GGD SF El Capitan Set Change

Scott, thank you for the email and your post here. For those that ordered a complete set of twelve El-Cap cars, is there need to change that order?

I personally think that's an excellent decision Scott.

Scott, thanks for the email and the post, I've replied back to you with my new request. Personally though, I sure would like to see the RPO and Baggage cars Budd Built and not ACF as you stated in your post, most photos I've seen of the EL Cap show Budd cars on the head end. I wonder what other forum members preferences are who also ordered the set, Budd Built or ACF Head end cars? 

 

Joe

I received the following email this morning.

 

Dear Valued GGD Customers,

 

The AMTRAK livery of the El Capitan will be Phase I. Not Phase III as previously Stated.

 

Thank You,

 

Scott Mann

Scott -

 

I would like to echo Mill City's question:

 

For those that ordered a complete set of twelve El-Cap cars, is there need to change that order?

 

I would think not, since the same 12 cars are being ordered, but I would be more comfortable hearing it from You.

 

Thanks.

Sounds like a great testimonial to how well Scott listens to and cares about his customers. 

 

Art

Yep, I am with Art, Scott always is concerned about doing the best job he can and is open to his customer's wishes.  Can't get any better than Scott!!

 

Alan

Santa Fe advertised the El Capitan as an all Budd built streamliner. This  referring to the Hi-Level cars. As far as the Baggage being an ACF car and the transition being a Pullman Standard car, I'm sure Santa Fe mixed and matched these cars as needed. Can't wait to see finished product.

Thank you Scott.

If you ordered a step down chair car as an add on car, you might want to update your order.  Since an add on step down chair car is still listed on the reservation webpage, you might end up with three of them in the total set.  Unless that's how you want it.

 

I updated my order at my dealer today.  Just switched out the add on step down chair car for another 72 seat chair car.

Brian, thanks for the heads-up. As you correctly alluded to, I have no need for three step down cars. A call tomorrow is in order.

I went ahead and pre-ordered a Sante Fe set.  You may wonder why this die-hard Amtrak fan made that decision.  Believe me it was not an easy one as I have plenty of GGD Amtrak single level cars to mix in with the El Cap. 

 

At the end of the day, I decided that since these will predominantly run on the high rail club I belong to, the Paradise and Pacific in Scottsdale, AZ, that the Santa Fe cars would be the best fit.  Power was also a consideration in trying to find an appropriate set of locomotives.  I was able to pick up a set of MTH FP45s in Warbonnet with the correct numbering and lettering for 1970 which would still be pre-Amtrak and I prefer cowl units over cab units for some odd reason. 

 

However doing some quick research, Amtrak did lease 5944 and a few others up into 1973 to pull the Super Chief so there is a short window of FP45's pulling Amtrak prior to the arrival of the SDP40F.

 

Could I have caught the Warbonnet bug?  Hmmm....at least in high-rail I guess I have.  Excited for this unique train!

 

Santa Fe experts.  What years did the baggage RPO run?

The Post Office canceled all RPO services in 1968.  Gave all the subsidies to the airlines.

Richard - Thanks for the info.  Looks like I'll need to renumber my FP45s after all since I ordered the RPO or live with the fact that I have a two year disconnect between my power and the forthcoming cars. 

 

As a side note, RPOs ran on the NEC until June 30, 1977.  A Penn Central painted M70 did the honors in an Amtrak train.  As I understand, Conrail inherited the mail service, while Amtrak did not.  Of course Amtrak got mail service back for a while in the 80's and 90's only to give it up again.

Jonathon:

 

In any regard, that RPO will look good behind your engines. I doubt that anyone who goes to your club shows would ever know the difference anyway.

Yeah, try finding a set of Bowser Amtrak Roadrailers.  And, I'm extending some MTH 50' hycubes to 60' for some express/mail cars.

After spending hours and hours painting the diaphragms on my 10 car set of Super Chief cars (and finding a paint that is close in color and stays flexible).... I am begging Scott..

 

PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE paint the diaphragms silver on the El Capitan cars.  PLEASE

 

There's not many things I can say about this hobby that I truly did NOT enjoy doing... but painting those 19 diaphragms is at the top of the list I assure you. That sucked!

PLEASE

PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE paint the diaphragms silver on the El Capitan cars.

 

Look at the pictures Erik Lindgren posted in his Super Chief thread.  

 

https://ogrforum.com/t...-1951-53-super-chief

 

Pecos River Brass also used a silver colored material for their Super Chief diaphragms.  Perhaps Scott (and you ought to email him) can work something out with the production facility to come up with some silver diaphragms.

 

Scott, Has THE Canadian train arrived yet? the suspense is dragging out forever...

re silver diaphragms: is there a silver fabric paint? Ought to remain flexible if it will adhere, etc.

