Water Level Route Basement Layout

Just curious, what do the inner fenders go to?

The 2" extruded  Blue or pink foam is a great choice, strong quiet, and easy to do scenery, both above and below the table surface.  Avoid nails and screws, and use a compatible adhesive, ( I use tacky clue ) to secure my roadbed and track until you ballast, it which will hold all you track in place .  For seams and blending scenery , I use  Red Devel light weight spackling compound, clean and effective as a replacement for plaster , use latex paint and your good to go

Mike,

I'm excited to see your layout come together. I too am loosely modeling the NYC with a 4-track mainline. I'm trying to squeeze it in to a 24x14 with yards and a roundhouse.

I've been told too much track, not enough interest. Nevertheless, I'm going to have a shot at it. For all the looks I will be sacrificing, seeing four steam trains of the NYCRR past, operating in opposite directions at different speeds and 4 inches apart will be worth it.

I wish you luck and will be paying attention to your progress. I am currently on pause. My train-room is occupied by a friend who lost their home. I hope to resume when my 1st. Ross order arrives in 3 weeks.

kevin

Will a 072 curve fit in that corner next to the closet?  Extruded foam is great for scenery but I would recommend that you use something more substantial like plywood and homasote under the track, and I would also recommend 16" centered cross members to support whatever you use.

You may want to paint your background walls now while it's easier, otherwise looks like a fun layout !

Rich in SD

@Mike R posted:

Hi Guys,

As some of you may know I started building a layout in my basement. I originally posted in the "What did you do on your layout today?" forum. I've always had floor layouts and a few small table top layouts. This one is going in the basement around the walls. It's going to be a pretty good size, U shaped measuring 19 x 22 x 12. I'll be using Gargraves track and Ross switches.

Here's some pictures of the benchwork going together and a track plan. The layout will be loosely based on the NYC Water Level Route with the 4 track mainline in Upstate New York. If you have any thoughts or comments I would definitely appreciate the input. I'm also thinking of using 2" foam board for the tabletop instead of plywood. What do you guys think about that? Nothing set in stone yet, just putting that out there.

Thanks,

Mike R

IMO, this is a very nice layout design, which I recall seeing in OGR or CTT magazine many years ago. Very nice design for a switching and an around the walls layout.

My current layout has some features in common with it.

Arnold

Hi Mike,

I really like the way you designed it, keep us updated with your progress.

Alex

This looks great. If I ever have the space I would like to build something similar. You might want to consider adding another double crossover between track 2 and 3 (starting from wall).  If you have that you will be able to reverse trains in both directions.

Not a comment on the track plan, that looks great, more about the sump pump.  As someone who has had basement issues in the past make sure you leave easy access to that hole in case you need to have that system serviced.  I have had my pumps replaced multiple times due to iron in the ground water clogging them up.

Mike, It's a nice plan and construction so far looks nice and sturdy.  I agree with Rich, in that I would pain the walls or put in a backdrop above the layout before progressing very far.  I can speak from experience, it would be much easier to do that early on than waiting.

I have to agree with an earlier comment; in fact, I would recommend you ask the local building inspector, or a local contractor who is familiar with your community building codes, to take a look at your "plan."  It would be terrible to build a nice layout, have something go wrong in the house, and then have the local building codes prevent a repair until the offending layout part is removed because it is too close to the sump pump, or the gas line, or whatever!

Chuck

Congrats on your progress.  I second the suggestions regarding painting and sump pump access.

I like your plan; however, it looks like you will have some reach issues at the return loops since you only have access from two adjacent sides of the benchwork.  Reaching more than about 24" gets difficult, especially when doing delicate work or working around fragile items.

Although I understand the origin of the name, I'm not sure I'd be comfortable calling a basement layout the "water level route". 

Concur with Jim's recommendation for another crossover to allow reversing at both ends.  The blue line is my thought.

This is just a suggestion based on my likes.  I don't mind if you throw it out.  You are limited to O-63 on the inner loop because of the area by the closet.  I have a lot of engines that require O-72, so to maximize running these engines, I would increase the radius of the curves on the other side to O-72 and O-80, and add the two crossovers (red) to run those engines on the outer loop for that short run.  You will not be able to run these large engines unattended on both loops, but it will allow you to have two on the mainlines.

Having 4 engines pass each other sounds awesome! 

2 comments

- with all the track - do you have enough storage track? The one yard looks like it won't hold many cars. Unless you plan to do shelf display of your rolling stock

- consider pulling the layout away from the wall to provide space for scenery - hills, trees, industries, etc.  Due to space limitations my track is inches away from 3 walls - wish I had more space for all that extra detail. 

