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A couple weeks ago I picked up a Polar Railroad Legacy K4 #11330. Great engine, great whistle steam effect, just love it!

 

After a couple weeks on the carpet layout I've noticed than fan motor getting louder and louder as it pulsates... Hmmm, drop of oil or new fan motor... Drop of oil didn't work so well on the F3's so I probably won't even try it on this one.

 

It's off to the workbench this weekend and it's now 3 fan motors I need to replace!

 

I'm just happy I can do some of this myself!!

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Open  up the engine with the fan motor powered.  Take your forefinger and thumb and pinch the motor gently giving it a twist in both directions  and you can get it quiet.  They are not high tech motors.  We have to do what we have to do.  I know how much these things upset people and I do not blame them at all.  I hate them as I do a large number each year between Lionel and MTH.

 

I have a friend in New Jersey who is not a fan of loud motors.  Every time I get a batch of motors in, I put each one in my motor tester and save the exceptionally quiet motors for him.  I am sure he will chime in as he is well known on the forum.  

 

I buy large numbers of MTH and Lionel motors each year.  I agree with all of you on this.

 

Last edited by Marty Fitzhenry

I feel your pain.  I get them in large numbers.  here are MTH and Lionel.  When you try oil, hold the unit/locomotive upside down and just touch the bearing with your oil  needle.  Wipe the motor shaft clean of oil with a Q tip before putting the impeller back on.  By just touching the bearing it will wick what it needs.  I had one repair where an expert soaked the motor.  You know how that went.

 

One last point, when you push your impeller back on the shaft, put the bottom of the motor against something hard or the motor could come apart.

 

When you un solder and solder the wires on/off the motor, tin the tip of your iron and do not hold on motor connections any longer than needed.

 


 motor1


Marty Fitzhenry
 
 
Last edited by Marty Fitzhenry

Well, my 2003 Dodge Ram 1500 blower for the heat started to make some noise the other day. Sounded like it was all angry and upset at me. Oh dear, what do I do? LOL

 

I mean really......

 

MTH and Lionel both have really awesome smoke systems, but failure is always in the cards no matter what one does. I run smoke on my AC6000, but not on my SD70Ace. The reason? I guess I am waiting to see when the motor might go on the AC6000. LOL

 

Truthfully, it never will as I hardly use any of these locomotives nearly as much as some do theirs on their layouts. I run my loco's fairly easy and only for a few turns around my small layout.

 

In reality, as far as diesels are concerned and especially modern ones, smoke is really not necessary and actually it does look wrong. Now on steam locomotives, it is an absolute must to have smoke because a steam locomotive without smoke just doesn't look or feel right. So, of course the members that run their steam locomotives with smoke all the time are more likely to encounter a burned out motor versus those that do not use the smoke feature.

 

"failure is not an option"

 

Pete

Will an overfill cause the fan motor to stop working?  I was running my new Berk last night at the club and the smoke stopped.  Thinking I was out of smoke fluid I put about 20 drops in (accordingto the manual), and the unit still didn't work.  I do however still get smoke from the whistle.   Gonna try letting it sit upsidedown on some paper towels in the cradle today.  Suggestions?

Greg,

 

Go into the smoke unit reference and look at # 14.  You need part number 610-1154-130.  After you read that it is unavailable, hit my email when you see that.

 

We would all love a brushless motor.  I think we might have a better chance to hit the lottery. 

 

John, overfilling will do it in.  I have seen this at a local club when a member kept putting more and more smoke fluid in an engine.  When it spills over into the fan chamber, the rest is history.

Last edited by Marty Fitzhenry

In defense of Lionel and every other manufacturer, the smoke fan motor does it's job well when operating properly.  Yes some go bad due to no fault of the owner/operator (in most cases) but the end result is we have a locomotive that smokes good.  If someone came up with a better motor, they would all use it.  I know this is a problem to many people.  I have seen them bad in new unrun locomotives and others that run with no issue. 

 

I have searched far and wide for a replacement.  No luck.

 

Gary, everyone thinks repair guys make tons of money and have fun.  Wrong on both counts.  Lionel (Mike Reagan) did a lot of work to establish a network of properly trained tech people to service todays trains.  Lionel did away with old service stations that had someone who worked on old Lionel.  Anyone can work on old Lionel and keep it going.  It was a great product.  This forum has a decent number of trained people that try to help members with a problem.  I read many members each day and try to learn.  I do the Legacy,TMCC, and DCS locomotives at Charles Ro and get to see many issues that I try to share with forum members who are having the same problems.  I do not want any more work but am willing to share information to help someone.

 

One last thing, if you order a smoke fan motor from Lionel or MTH, order a few as they do not cost a lot of money.

Last edited by Marty Fitzhenry

I missed that Marty.

 

Do you find the replacement motors have been more reliable?  I keep lots of the MTH motors around, but I've been reluctant to replace a Lionel with another Lionel until I know they won't come right back to me.  I have had people that have had two motor replacements at Lionel service, only to have the same issue again.  I haven't seen any of them back with the replacement MTH motor.

 

Originally Posted by jojofry:
One day these will be brushless and that will be the end of bad motors .

The Brushes don't make the motors squeal, so it won't fix the problem.  The bearings going bad cause the noise, and the resultant increase in current to overcome the rotational torque requirements due to the bad bearings causes the electronics to shut off the motor.

 

Shutting down the fan motor and blinking the cab light is much better solution than electronics burning up, as the replacement PCB cost is very expensive!  The motor is not expensive, although frustrating that it failed.

 

We are certainly aware of the problem, and have tightened the incoming inspection process on the motors; and perform an AQL test on the lots. Still some motors are not reflective of the lot, and they fail.

 

Just the other day my LEGACY GP35 cab light blinked 3 times signifying a smoke fan motor defect. According to the owner's manual, the smoke unit can be reset 3 times before it shuts down and has to be serviced.

 

The next time I powered up I turned on the smoke unit with my CAB-2 and it worked fine at all 3 settings. When I brought the locomotive to a stop the cab light again blinked 3 times. I did a reset 3 times and the blinking stopped and the smoke unit shut down.

 

This sequence has occurred several times since the cab light first blinked 3 times. The smoke unit works until the engine is stopped.

I did have a rash of Lionel smoke fan motor failures on brand new engines but the problem seems all fixed now!  I love the new FA-2 and bought several of them.  They are terrific, the best!  Except for the smoke fan motors.  Three did not work from the start, all others but 1 failed within 1 or 2 operating sessions- I'm talking within 20 minutes!  Three blinking lights.  For a 90% failure rate.  Oiling bearings, test running the motors, etc. was all time consuming and the motor would then run only 10 more minutes or so before 3 blinking lights again.  I did not want to have them fixed under warranty, that didn't last long before.  I did not want to replace them with new motors from the same faulty supply bin.  On O Gauge Forum I learned to use MTH fan motors.  So I did.  So far- they are all working properly!

Now I can enjoy all features of the best: the FA-2 look, Legacy control, 3 and 4 unit lashups, and lots of Alco smoke from each and every unit!

Thanks O Gauge Forum!

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