Changing green class lights to white?

I think about all you could do would be to replace the green LED's with white ones.  Paint might make them green, but I don't think you can go from green to white that way.

That's what I was thinking.  

Jake is right, replace the bulbs.

Why not just unplug them and have NO CLASS LIGHTS lit. Many railroads did not always use green or white class lights, ESPECIALLY in freight service. For example, the New York Central even started removing the class lights from their steam locomotives completely.

I think you would need 2MM LEDs to fit inside the the indicator. I've been able to find them in red and green but not in white yet. I suspect you could use an incandescent grain of rice bulb inside though. The current draw on these is not much more than an LED. Maybe Mike or Jon could tell us what the LED Legacy driver for the class lights is rated for? Might be generic 5 volts? BTW the bulbs I am thinking of easily fit in HO markers so you would have no problem installing them in O scale lights.

Pete

I'm also looking true 2mm white LED's, I use the red/yel/green ones like are used in those markers, but I've never found a similar one in white.

I haven't looked at it in great detail, but would any of these work?

http://www.modeltrainsoftware.com/ledlights1.html

I'd imagine it would be a snap to configure a DCS or Legacy remote to have the ability to change class lamp color if steamers had multiple colored class lamps installed similar to their F units. Lionel configured the S-3 to turn off its brake light after the engine was released 

I see it as a no cost and long overdue upgrade.

Joe

Note the base of these is larger than 2mm, which is the sticking point.  The 2mm LED's used for these lights are 2mm maximum diameter.

The prototype aspect of course is that a scheduled train would not have class lights illuminated. White denotes an extra train that does not appear on the schedule. (Some fright trains were scheduled.) Green means second section. Red would be to the rear.

Why so many manufacturers insisted on putting red class lights on $1000+ engines is beyond me.

If your layout is immense enough to need green markers for a second section, my hat is off to you.

What we need is white markers (because most of our trains run at our whim) that maybe we can turn off. 

If not make mine white.

I don't understand the red on the front, I have a couple that I'm going to change.  I'd like to find white, but I have trouble finding true 2mm white LED's.  At least with the green, it's something that "might" have appeared on a working locomotive.

What about the bulb at 18:08 in the video below.  I'm dong some work on the UP 844 and I don't think the prototype has the inner class light...just the front and outer side.?  Couldn't I paint the inner side light black and keep the remaining white light?

On the latest Diesel Legacy Locos, we use "Water Clear" RED LEDs on the front of the loco.  These LED's are OFF in forward, and when operating as "rear" turn RED. 

It is a reasonable compromise, where OFF is common, in which CLEAR can take one's imagination to WHITE; and for those who want RED on the rear, you get it when the loco is in reverse.  If the RED is troubling, you can turn them OFF with the CAB-2, which works for Steamers (which stay on).

So maybe use a water clear RED LED for the markers, which can be found in 2mm sizes.

>>What we need is white markers (because most of our trains run at our whim) that maybe we can turn off. 

If not make mine white.<<

As I pointed out. with the MR S-3, you can now have the option to turn class lamps on and off if you have the Legacy 5.1 upgrade.

What would be nice is green/white/off & on control.

Joe

Jon, can you point to a source for the clear red LED in a true 2mm form-factor?  I'd also love to find a white one, but that's not happening right now.

Larry, The question to ask is how did Lionel get white light from the class lights on that MR S3? Do they know of source for tiny LEDs, is light actually behind the smokebox cover with a light pipe, or are they using an incandescent bulb in the light?

Pete

I'll send something over to Mike Reagan and maybe he can tell me.

My guess would be an incandescent bulb.

Here is what they used in the S3. The description says white LED though it looks yellow in the picture. You can double check at the Lionel site, replacement parts, item number 11312.

Pete

http://www.miniatronics.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=CTGY&Category_Code=6

Try Niniatronics. They have a 2mm white LED that they call "Yellow glow". Probably comes down to the same product Pet shows above but they are a great place for a number of items and worth I look.

They also have a nice catalog that they will send to you.

Good luck and always have fun with it.

It does look yellow, but in the video of the engine I posted above, they look white.

YIKES!  $11 and I'm sure some shipping for one LED?  I think not!

Your right John, that is a high price. $5.95 each dose not sound like a good price for LED's. All of their other LED's 1.5mm, 3mm and 5mm are listed as six to tweleve in a package.

Go to the left of their page and pull down LED's. You don't see the 2mm but all the others are as I stated.

I think they have a pricing screw-up on their internet page. Try giving them a call to get it cleared up.

The worst that could happen is you say thank you but no thank you.

They must have heard me, their site is down now.

The price from Lionel for the one above is two bucks. Such a deal.

Pete

Green/red LED's are possible when you can put two diode elements in the same package. DC polarity is often used to control which color lights up. I don't know how small these can be made, though. Adding white would be more complicated; the best you can do with green/red LED's is pass AC to them, which causes both colors to light, giving a yellow or amber output due to light mixing.

The 1.8mm ones have an enlarged base and don't fit in most of the places that the 2mm ones we're discussing will fit.

Big difference in adding white to any other color, the white LED's run on 3V and the red/yellow/green ones run on 1.5V.  The only red/white ones I found turned out to be defective and kept dying, even though I had polarity protection and the proper dropping resistors for them.

Another way to make a red/white LED is to use a white one and stick the red one right behind it in heat-shrink tubing.  Turn off the white and turn on the red, you get a red LED.  Works better than I had expected.

Another way to make a red/white LED is to use a white one and stick the red one right behind it in heat-shrink tubing.  Turn off the white and turn on the red, you get a red LED.  Works better than I had expected.

Not that's a great idea; you'd only need a control circuit to switch LED's. If only it could be made small enough, or just keep the (larger) LED's back in the locomotive shell and use lenses with light pipes/fiber optics to channel the illumination to the markers.

>>.you'd only need a control circuit to switch LED's. If only it could be made small enough, or just keep the (larger) LED's back in the locomotive shell and use lenses with light pipes/fiber optics to channel the illumination to the markers.<<

Having zero knowledge on this stuff, if Lionel & MTH can switch class color from red to green on F units today why can't they do the same on steam??

Joe 

Red to green is no problem, I have both two lead and three lead LED's in 2mm, 3mm, and 5mm sizes that are red/green.  The two lead ones work on polarity reversal, the three lead ones have a common cathode or anode (I have both types) and work on a single polarity.  It's getting white into the mix that changes the deal, it's a different die material than the colored LEDs.

I do use a large fiber optic to put markers on some locomotives, and I just used the same fiber optic material to put rear lights on my MTH Galloping Goose TMCC conversion.  You can get some pretty thick fiber optic material that's great for stuff like markers, and allows you to put the somewhat bulky LED or LEDs where they'll fit.

Red to green is no problem, I have both two lead and three lead LED's in 2mm, 3mm, and 5mm sizes that are red/green.  The two lead ones work on polarity reversal, the three lead ones have a common cathode or anode (I have both types) and work on a single polarity.  It's getting white into the mix that changes the deal, it's a different die material than the colored LEDs.<<

Thanks, John,  I learn something everyday.

Joe