Rich, thanks for posting this great news.  Yes, I know they actually have to finish the study, etc.  At least its a start.

 

Stuart

I'll believe it when I see it run. Still a few things I'd like to know, like "now what" after it is restored... Wick isn't going to run NS forever and the next guy may not give a rats behind on steam. Last I heard, VMT has no shops or mechanical equipment to work on it, let alone a place to store it. If VMT wants steam, I believe they have had the New Hope 0-4-0T a few times, a la Flagg Coal 75. In my book, that makes a lot more sense. 

A good sign that optimism is returning to a broad section of our economy & nation. 

Wonderful!

Fitzpatrick says that a thorough study is needed if the Class J 611 Locomotive is to ever run again. “Before we can promise our 611 fans that she will indeed return to service, we need to know what it will take to fix and maintain her,” he says.
Fitzpatrick adds that rail fans will ultimately decide if the Class J 611 can run again. “We will need to raise the funds for the study and restoration,” he said. “We don’t have a third party to help us. Her restoration will ultimately depend on financial support from her fans around the world.”

We are a long ways from having her ready--they still need to raise funds for the study.

Scott Smith

Great news!!!

Now that's the proper way and the professional way to approach a project like this. Get your ducks in a row first then go public !!

Great News!!! Let's all participate with the committee's survey and spread the word that this is being considered. This could become a reality with enough support.

Rich, thanks for posting this new information...see you at the curve!

 

Jeb Kriigel

I made my donation to the feasibility study!

The one think that they have going for them is that the engine was operating in 1994 and retired with all its parts intact.  Many of the restoration efforts start with engines that have been on display in public parks and have been strip of many of the details. 

 

The big expense will most likely be the replacement of the flues and certification of the boiler.  At least there is local talent in the Roanoke area that would know what to do and how to do it.

 

The Santa Fe 2926 in Albuquerque is nearing completion.  It had been on display in a local park until 13 years ago.  The NMSLRHS does not have any shops or buildings.  Their biggest need would be crane services.  Everything is done out in the open.  In 2009 they estimated that they were withing $500,000 of completion.  This is probably a good starting figure for the 611 based on what I think its condition is.  Last year the NMSLHS consumed 84,000 hours of volunteer labor.  Hopefully they will take to the rails yhis year.

 

Jan

"Studying the feasibility"...

 

Really???? 

 

What makes you think THAT?

Someone more directly involved with maintaining steam could answer this. When the 611 was last shopped, were the revisions to FRA regulations in place requiring some modifications? If not what additional work would be required to bring her up to current codes, if any? Slightly off topic, I hope Wasatch bids on this for purely selfish and a silly reason..they regularly post very informative videos of work and other aspects of steam on their website..

http://wasatch-rr-contractors.com/

1) N&W 611 must have the vast majority of the tubes & flues removed from her boiler so that the ENTIRE inside AND outside of her steel can be ultrasonic tested for thickness, including the firebox. A new FRA Form 4 must be re-calculated, and submitted based on the ultrasound findings.

 

2) If Wasatch RR Contractors do indeed bid on the project, the VTM better have LOTS OF MONEY!!!

The necessity for twin sight glasses etc was what I had in mind as well..perhaps others. Beyond structural soundness of the boiler. This brings to mind the number of qualified steam contractors..rather than the K4 debacle.Wasatch came to mind because I am familiar with them.Others?

Pretty much all the big "modern" main line steam locomotives were originally equipped with two gauge glasses, and that is why the FRA mandated THAT. The only main line operable steam locomotive I'm aware of that HAD to have the second gauge glass added was the CP Hudson #2816, in order for it to operate into the U.S., some years ago.

 

well, since Scott Lindsay is involved right now, I'd say he would probably be in the bidding to do the restoration if it comes to that.  He was with NS at the time, knows what work needed to be done in '94, and has worked on a lot of engines since then.  There are plenty of others also.  The Age of Steam Roundhouse crew would be a possibility also, which would solve the where to do it.

 

This is all down to money.  How much do you want to spend?  How fast do you want it accomplished?  How extensive of a restoration do you want to undertake?  Fast.  Good.  Cheap.  Pick two.

 

I just hope they know something about the future of the steam program that isn't being let out just yet, because this is a LOT of money to spend on something with the very real possibility that NS could go back to No Steam very quickly when Moorman retires.  If this actually goes ahead, I will feel a lot safer about the continuation of the steam program for a few more years.

Kevin

Great news!  Thank you, Rich!

 

http://www.roanoke.com/news/breaking/wb/320752

Hot Water,

 

You'll find that a very large portion of the people working on the restoration of these locomotives made their livelihood working on steam locomotives.  They now spend their time performing, directing, and educating younger people in their crafts.  Roanoke area will have a greater share because of the N&W shops.