I tried a couple different fabric paints but they didn't stick well. That paint is meant to go on very thick, and I guess if you put 50 thin coats on, it might look OK. I did find a paint that has worked so far. Stays flexible after it dried but took 2-3 coats to get a good color. It was not very fun hand painting 19 diaphragms 3 times though

 

It comes in 4 different colors.... I chose Sterling, and it's pretty close. Like I said, it took me hours and hours to get them painted though.

 

That's why I'm asking Scott to have them factory painted

Use a silver sharpie marker. It works great on fabric diaghrams. 

They're not fabric diaphragms on the Super Chief cars, and I'm sure they will be rubber on the El Capitan too. 

It was not very fun hand painting 19 diaphragms 3 times though 

 

It is possible that the factory tried to get silver rubber or paint some black rubber and decided that it was not worth what it would add to the price?  Maybe Scott didn't want to deal with complaints of paint flaking off?

There are sometimes scale limitation to actual sized items.

 

Diaphragms are one of them. Either the scale diaphragm material is too flexible and weak OR strong enough but way too rigid.

 

Painting them poses similar issues; paint at 1/4 scale is way too thin on a flexible material and with a myriad of coats too thick and prone to flake off.

 

so maybe you just have to accept the gaps.

 

 

So the question is, why use rubber? The fabric type used by walthers since the 50s looks far more prototypical and easier to color, imo.

Lat me go on record by saying there is no way I will ever paint diaphrams. 

 

Nope 

 

Sorry

 

No Way

 

Ain't gonna happen.

it took me hours and hours to get them painted though.

Perfect for watching baseball on TV :-)

It has been awhile since there has been any activity on this thread.  I checked the GGD web page and they are still taking reservations for these cars.  I thought by bumping it up Scott may update us on the status, or perhaps a member knows if the cars will be produced and when they may be available.

 

thanks

Scott stated in a post about the progress on the FT diesels that the El Capitan cars would go into production later this year.

Scott,

Remember Fred Hill over at The Original Whistle Stop used Trojan to mold his HO diaphragms in colors and used Tampo decals for the striping. If you want I can chase down more info for you on this methodology.

John Smith used stickers looks like you did too with some success.

I've painted GGD rubber diaphragms on the heavyweight coaches and the silver turned yellowish. Odd

 

That would be amazing... considering the GGD El Capitan first broke on this forum back on February 6th of this year, when Boilermaker1 posted this topic:

 

https://ogrforum.com/topic/ggd-el-capitan

 

This has got to make the poor folks that have been waiting 5-6 years for tha Atlas California Zephyr, just a bit uneasy.

 

Go Scott !!!

This project was long overdue in the O-Gauge community. I give Scott a lot of credit for moving this to the forefront. This gives anyone the opportunity to own and run a set of Sante Fe Hi-Levels the opportunity to do so. They are so impressive on a layout, and of course they represent one of the most popular railroads, ever.

 

Jim, you are not alone in loving the Sante Fe and Hi-Levels.

Scott Mann, how about update on the progress of El Capitan cars??

Scot mentioned a short time ago that when he finished the Train of Tomorrow project, the Hi-Levels were next. The ToT is scheduled for shipping in November.

 

I hope this helps.

The Amtrak version is about to be canceled due to lack of reservations.

Did Scott say anything at York about approximate ship date for this set?

I asked him that question and he said "looking promising for January". Hopefully we see some pics soon.

Cool. Thanks for the info.

Not surprised there..... couldn't get enough orders for the Santa Fe Super Hudson, I just don't see the numbers coming for the Amtrak cars.

January would be GREAT.  I can't help but compare the El Capitain project that Scott has put together vs the Atlas California Zephyr.  If Scott delivers in January, that will be just over 11 months from announcement to delivery.  Atlas is going on six years and the Zephyr is still not finished.

 

 

 

 

There will be many happy folks come January with their new SF Hi-Level set. Jim will be at the head of the line. 

Brian, you know me like a brother. 

LOS,
I would have loved an atsf super Hudson,  but i am hooked on legacy and the looks of third rail engines for me do not overcome that deficit.  I hope Lionel will consistently rival third rail some day

Woooo!  And I'll be second in line!  I missed out on the K-Line version of these and did cartwheels when Scott announced this set.

 

(Now try and get THAT vision out of your minds!)  

 

Really the only difference between my Legacy AC12 and my 3rd Rail AC9 is the smoke volume and whistle smoke. Other wise the AC9 runs just as well as the Legacy, but has a lot more detail.

 

I missed out on the K-Line high levels as well. Been trying to track down the transition cars for a couple years, but REFUSE to pay the price for them that they were commanding.

