Dullcote alternatives ???

This is a religious topic for a lot of folks.  Me, I just use the cheapest flat clear rattle-can spray that I can find at Home Depot or Walmart.

Krylon flat clear.

@prrhorseshoecurve posted:

Krylon flat clear.

I agree.  Specifically, the one I use is Krylon Colormaxx "Flat Krystal Clear."

I bought a can of Rustoleum Matte clear for the building I just finished. Worked fine IMHO. Stunk to high heaven though. Worse than any rattle can I've used before.

Never used the Testors so I have no reference.

Bob

@prrhorseshoecurve posted:

Krylon flat clear.

@Bob posted:

I agree.  Specifically, the one I use is Krylon Colormaxx "Flat Krystal Clear."

I concur.  I have used both Krylon Gloss Clear and Flat (Matte) Clear for decaling and/or dulling finishes with great results.  Admittedly, the stuff stinks, so you either should have a spray booth w/ exhaust fan or else do it outdoors.

Testor's Glosscote and Dullcote are great products too, but a long time ago I got tired of occasional availability issues and the high prices of the little spray cans.

Guess you don't shop around much?

I cut way back on Dullcote for various reasons.

Have had ++ experience w/Krylon Crystal Clear. Agree with Mixed Freight (above) about the smell. Take it outside.

Tru Color flat has about the same sheen as Dullcote. If I want dead flat, I still have some Floquil. 

Pete

@dkdkrd posted:

I don't know what it is about that product but I have NEVER had a bad experience with it, and why I would try something else on a labor of love like that kit to save money is one of those mysteries of human foible-dumb.

There is a good reason to use something else - dry transfers from Clover House are not quite compatible with Dullcote.  They are however fine with Rustoleum Matte Clear which is what I use now for most cars that I build.

A little FYI -- Michael's the chain craft store carries Dullcoat. I get it there when my local hobby shop is out of stock.

Artist's Matte Medium, thinned with water and a bit of isopropyl (rubbing) alcohol, sprayed through an airbrush.

Is is me, or is DullCote "less flat" than it used to be??

Sirt

THANKS, I just purchased my first can and it works great

Mike W

I just DULLED two cars one with my last spritz of Dullcote and the other with Krylon. The Krylon Flat was a much better finish and yes Dullcote was "LESS DULL"

Appreciate all the responses.

OK further update. I Just finished painting a few cars, all with Scalecoat II. A few reefers in Boxcar Red (Brown) and a few in a combo of Yellow/Blue. I dulled one of the Brown cars with Krylon Clear Flat and it worked great. HOWEVER, with the Yellow/Blue car the paint cracked. Not a total loss and the cracking may add to the aging and weathering but am weary of adding more Krylon as it is not the desired look.

Has anyone else experienced this?  Is there a compatibility factor as to what paints will go with what sealer/Dulling coats? Were the Yellow and Blue paints defective?

Any help  here appreciated and this continues

Might have sprayed to close. Next time, try several quick passes and wait a few minutes apart. Try 10 or 12"away.

Also the paint may have not been cured or had a reaction with the clear.

Steve, how many days did you allow for the Scalecoat II to dry before applying the Krylon clear?

Original Krylon, not the plastic safe version, is listed as an enamel but the solvents in it are more like a lacquer. It will attack a lot of paints, especially fresh paint.

Dullcote is also a lacquer. I have had it attack decals that were a week old when sprayed from a rattle can. Using it from an airbrush I can apply lighter coats, which dry faster and flatter and not had it lift any paint or lettering.

You read a lot of recommendations for various products on the forum but not so much how to use it. How to use it is just as important as what to use.

Pete

Steve, can you post a few pictures of the paint jobs?

Andy

I don't know how you guys get good results from rattle can clear finishes. I haven't tried any of the big box store clear finishes on a models because I don't want to mess up something I've spent a lot of time building and painting. My experience with Dullcote from a rattle can has not been good. Frequently it leaves either a visibly grainy (thin coat) or mottled finish (thick coat). Humidity affects the finish greatly as I don't dare use rattle can Dullcote on a humid day (which is frequent around here).

I get my best results with Dullcote using an airbrush. The airbrush sprays the paint in much finer droplets than is possible from a rattle can nozzle. The result is a very consistent flat finish. The amount of shine can be adjusted by mixing some Glosscote in with the Dullcote.

I like Tamiya rattle can paints although they tend to be expensive. I tried their flat finish and I felt that although flat it left kind of a milky, translucent finish.

Finding Dullcote in bottles can be a problem, however. Testors is reducing its model paint lineup greatly. Several years ago they dumped Floquil. About a year ago they eliminated most of their military paints, now I understand they are eliminating their entire Model Master line, both enamel and acrylic. Supposedly Dullcote and Glosscote will remain available however all the changes they are making seem to be affecting the supply of the paints they are keeping.

Ken

I just used Rustoleum 2x gloss clear first on the painted model to hide the decals applied after, and then over the top of them to protect them. These are G scale decals from Cirrcus City and were nice and thick. That made handling them much easier.

 I only post this incase anyone is wondering about the product.

@kanawha posted:

My experience with Dullcote from a rattle can has not been good. Frequently it leaves either a visibly grainy (thin coat) or mottled finish (thick coat). Humidity affects the finish greatly as I don't dare use rattle can Dullcote on a humid day (which is frequent around here).