 

Most of the people working on the 2926 in Albuquerque had no previous experience.  However, they are directed by the older, experienced folks and members of the boilermakers union.  Their are also centers of expertise to call on.  But the restoration can be done onsite.  Perhaps NS will donate or rent at cost space in their facilities.

 

I heard that FRA regulations dealing with excursion railroads now require that the boiler flues must be changed out every 15 years.  This makes it hard on tourist/museum operations.  They survive on volunteer labor.

 

Jan

Well, yes and no. The boiler tubes/flues have to be removed after 1472 days of operation OR 15 years, which ever comes first. The tubes/flues do not necessarily have to be changed/replaced, but in order to do the inside & outside ultrasonic test/inspection most/all of the tubes/flues will have to come out in oder to allow personnel access to the inside of the boiler barrel.

 

Anyone left living in Roanoke that has actual experience working on N&W steam is approaching 80 years old--and that's on the young side.  The people that will do the rebuilding are the next generation that learned from that group.  A decent percentage of those that have the knowledge of steam restoration (at least on the East Coast) probably came from the original SR/NS Steam Program.  That includes Scott Lindsay, who is part of the feasibility group.

 

Trust me, finding the people with the know-how to do this is the least of the problems---and there are much better places to do the rebuild than Roanoke these days.  Having closer access to the shop facilities needed to rebuild steam is fairly high on the list.  IF the rebuild happens, and that's a big if, I'd be surprised if it was done in Roanoke.

Kevin

 Could the 1218 be next??  Yes, I know it needs a lot.

 

...keep the rails polished...

The best man for the job would be Robert Yuill, former General Forman of the NS Steam Shop in Birmingham, AL.

When you consider the thousands of athletes and movie stars this country supports with multi-million dollar salaries each year, a project like this (of which the benefits will span many years) really shouldn't be a stretch.  Just a matter of priorities and the will to do it.

would it be possible,feesable to let the 261 or 765 group have at her? they sure have a proven record and the know how.

I began that line of questioning to determine if any thinking has been done in advance that has been put toward this evaluation as a solid, affirmative step forward, meaning bids in advance of creating a target goal for donors to determine what the projected costs are. I got the impression this is a sort of a loose stab. More of a poll than proposal.

Inasmuch as I like the idea of 611 running again, all of this seems very speculative and based on public contributions that I would assume NS would have some sort of investment in their use of 611 as well. Unless all of this is NS agreeing to a lease if....ABC are completed. A sweet deal.

It sounds as if the museum itself does not have the funds itself to proceed so all this strikes me as both a positive turn of events and yet far from being a done deal. If they have not secured bids for evaluation...a projected cost and are waiting for us in the community to pony up the cash..I would not break out the champagne yet. I am not trying to be a sour apple, but money talks and putting the A back in service is extremely unlikely. They will be fortunate to get 611 out of the stall.

I hope they do.

agreed, alot has to happen for this to become more than a dream. but just a couple years ago there was no way NS was going to have steam again. Now thanks to alot of hard work from alot of people, and just maybe a cab ride for the NS Big Kauhana in a certian Berk, this may just happen.

Dave

I guess that when I read this, it sent up a warning flag..

"If the Museum determines it is unable to restore the engine, funds will be rolled over to support Museum operations so that 611 is protected, preserved, interpreted, and accessible to the public." 

IRM is also seeking funds for another storage barn ( not as sexy) with dedicated contributions, earmarked for that purpose and not to be rolled over as a qualifier, and so with only so much disposable cash to make donations, I would have liked to have read more meat and potatoes details before sending a check on blind faith.  The whole thing seems very vague to me especially no projected cost based on real world estimates for an evaluation.  Just a personal take. 

Bruce

From Trains.com

 

Committee to study restoration of Norfolk & Western Class J No. 611

Published: February 22, 2013

No. 611 on an excursion.

Photo by Jim Wrinn

ROANOKE, Va. – Norfolk & Western 4-8-4 No. 611, the homemade streamliner that became famous as one of the greatest steam passenger locomotives ever built, may return to the main line again.

That’s the objective of the “Fire up 611!” committee that the Virginia Museum of Transportation announced Friday. The seven-member panel will study and research what it will take to restore, maintain, and operate the iconic locomotive that pulled N&W varnish and pulled Norfolk Southern excursions. Findings are due within 90 days.

“The Class J 611 locomotive embodies both beauty and power,” Bev Fitzpatrick,Jr., executive director of the Virginia Museum of Transportation, says. “Since her retirement from excursion service in 1994, fans have been clamoring, hoping, and dreaming of a day when she once again blows her whistle and thunders across the landscape.”

The committee will consult with specialists in steam locomotives operations and restoration, technical engineers, and experts on Federal Railroad Administration regulations and safety.

