I am building a o gauge layout. I bought some MTH signals. I am using Fastrack on my layout. Could someone please tell me how to connect them? Do I need to buy a special piece of track or something else to make them work on my fastrack? Can some one even tell me where to get a diagram to follow what I am to do. This is my first time with trying to mix the MTH and Lionel fastrack.
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What signals do you have (model numbers)?
You need to choose a method for detecting train presence to activate the signal to change color. This brief article gives a nice summary of the various methods.
http://www.tcaetrain.org/articles/operating/BLOCKS/
I'd say the 2 most common are Insulated Rail method and the Optoelectronic method. Most MTH signals I've seen have instructions on the package that suggest using the Optoelectronic method such as their ITAD (Infrared Track Activation Device).
Some guys prefer to manual control and use an electrical toggle switch to change signal colors at-will irrespective of the presence or absence of a train. Other guys want the signaling system to control train movement such as automatically stopping trains approaching a red signal.
So it kind of depends on what you want to do with the signals beyond simply connecting them. Keep asking questions and provide as much information as you feel comfortable sharing about your layout/equipment.
the model no is 30-11036 o scale Vertical signal
I agree with stan2004. This signal has three lights that turn on and off, so an insulated track section will not work. That section can complete a circuit and turn an accessory on and off (a semaphore, a crossing gate, an automatic gateman) but it can't turn three lights on and off in sequence without a relay and lots of extra wiring.
MTH instructions recommend an ITAD or a RailKing mechanical TAD, as stan2004 posted. They are your easiest options.
If you don't have a manual, go to MTH Trains. Click on "Product Locator." Type in "30-11036." When that signal comes onscreen, click on that number. At the lower right are several icons. Click on the icon that resembles an open book. The manual will come onscreen. Scroll down to the wiring instructions.
Thank you all for the help. You really pointed me in the right direction.
The relay is to control the signal is built in, you can trigger it via insulated rail track or the mentioned optoelectronic method but you cannot control the red - yellow - green sequence.
I myself have the MTH Pennsy signal Bridge and of course is the position light Style. with that in mind, must I use the ITAD or is there anyway can I use the insulated track system? I have Atlas o track and I am kind of unsure as to how one would wire it up if the insulated track system is applicable.
To be clear, you have this signal?
In which case, no, you do not need to use an ITAD even though that's what the instructions suggest. You can instead use a relay module triggered by an insulated rail section(s).
Suitable relay modules are around $15 each (vs. $30 or so for an ITAD). One of us can provide more details if you confirm what you have and your available track/accessory power source.
Or, if you don't mind some basic wiring (though no soldering), you should also be able to do this for about $5 using low-priced eBay modules.
I have couple of the same signal bridge. You can use a an isolated as the trigger but you are going to need a relay to make it work.
Yes, that is the signal I have! in terms of my power source, forgive me if I don't know the correct name here, I have an older 500 watt or so Lionel controller that has the two separate control handles if that makes any sense? I would use the one side for the layout, and the other for the accessories... What I a most confused is about the wiring
It is odd that MTH only chose to show the ITAD method with the signal bridge. I don't believe MTH sells a suitable relay module for the insulated trigger method. But there are several off-the-shelf relay modules that don't require soldering - for example Azatrax has one for about $10 (plus shipping):
The Azatrax application note shows it hooked up to a 2-aspect Red-Green so I modified it above to show how it could attach to your PRR 3-wire signal head. Your 2 control handles would be what they call "Train Power" and "Accessory Power".
If this is the only insulated-rail accessory you have, then buying one or a few of these ~$10 relay modules is the closest exit. OTOH if you have a handful or more accessories that are controlled by insulated-rail triggering, I have posted OGR threads on alternatives that get the cost/relay down to ~$2 per relay and we can re-visit if there's interest.
Thanks to everyone for your help! Very much Appreciated!!! Happy belated Thanksgiving!
Are using these relays still a good way to hook this up?
Yes.
I'm jaded, I use this. 
How far away should the activation occur from the signal bridge typically?
Stan, when I have the signal light hooked up light the image shows above, I am getting a lot of relay chatter which is making the lights go crazy. What could I be doing wrong?
Are you using the Azatrax relay?
Do you get chatter if the train is stopped on the insulated rail section with multiple axles connecting the outer rails?
Or does it happen only when rolling over the insulated section? In which case I'm thinking dirty wheels/track making intermittent connections between outer rails.
Yes I am using that relay, I was just trying to bench test hooking it up before taking it to the layout. When the car is sitting still in the block section it is fine, when I put it in motion that’s were I get the relay chatter
Clean wheels and track. I'll bet if you "press down" on your test car as you roll thru insulated section on bench that chatter drops dramatically.
I think of this like flickering lighted passenger cars. Heavyweights tend to flicker less because they are, umm, heavy making better wheel-track contact. But cleaning wheels and track always helps.
And if the flickering is still unacceptable then switch to DC technology (LEDs) where capacitors can store energy to demote flicker.
Likewise, after cleaning, if relay chatter in insulated rail triggering is still unacceptable then switch to DC relay technology where capacitors can store energy to demote chatter. There have been many OGR threads on this alternative. GRJ's ITSD mentioned earlier is one option that uses a DC relay and capacitor to demote chatter.
Thank I will try all of that, another question when doing an insulated rail with fastrack is it better to remove the pins or just cut the track?
@Casper posted:Thank I will try all of that, another question when doing an insulated rail with fastrack is it better to remove the pins or just cut the track?
When I used fastrack I just removed the pins. Not really hard to do and can be undone if needed!
What Darrell said plus, you need to remove the ground straps from underneath. The process is completely reversible, just be gentle with the tabs. I use Fastrack isolated rails to trigger my signals.
Would having this setup with the same power my switches are on a bad idea?
@Casper posted:Would having this setup with the same power my switches are on a bad idea?
It depends on what you're powering from the insulated rail. If it's something like the Lionel gateman or crossing gates with a solenoid to activate the action, I wouldn't share that with anything electronic on the same transformer.
I was just down this road a few months ago with trying to wire an MTH signal. I purchased a Azatrax MRD-1 to control the signal but didn't buy the relay at the same time. After talking to Azatrax (I believe Jeff is the owners name) I got what I needed. He was very helpful in working with me to get everything up and running.
Just installed some MTH signals on my layout as a pair, I used an insulated rail section as a trigger for one of GunnerJohns awesome signal drivers I got from Hennings trains. I wired it per the directions they had instead of the ITAD I used the signal driver. Signals work flawlessly with no chatter and no sparking on the rails.
I use the signal drivers for crossing signals and a gateman as well. Bit of extra wiring compared to just the rail but the reliability and no sparking is worth every penny.
@gunrunnerjohn posted:I'm jaded, I use this.
Nice packaging on this unit.
@gunrunnerjohn posted:It depends on what you're powering from the insulated rail. If it's something like the Lionel gateman or crossing gates with a solenoid to activate the action, I wouldn't share that with anything electronic on the same transformer.
Only thing being controlled by the insulated rail is the Mth signal bridge lights.
@Casper posted:Only thing being controlled by the insulated rail is the Mth signal bridge lights.
That shouldn't be an issue from track power.
@AGHRMatt posted:Nice packaging on this unit.
Thanks. I actually made these initially because our modular club needed a bunch of signal relays. I was building them on a little wooden block and hand wiring them. Then I realized that it would be much easier to do a PCB and make the construction job tons easier.
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