Insulating through 07 to post-war tubular track and 72 switches question

Lionel 153IR.

Might be a long shot, but Gargraves/Ross track comes with the outside rails isolated. If you are going to ballast your track, maybe you could fit some of these pieces in where needed and the ballast would help blend it in with your other track? Might work if you only have a couple of areas like this to do and can blend them in?

Otherwise, use ACDX ROB's suggestion. It may be better anyway as you wouldn't have to change any track or worry about matching up with the other track you already have down.

I agree with Rob. I have 5, 153IR controllers on my layout. They all work flawlessly.

How about using a small cut-off wheel and cutting the ties between the center rail and outside rail leaving the screw hole in the tie.  Then use the plastic rail joiner in the ends.  You'd have to re-gauge the width.  I have not tried this but just a thought.

Thanks much,

These controllers look very good for me to buy. Will they also work on semaphores , crossing gates, 450 signal Bridges, Exedra.

Can these be set  up to activate a few feet before the train comes before a particular signal  and a few feet after the train goes past the particular signal?

Thanks for your reply, jerry 

I use them to activate a crossing gate, a signal bridge, an automatic gateman, and other accessories. So I would say yes to all. It also has an adjustable time delay. It comes with a manual. Be sure to read and understand the manual, because it can be a little tricky if you just jump into it without fully understanding just how it works. The manual has several wiring diagram examples for different accessories.

There is a controller out there that uses the window of a current transformer to detect current flowing in a wire.  This can detect the presence of a train by the current flowing to the center rail, either to the engine or lighted cars/caboose.  Blocks can thus be created by insulated pins or gaps in the center rail, without needing any other rail work.

This has additional advantages.  For example, the exclusion of trains from passing the short insulated stop block approaching a red signal at an interlocking can be effected by passing the wire to the red bulb through the window, even if there is no train yet in the interlocking drawing 3d rail current thru that particular window.

Thus, it is possible in this way to mimic the methods used in real railroading to protect interlockings.  Interlockings, of course, may contain several closely spaced switches where it is difficult to isolate the outside rails due to various complications such as the non-derailing features.  --Frank

Use the insulated rail on the switch. Attach to a relay and you get red or green. The train goes through the switch and the insulated rail energizes the relay activating Normally open and turns the light red. The train passes and the light goes back to green. Without a relay the rail can turn the light red when it passes the light goes off. Another insulated rail can make the light green.

You can tape over a piece of outside rail and cover with a piece of brass and a wire for an isolated common triggered by the wheels.

If you want the lights to designate which route the train will take just wire off the posts of the switch.

Mr Maguire, what is the controller out there that I can use to activate my accessories? Please advise what and where I can get the components and how to put them together schematic wise I would really appreciate it. Might be a fun project for me. Much much thanks, Jerry

@Jerry A-- I only had a couple, plus a 12v DC power board unit for powering their electronics. Of course they now cost more than they did in past.  I built a circuit to operate the Lionel semaphore, with special attention to reduce the buzzing and heating in its coil (DC? I can't recall).  So that's a pretty simple and obvious circuit.  I have nothing to hand on more complex ideas-- most if any would have been on the backs of an envelope anyway.

Then there is the problem of mentioning someone not an advertiser (perhaps in past?).  So an internet search phrase occurred to me.  "Model tran detection circuits" was a little too broad although quite interesting, so I added to it "using current transformers".  Really amazing what's out there now, compared to 30 years ago (my supplier/designer still comes to York and has diagrams with the gear, though).  But anyway, you have on the net both cheap and simple (one window) and presumably cheaper by the dozen (four windows), and then bells and whistles (integral power supplies, output devices, and diagrams?).   Love the searches that have the 500 little pictures.

You'll easily recognize the little toroidal coils with a round window, standing on two feet that carry the coil wire ends.  I'm looking at a kit (?) with 8 of these widgets.  However, not sure I would recommend even a kit to save cost, until one were very experienced at always making good, solid, and conductive solder joints.  The thing is, if the coil terminals of a current transformer become open circuited, there will be dangerous voltages across them.  So I definitely would not recommend designing one's own circuit, unless one really knows the way around these.

But the control outputs in the built ones are well isolated, sometimes by relays which can carry quite heavy (track) currents.  So you don't have to worry about designing your own circuits on that side.  That would be just the same as wiring the two-pole pressure switch that comes with the tinplate signal.  I'd say they would be most useful where you used tinplate track and might otherwise have to insulate a lot of outside rail by hand for detection anywhere in a block.  I did see one rated at up to 20 amps through the window.  That certainly overcomes problems with using lighter HO-type circuits.  I noticed one with detection down to 0.1 ampere, so good range can be had (0.1 to 20 on one, IIRC).

--Frank

Frank,

Holy cow, I think I will just buy the Lionel 153 IR version. I can just see me blowing up our house and our whole neighborhood.

Thank you very much for the reply it is much appreciated, Jerry