 

Now I'll have a great El Cap, Super Chief, and run them as the combine El Cap/SC with 4 powered 3rd Rail F7's

Laidoffsick posted: 

 

Now I'll have a great El Cap, Super Chief, and run them as the combine El Cap/SC with 4 powered 3rd Rail F7's 

 

That will be one SPECTACULAR site.  I hope you can post a video.  

 

I would also be interested in close-up stills of the 3rd Rail F7's,  Thank You.

"Now I'll have a great El Cap, Super Chief, and run them as the combine El Cap/SC with 4 powered 3rd Rail F7's"

 

This should be the nicest passenger train on your fabulous layout. Can't wait for you to receive it and post pictures. The Sante Fe Hi-Levels are unequalled in the passenger train world.

Can't wait to see some pictures of this fabulous train set! 

Doug, in addition to the GGD El Capitan set on order I have a K-Line Super Chief 10 car set I'll run with MTH Santa Fe ABBA F7's, F-3's and ABA E8's.  I may look into some ABA PA's at some point too.

 

I also ordered some Amtrak coaches to make my K-Line set longer.  I hope they get made too.

Great to see Brian at York. The Sante Fe will be well represented on his layout for sure!

I have an El Cap set on order and some extra cars... Just curious... What cars would I need to make up a prototypical El Cap/Super Chief? 

The consist for train # 18 Combined SC/EL Cap from LA to Chicago in Sept 1959.

 

60' RPO

Baggage Mail

Baggage Dorm

Hi-Level Step Down

Hi-Level Chair Car

Hi-Level Diner

Hi-Level Lounge

Hi-Level Chair Car

Hi-Level Step Down

10-6 Sleeping car

2-4-4 Sleeping car

Pleasure Dome

Dining Car

2-4-4 Sleeping car

(2) 10-6 Sleeping cars

YEP, that is the way I remember Train #17 heading West out of Chicago.  Train #18 was East bound from LA to Chicago and did not have an RPO in the consist.

 

Can you share your source?

Sure Jim, Santa Fe Super Chief and El Capitan by Patrick Dorin, a great book for Santa Fe fans and modelers.

Not O gauge but heres a pic of Walthers El Cap Step Down car with drum head, just to get us by until we see some GGD pics

This has been such a great thread with lots of very informative and useful information.  I too am a Santa Fe fan and have all of the K-Line 21" cars plus an extra or two.  In addition, I have two complete sets of their Amtrak cars...one in 3-rail and the other in 2-rail.  BUT...for sure, the GGD set will be the standard.  They will be accurate and beautiful cars!!

 

Alan

You guys have really been making me nervous with all this talk and pictures about this beautiful train.  I had a chance to buy a complete set of the K-Line 21" cars recently and passed on it.  That was because I assured my wife that I would not buy any more engines or trains until I got a lot of scenery done.  I don't doubt that I will have a tough time finding one when I am finally in the market, but the search has always been part of the fun.  I know the K-Line set is gorgeous and I have no doubt that the GGD will be also.

 

Art

       
       

That combine train is easy to build if you have the SC and El Cap sets from GGD... Even for you Brian with the K-Line cars, you just need enough powered units in the consist to pull it.... oh and a big enough layout. I'll have to run that train at the club in San Diego.

I have the El Cap set on order. I really regret not getting the SC set when it came out

In 1959, the East bound #18 had an RPO from LA to Kansas City and at KC would switch out the RPO as well as the LA to Kansas City 10-6 sleeper. So yes, Jim is partially correct, no RPO Eastbound from Kansas City to Chicago.

jvega2 stated:  "In 1959, the East bound #18 had an RPO from LA to Kansas City and at KC would switch out the RPO as well as the LA to Kansas City 10-6 sleeper. So yes, Jim is partially correct, no RPO Eastbound from Kansas City to Chicago."

 

Thanks for posting this, that explaines why I did not see the RPO on the Eastbound SC/EC combo into Chicago.

hi jvega

got anymore photos of the Walthers car ? Bernie

"Even for you Brian with the K-Line cars, you just need enough powered units in the consist to pull it...."

 

You got that right. I am running 13 cars in my El Capitan with Lionel F3's (ABBA, two powered) and pulling it and you know you have a heavy load behind. The GGD cars will undoubtedly be heavier, so lots of power is advised.

I'll take some and post soon.

Here are some pic's of the Walthers HO El Capitan.  I bought the complete 12-car Deluxe set.  This set included lighting and passengers.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

For anyone who may be considering mixing and matching GGD and K-Line cars note that the K-Line El Capitan cars are Superliner cars in disguise and that they are different heights and shapes from the GGD El Capitan cars.

 

No problem doing it just don't get upset when they don't match.

hello jvega

I tried sending you an email for photos listed here but it bounced back , could you send me some pictures of the HO cars close up like your posted photo.

 

Thanks Bernie  , email in my profile

Tried to send pics but also bounced back using your email.