Skip to main content

Okay, okay already!  I know your heads are about to explode!  Nobody seriously cares about the collectibility of MTH trains, do they?  Maybe Tony Lash who owns two of everything MTH and Lionel have ever made since 1980 does, but few if any of the rest of us do.  Nonetheless, I, the great bearish one, am suddenly intrigued.  If you're a collector-head, please read on, I need your input.

 

So here's the mystery:  At a Colorado Toy Train Group (CTTG) auction last month, I bought a Premier El Capitan set, plus a two-car add-on set, a 60' sleeper and diner two pack, that adds to the four cars in the single-boxed El Cap set for a beautiful 6-car streamliner consist.  That add-on two-pack set was stock numbered 20-6122.  The sleeper is named "Laguna" and the diner, "5122".  The cars have aluminum car bodies with fluted sides, red and gold "war bonnet" trim strips above the windows carrying "Santa Fe" in gold on a gloss red background, mirror-finished car tops, and traditional post war style black and white passenger silhouette window insert strips.  So far, so good.

 

At York last week, I bought another two-car El Capitan add-on set with stock number, 20-6121.  There is a piece of mysterious white tape on the box end-flap, about 3" by 1", right next to the lithographed stock number, 20-6121 and hand-lettered in red felt marker, "Production Sample 9/8/97" Inside the box are two 60 scale-foot cars with the same name/number as the ones in the 20-6122 set!  In other words, same sleeper name and diner number, but different MTH set stock number!

 

I logged onto MTH's railking.com site and used the product locator tool to search under both sets' stock numbers to see what the strange case of different stock numbers for the same car sets could be all about.  The result confounded me.  According to MTH's system, the 20-6121 set consists of sleeper "Polacca" and diner, "1475"!  So why did my box labeled 20-6121 contain "Laguna" and "5122" instead?  Did someone at Trainworld where I bought the set innocently mix up cars that had been on display and put them into the wrong boxes?  Did MTH's "Production Sample" set uniquely not include the correctly designated "Polacca" and "1475", or perhaps the entire run of both 20-6121 and 20-6122 sets contained all the same named and numbered cars, "Laguna" and "5122" with the possibility that "Polacca" and "1475" were never produced for some logical industrial or marketing reason.  Do any of you have the 20-6121 set with the cars that MTH's records say should be in that set, Polacca and 1475?

 

Hopefully some of you collector-oriented brains out there, can explain to me why I have a duplicated set of cars with set stock numbers that are different.  Did I inadvertently buy a priceless collectible masterpiece, "Production Sample 9/8/97" with the wrong cars in it, or did someone at a train store just mix them up when they put display merchandise back into the boxes?

 

Where's Ed Boyle when we need him?

 

PerplexedBear

Last edited by Bearlead
Original Post

Replies sorted oldest to newest

MTH recently released to a dealer (Trainworld) pallets full of their production samples that have been sitting around their warehouse. When they start a run at the factories cars are sent back to MTH for approval before the entire run is started. So different numbers then the actual production run are not uncommon. Trainworld or MTH could have re-boxed them incorrectly, they have been sitting around for a long time. As to any collectible value that's another kettle of fish so to speak, maybe, maybe not. I have seen a lot of them on fleabay by Trainworld and they don't seem to be bringing even MSRP prices for most, while some do bring slightly higher prices.

Hey, Paul, thanks for your insights on this matter.  It was great to finally meet you in person at Thursdays at Friday's last week.

 

Now I just wish I could find the sleeper/diner set with the advertised names on the cars.  It would be nice for the consist to have all uniquely different cars, as if anybody but me would notice!  It will still look nice around the Christmas tree with the ABBA set pulling 8 cars instead of the original and apparently overpowered 3-engine 4-car set!

 

AppreciativeBear

"Nobody...cares about the collectibility of MTH...". Well, I care about their collectibility as
much as I do about Lionel's, which isn't much.

MTH is indeed supremely collectible, and waits to be "discovered". Beats more 6464
boxcars. But, collectors live on a planet other than mine, so...

I'm ordering the (Tinplate) 1700 Lionel Junior passenger set (red and silver). Collectible
or not. Hope that they don't cancel it.
Originally Posted by eddiem:

I got a production sample Railking CNJ crane and tender at York, but it was from a different dealer...the guy on the right side of the first aisle on the left (near Trainworld)... boy, he had a lot of passenger sets too!

 

Ed

I saw a number of production tagged samples at RPO Trains (formerly known as Uncle Jack's Trains).  These items were in various condition, but most common of the lots were that many of the items' boxes were well worn.  Over the years RPO f/k/a U.J.T. commonly sells odds & ends from MTH.  If you like the items, great, but as to the collectibillity of these samples ...who knows.

I own one of something with silver writing underneath, probably a stock number. I have been hovering over the Ebay auctions of that nature with the so called "Prototype" Models on sale. I am happy that the prices end up being affordable at times and purchase a item or two myself.

 

It so happens to be a pretty perfect shade of silver, at least to me. I wonder what kind of marker was used.

Well we learn something everyday. I went down stairs and checked this set out.

I purchased one set of add on cars when they first came out and another years later. I always thought they were the same set of add on cars. Low and behold 2 different sets of add on cars.

 

 

 

On another note I believe this engine has a deselect chip problem. I sent the set back to MTH and they wired the add on powered B unit to work as a slave to the powered A for a small charge and I believe they upgraded the chip at this time.

Dennis,

 

Not yet, but I'm working on it.  Built the house, but the loan process is dragging out with the lender adding new and different closing conditions in a never-ending stream!  Now if I get final loan approval, I may have to sue the builder to perform.  The market has turned and they are trying to break my contract and sell to someone else for more money.  This is the end of a 6-year project and I'm not going to give up until my dying breath!

 

P-OedBear

Post

OGR Publishing, Inc., 1310 Eastside Centre Ct, Ste 6, Mountain Home, AR 72653
800-980-OGRR (6477)
www.ogaugerr.com

×
×
×
×
Link copied to your clipboard.
×
×