I get my best results with Dullcote using an airbrush. The airbrush sprays the paint in much finer droplets than is possible from a rattle can nozzle. The result is a very consistent flat finish. The amount of shine can be adjusted by mixing some Glosscote in with the Dullcote.

I like Tamiya rattle can paints although they tend to be expensive. I tried their flat finish and I felt that although flat it left kind of a milky, translucent finish.

 Ken

Interesting to read this. My experience with Dullcote has been similar.  I also find that frequently it goes on unevenly, just as you describe - either grainy when it's a thin coat, or mottled when a thicker coat. I assume a major part of the problem is the quality of the nozzle, and apparently that's a significant part of the issue judging from your better results with an airbrush which sprays finer particles.

I've had excellent results with Tamiya rattle cans - paint quality is very good and the nozzles are very good as well. I haven't tried their translucent flat finish. I much prefer Krylon rattle can paint over Rustoleum. My experience is that Rustoleum nozzles aren't as good and the paint takes much longer to dry. I plan to try using the Krylon product instead of Dullcote the next time the need arises.

First of all THANKS to you all for your responses and input and the amazing depth of your knowledge.   As requested I am posting a few pictures of the cars. and here is a recap of my process.

1. The cars were soaked in 99% alcohol and stripped clean then washed and allowed to dry

2. I used Tamiya light Gray primer which dried for over a week

3. Used Scalecoat-II Yellow gloss on the sides

4. Used Krylon Blue Flat on the doors, ladder and roof-top walkway

5. After the paints dried for about 3 days I applied the decals.

6. After the decals set for 3 days that's when I sprayed the Krylon Clear Flat. The yellow paint crackled with the exception of the areas under the decals and the Blue paint faded. The result is not a total loss as it adds to the weathering which was the next step (currently on hold). It just wasn't expected.

I'd say that whatever Krylon uses as a solvent/carrier in their clear paint isn't compatible with Scalecoat II. I don't know whether the Krylon is an enamel, lacquer, or acrylic but the solvent in the clear was obviously too hot for the Scalecoat paint. A lot depends on how thick or wet the coat of clear was. Generally if you are using a hot solvent holding the can away from the model and spraying on thin coats works best. This allows the solvent to evaporate or disperse in the air so not that much lands on the model. The blue paint fading could be due to excessive humidity in the air or is just a characteristic of the paint. These big box store paints weren't designed for models, they were designed for household projects. Stick with model paint designed for use with models.

Ken

Ken, My thoughts exactly and I couldn't have said it better. I have been using Dullcoat for over 30 years mostly over Scalecoat 2 but over may types of paint with no ill effects. Usually what I Dullcoat has been drying for a week or close to it and I spray (rattle can) at a distance of 8" - 12".

Steve, thanks for posting the pictures.  It's been years since I sprayed dulcoat from a rattle can, but I have  had simar results with the finish drying cloudy as your pictures show.  As others stated it may have been from humidity or maybe from spraying too close resulting a too think coat.  

My preferred paint for airbrushing is badger modelflex acrylics.  I always get a smooth thin, opaque  finish.  I have had success with their clear finishes as well (flat, semigloss, and gloss).  Curious to know if others use this paint and what they think of their clear coat finishes. 

Great information on this thread !!!

Thanks in advance !!!

CB&Q Bill

Just watched a you tube video where the guy makes his own flat finish using 10 parts Pledge floor gloss, 1 part Tamiya X-21 flat base, plus thinner. Credited another fellow for the idea, but I missed the name. Obviously he's airbrushing, not rattle-canning.

Recent post from a general "Painting" thread:

Lately, I have had trouble finding Testor's DullCote.  I bought Tamiya Flat Clear (also a lacquer), and was very happy with the result.  I have used in aerosol form (convenient).

I also have used Tamiya Acrylic Flat Clear acrylic through my airbrushes with good results.  For re-glazing plastic "glass" after I dull the entire car or loco, I use Testor's Gloss Cote, brushed, right out of the bottle.

It would be very valuable if someone made up a table that had, say, various paint manufacturers on the side and clear coating choices along the top, then filled in as many entries as possible indicating good or bad reaction between paint and coat. 

I can think of few things more saddening than to paint and decal a piece, then have the coating I chose react and thus ruin my work.  This thread has a ton of valuable information in it that needs to be saved in an organized manner easy to retrieve.

I use Tamiya Dullcote and it flows very evenly.

Re-glazing plastic  glass after dull coating?  I never thought of this.  Mike Wyatt and others, please tell us more.  I have a few older " SHINY BRIGHT"  Williams engines that are begging for this treatment.  Earl 

Mike Wyatt:

You mentioned brushing GlossCote onto Window glazing.

Have you ever brushed Dullcote and/or GlossCote onto the main body of your models ?

I have recently noticed on websites for Vallejo, Micro-Mark, & other paint suppliers that many of them offer their own versions of dull & gloss coatings.  I have no experience with any of these.

CB&Q Bill

Tamiya clear matte...greatest stuff ever.

Forget about the Pledge Floor Gloss idea. Product has been discontinued. In addition, it was reformulated at some point, and many modelers questioned new product was the same formula.

I've used Tamiya spray can paint and flat/gloss/semi-gloss finishes for years now with no problems. Tamiya is designed for painting models, so it's spray cans use a nozzle that produces a much finer spray than most hardware store spray cans, which are designed more for big jobs like spraying metal patio furniture.