“Before we can promise our 611 fans that she will indeed return to service, we need to know what it will take to fix and maintain her,” he says.

In addition to Fitzpatrick, Jr., the committee consists of:

• Scott Lindsay, president of Steam Operations Corp., a company that specializes in the restoration of historic rail equipment. Lindsay was also on the 611 locomotive crew that maintained the locomotive in the early 1990s.
• Preston Claytor, railroad operations and safety consultant and the son of the late Robert Claytor, who was chairman and CEO of the company when 611 was restored in 1982.
• Cheri George, owner of a software consulting company in Atlanta, Ga., and a volunteer 611 fireman in the early 1990s.
• Jim Wrinn, editor of Trains magazine, author of Steam’s Camelot about the Southern Railway and Norfolk Southern excursions, and a long-time volunteer at the North Carolina Transportation Museum.
• Jeff Sanders, president of the Roanoke Chapter of the National Railway Historical Society.
• Ron Davis, president of the Norfolk & Western Historical Society.
• Will Harris, board member of the Virginia Museum of Transportation and president of North Fork Lumber Company in Goosen, Virginia.
• Jeanne Bollendorf, executive director of the History Society of Western Virginia

Fitzpatrick adds that railfans will ultimately decide if the 611 runs again. “We will need to raise the funds for the study and restoration,” he said. “We don’t have a third party to help us. Her restoration will ultimately depend on financial support from her fans around the world.”

The committee will determine the restoration scope, the experts needed, and the location for the work as well as cost estimates based on 611’s mechanical history, FRA boiler regulations that went into effect since the engine last ran, and other factors.

No. 611 fans are invited to visit fireup611.org to learn more, fill out a survey, and to donate to the Fire UP 611study. They can also visit the Fire Up 611 Facebook page and YouTube channel.

The Norfolk & Western Class J Locomotives were designed, constructed, and maintained in Roanoke, Va. These streamlined locomotives have captivated the hearts of rail fans worldwide since they first rolled out of the N&W Roanoke Shops, beginning in 1941.

No. 611 was built in May 1950 to pull the famous Powhatan Arrow passenger train from Norfolk to Cincinnati. Retired in 1959, the engine was displayed at the transportation museum in Wasena Park then withdrawn in 1981 for restoration at the Southern Railway steam shop in Birmingham, Ala.

Completed in August 1982, the engine entered excursion service and ran until December 1994 when the company changed its policy on steam and the locomotive once again became a museum piece.

In 2011 Norfolk Southern began running steam excursions again using Tennessee Valley Railroad Museum’s Southern Railway 2-8-0 No. 630 and the Fort Wayne Railroad Historical Society’s Nickel Plate Road 2-8-4 No. 765. President, Chairman, and CEO Wick Moorman says that if 611 is rebuilt, the railroad would be happy to run the engine on its new 21st Century Steam program.

Hello All,

 

This is just tremendous.  I served on the board of the VA Museum of Transportation several years ago, and it has always been a strong wish to bring the grand lady of the rails back into service.  Hats off to Bev Fitzpatrick the Executive Director of the museum and his team. Since he came to the museum, his passion for trains has pushed the museum ahead in some very difficult times.  I know that I will continue to support the museum financially, and I hope others join me in this new opportunity.

 

Regards,

Frank

Frank Smith

Roanoke, VA

I want that...I will drive a distance to ride that train.

If 

Robert B. Claytor was still alive both J611 and 1218 would be still running now!!.. He keeped the steam program alive!  Since he was a very big steam fan him self..When he passed away in april of 93 that was the end of the steam program..

Very exciting news! I made sure to follow fire up 611 on Facebook and twitter and subscribed to their YouTube. Let's hope they get her running again 

As they said it will take donations...so those of you who are a fan and can...please make one....I made mine already.

If this post didn't appear to be written by a first grader, it would be a lot easier to read. Yikes! 

I think this is all Rich's fault. He represents that guy in the sports car driving down your street when you were a kid.

 

You say to your self "yea, I want one of those".

 

Then when you get your license and realize how much the cost of the sports car and insurance is, you realize its not gonna happen.

 

 

They're going to gut the boiler and refit her with barely used Lithium-Ion batteries recently donated by Boeing.

Guys like Bill Purdie and Walter Dove, men who could at once oversee, work hands on and fine tune a steamer, set the "Pops", etc, aren't around anymore and their equal as replacements are few--very few.

 

I will contribute to the Survey, I always did---Fort Wayne and Spencer Shops. But I do not believe the "J" will ever run again---perhaps a cosmetic restoration may be funded but even that is a formidable goal for us tightfisted rail fans.

 

Hot Water makes some factual comments regarding personnel and facilities and raises some other very pertinent questions IMHO.