Regarding the track plan, for those who have the room, it can be extended so that the middle section is longer, which is what I did with my current layout.

Ideally, a long middle section can be such that the trains go somewhere else, out of sight, maybe through a tunnel into a different room, and then return.

My preference is to have the trains go to a different place, like real trains do.

Arnold

I thought this was going to be a “tongue in cheek “ post that your basement got flooded or something along those lines. Glad it wasn’t. BTW, looks like a nice layout.

Steve

Hi Guys,

I've been away a few days. I can't believe the response. Thank you so much for all the suggestions everyone.

Harley Rider the inner fenders are for my 57 Chevy I'm building.

Dave Koehelr thanks for your opinion on foam. I'll take it into consideration. I'm not really sure what to do. LOL!

Fast Mail (Kevin) I agree completely! Thanks for the words of encouragement!

Turkey Hollow RR (Dan) I'm using 24' on center studs. The frame is all 2x4 construction and it's screwed into the cement block.  I think it'll be plenty strong. The minimum radius is 0-72 on the mainline and I probably will go with plywood table top.

Trestleking Rich, Mark Boyce,  I agree but I hate to paint. LOL!

Arnold I don't think I've ever seen that layout you are referencing. I made that up on RailModeller Pro for Mac. Also sounds like a great idea unfortunately the walls are cement block so the trains have to stay in the basement. LOL!

Alex M Thanks pal! You know I will.

Tanner111 (Jim J) This is the first time I ever really had the room for a layout so it's nice. I'm thinking about adding another crossover like you suggested.

Jetsalfi, PRR1950 (Chuck), Thanks for the advice. there's plenty of room for sump pump repair or replacement. Also I'm planning on putting a couple of pop out hatches so I cold get to the water main for the sprinkler system. The water meter is also easily accessible from under the layout.

Mallard4468 I'm planning on having a few pop out hatches to get to those hard to reach areas. I get it about the name but it hadn't occurred to me.LOL! Now I think it's funny thanks to you!

CapPilot (Ron) thanks for the suggestions. The track plan is in flux. I like your ideas and may incorporate some of them, thanks.

ScoutingDad I know that's my only dilemma. I might eventually add a peninsula in the center for a big yard or just storage shelves under the layout.

RidetheRails (Steve) Like I said to Mallard I didn't think of that, but now I think it's funny!

I hope I answered all your questions and thank you so much for all the suggestions. Keep'em coming.

Mike R

Mike, that’s an excellent answer about painting.  As we all say, it’s your railroad!

Mark,

I might actually use preprinted backdrops.

Mike R

Hi guys,

Heres a couple of pictures of the 12 x 8 foot side. Just starting to frame it out. It’s really a big area. The new frame is 10 x 8 with the 32” section it’s actually 12’ 8” from the back wall and 8’ 3” wide. I made it a little bigger than the diagram.  I’m definitely going to need a couple of pop out sections in there.

Mike R

@Mike R posted:

Arnold I don't think I've ever seen that layout you are referencing. I made that up on RailModeller Pro for Mac. Also sounds like a great idea unfortunately the walls are cement block so the trains have to stay in the basement. LOL!

Mike R

Mike, cement walls doesn't stop us, that's what dynamite is for.

LOL, just kidding, Arnold

@Mike R posted:

Mark,

I might actually use preprinted backdrops.

Mike R

That is actually a great option.  I have one of a power station that I want to incorporate into my painted backdrop.

Those pesky support posts!  On the other hand, the house would come falling in on the layout if they weren't there! 

24" centers with 2x4s can work with at least 1/2 plywood on top. Add a couple of legs in the middle and you could probably climb all over it.

If you are thinking of using a backdrop I can recommend Backdrop Warehouse with no hesitation. He is a little tricky to get in touch with but his backdrops are amazing. If you think you may go this way for treating the walls I suggest putting up furring strips to attach hardboard to the walls, then attach the backdrop to the hardboard.

Arnold that’s hysterical! I’ll blow up the foundation so I could get a few more feet of track. A 2x4 should suffice supporting the house. Lol!

Mark Boyce that’s what I like about them. No muss no fuss. Just put them up and it looks great. I’m no artist. Lol! As far as the lolly columns  go it is what it is.

Turkey Hollow (Dan) it’ll be strong enough for a dance floor when I get done with it. Lol! As far as the back drops go thanks for the recommendation. I couldn’t remember the name of the company. I like the idea of furring strips. I was thinking of mounting some of them on MDF and hanging a few from the ceiling so I could get to the pipes and sprinkler system control box.

