section both before, after, and including the switch I will be left with only about a 10" section out of a 98.6 " piece of that track that I could grade. Hardly worth the effort and the carpentry would be a nightmare anyway. I am using the scarm software and it doesn't include the ross 4 way yard switch that might be able to solve some of the problems. Alas, I will have to buy the RRTRACK software next week.

 

In trying to come up with a fix I have tried to create a very slight continuous grade, 1.6%, and try to run the switches on the grade with the turnouts returning to parallel courses. Although I am trying to make this fit, the last thing I want to find out that I was wrong after spending a lot of money on the track. So a great big collective "NO DON'T DO IT" wont bother me. Just the same I have included a graphic and would like your feedback. Thanks, Rich 

 

 

We have a few switches on a grade, including cross overs.

Good to hear from you Laid off sick, I watched the building of your layout and enjoyed it very much, great work. I have only had one switch on a grade before, and it worked just fine, it was an 036 fastrack switch near the top of a hill, on a reversing loop. I understand the concept here though, and everybody seems pretty much of the same mind so I guess it's pretty easy to get into trouble with the practice. Can you tell me about your experience with switches on grades, size of turnout, amount of grade and what preceeds, and follows the turnout area?

I wanted to post a graphic of what I have in mind , but I am having trouble figuring out how to attach a file and a graphic. Once I get that figured out I'll post my plan.

Thanks for posting. Rich 

Attached is a proposed plan for running some switches on a constant 1.6% grade, all turnouts will immediately return to a parallel course until attaining a level grade and then resume their course. I would appreciate any feedback from any member that has, or has had switches on grades, and those who tried but were not able to accomplish it without derailments etc. Please view the attached and let me know what you think. thanks, Rich

You can see the cross overs and switches circled in red, all of which are on a grade.

 

The cross overs, on the left, top and bottom are both Ross Regular 11 degree turnouts. They make it possible to go from Main 1 to Main 2 and vice versa.

 

The other 2 switches on the bottom create a reverse loop across the bridge. Normal position for those to turnouts is through the curve. Straight send you through the bridge. 080 for both of those, and that bridge grade is pretty steep but only a few feet in length.

 

We don't have any problems with them so I would say, as long as your track work is good.... you shouldn't have any issues either.

Thanks Laid off sick, Now I'm going to have to back and take another peek at your video to see them in action, and it is always nice to look at that video. Thanks again, Rich

I dont remember which one, but 1 of the videos shows a steam engine going through the cross over on the front left side of the layout. One of the videos showing the NKP ES44 going through the turnouts leading to the bridge in the front of the layout as well.