Thanks guys!

Mike R

Looks great. Remember getting under it as you age can be an issue. Do not over extend reach. That’s All..

Rich

Mike, here's the backdrop I mentioned.  I don't remember who I bought it from. 

Hi guys,

I couldn’t help myself today. I laid a couple of pieces of plywood and some track on the framework. Then put one of my late father’s engines on it just to dream a little. Lol!

Mike R

BigboyRich I’ll have a few pop out hatches for the hard to reach areas. The table will be roughly 45” off the floor so there’s plenty of room to get underneath the layout.

Mark Boyce that’s exactly what I’m thinking. They look great.

Mike R

Magnificent!!!!! Thank you for sharing. This is so cool!

Great photo of a treasured train…. At 76 if I go under a 45 inch table just call 911. After three fusions, the last one has failed, I would never get out. That is the issue I am having with wiring my lights…Ahhhh to be 45 again…..Let’s see at 45 I was working as a Park Ranger at LBHBF in Montana……Leading Wilderness hikes at Badlands NP.. Now I have issues getting out of the recliner in time to pee.

Take advantage of every day……

Rich

Mike, Wow those pictures look great !

I just finished up the same engine today with , ERR AC commander , ERR steams sounds.

Hi Guy's

I finally finished the last section of framework. So I thought I'd post a picture.

Now I'm going to start preliminary wiring than start laying plywood.

Thanks for looking guy's.

Mike R

Looking good.

What a great start! I have been away from the hobby for most of the past year or so, with only intermediate tinkering on my layout, and Mike G's post gives me some great incentive to get back on track, so to speak.

Regarding backdrop scenery: I highly concur with those who recommend tackling that element at this point. Here's how I did it on my Happy Valley RR.

Since you have basement walls, I recommend screwing 1/8 inch hardboard over the concrete. It's relatively cheap, gives a smooth surface, and can easily be radiused around the corners for a seamless look (far more "natural" than a harsh joint where the walls meet). Start in the corners with full 8-foot sheets (lengthwise, ripped to whatever height you decide to use) so that you don't wind up with a seam in the middle of a curve. You can also partially screen the window with the hardboard. Paint your own Adirondack Mountains or use commercial backdrops, either of which will be much easier to apply to hardboard than to concrete.  Hardboard that is already primed on one side is quite slick, and joints and screw holes are easily covered with painter's putty.

From personal experience, you might even consider backing the benchwork from the walls (if it can be unscrewed) to avoid constantly crawling over or under it while working on the backdrop.

Best of luck! I look forward to following your progress.

I made a glorious attempt at painting a scenery landscape on my wall."Then we moved so I took photos, had them enlarged and put them on my new wall to Styrofoam." Chimney Rock in Nebraska, a wagon train landmark in days of yore…

Hi Guy’s,

Thanks Dave. I hope it comes out good. Lol!

Bruce that looks great. I’ll definitely look into that. Thanks.

Rich that was a great idea. Looks terrific.

Thanks,

Mike R

Nicely done!

Looking forward to the next set of pics!

Peter

@Bigboyrich posted:

Great photo of a treasured train…. At 76 if I go under a 45 inch table just call 911. After three fusions, the last one has failed, I would never get out. That is the issue I am having with wiring my lights…Ahhhh to be 45 again…..Let’s see at 45 I was working as a Park Ranger at LBHBF in Montana……Leading Wilderness hikes at Badlands NP.. Now I have issues getting out of the recliner in time to pee.

Take advantage of every day……

Rich

Mike,

I am 58 and have two corners of my layout that are 5' away from the inside edge. It is a major headache trying to work on stuff in those corners. If you are building your forever layout you might want to cut out a 2'x4' section of the 9' bench (where it joins the wall benchwork) so you can walk to the far corner. When I was in my 40's duck unders, pop-outs, crawling on top of the layout, etc did not bother me. At 58 I can see exactly what Bigboyrich is saying and 100% agree (most of the guys here that are "seasoned" will agree) . It is better to take the time now and plan for the day when you are an old f@rt running trains with the grandkids.

Hi Mike- just catching up on your build. I like the theme and what you're doing so far.

A general rule of thumb is to allow 3' clear access to any utilities. The National Electrical Code mandates 3' in front of electrical panels for reference. Sounds like you've got it covered but just adding my $.02.

Give some thought to access to the corners. So many posts on the forum of guys swearing off duck-unders and pop ups. Consider a couple of swing out sections that will allow you to reach the back corners.

A couple of suggestions.

Keep up the good work, looking forward to seeing trains running.

Bob