@John Meyncke posted:The "other" forum has always had a definite "Stepford Wives" quality to it. It's unpleasent in a way you can't quite put your finger on.
Thank you Steve for really clearing the air.
John
Exactly.
From my visit there, albeit a short one, earlier this morning the most active threads all appear to be gossipy, sanctimonious dribble.
Really a bunch of old women (with apologies to old women everywhere). 
@Allan Miller posted:Gee, maybe I should sign-up, too!
On second thought. . . nope, I'm sure I would be denied. Takes a while for folks unfamiliar with the "history" to catch-on, and that is totally understandable, but I think that most eventually do.
I was one of those who was unfamiliar with the "history" when the leader of OGF befriended me back in the summer of 2015. Through this forum, I found out we live a short distance from each other, I emailed him to introduce myself, and he latched onto me like nothing I've ever seen. It was right at the time he had his falling-out with OGR, but I didn't know about that because I was relatively new here, although not new to toy trains. We went to dinner at his home, he invited us to join him for dinner at York, he photographed my collection and posted it on MTF, you name it. I was so consumed by the fact that a perceived "big shot" in the toy train world would befriend me, a nobody, that not much else mattered. Over time, the pieces of the puzzle finally came together, and the reason he befriended me became clear, and boy did I feel foolish--still do when I think about it. Live and learn!! And.....HAPPY BIRTHDAY, HARRY!
Thank you, Steve, for providing the other side of the story; it needed to be presented.
John
As l am always interested in info on this hobby, and afraid l will miss something, l perked up at thinking "another source". Glad l ,as several prominent posters on here , never had before heard of THAT site. I have seen Heike's creations at York, and that work takes time.
I'll just say: I was called out by name in one of the OGF threads. Hopefully there are enough fellow train hobbyist on here that know me and know I am not as described by he that rules the delete button on the OGF.
Harry is working on a couple FP7's for me. He has been great to work with–What a legend. I don't mind the wait.
@laz1957 posted:Hi GUYZ,
Yes I was part of the OGF until recently being banned there. I have done a weekly thread called Whistle Stop Wednesday Videos, of a quick review of engines that I own and have some fun narrating it. I was banned telling the truth in which the management could not own up to. It was always someone else’s fault. This is suppose to be a fun hobby and there is not suppose to be drama in toy trains. I believe this is a brotherhood of people to enjoy this hobby and try are best to keep it alive and well. No DRAMA just fun and if we can help someone enjoy and learn from doing it themselves we are in a better place.
PS, Wondering if I can post my Whistle Stop Wednesday Videos, here at OGR?
No need to "wonder" my friend!! We will be proud to have you start posting your Whistle Stop Wednesday thread. Please do so in the photo/video forum and if you want, catch the rest of us up by sharing your previous OGF Whistle Stop posts!
@RJ Shier posted:I'll just say: I was called out by name in one of the OGF threads. Hopefully there are enough fellow train hobbyist on here that know me and know I am not as described by he that rules the delete button on the OGF.
RJ, you and I have discussed issues offline as I have with John @BlueComet400 and others. I want to keep this short, so we can hopefully get this thread to wind down. I'm sure Alan will make that call when he thinks it is appropriate.
I made a comment over there calling out one of their members who wrote that you and others even on this thread left on your own because of harassments. I should have quoted that member, but didn't. Then I see I was quoted, called out by name, and chastised for it in a pinned and immediately locked post. My intent was to get the member to show evidence, not beating up on their management. I thought about emailing the owner, but decided it wouldn't matter.
I just deleted my account over there, so if anyone hears I was kicked out, I wasn't. I left on my own.
I'm going to just say one thing about this forum, (thank you for letting us speak out frustration about this ) I look at your policy of no criticizing others' like I was taught and sometimes need to be reminded," if you can't say something nice about someone don't say anything."
@rtraincollector posted:I'm going to just say one thing about this forum, (thank you for letting us speak out frustration about this ) I look at your policy of no criticizing others' like I was taught and sometimes need to be reminded," if you can't say something nice about someone don't say anything."
I try not to post anything in an Internet forum that I wouldn't say to your face. That usually (but not always) keeps me out of trouble. 
@gunrunnerjohn posted:I try not to post anything in an Internet forum that I wouldn't say to your face. That usually (but not always) keeps me out of trouble.
That's good to know that about you John, especially when we meet at the next York! 
Reading all these posts removes any guilt I had over helping the “other board” lose their #1 “Corporate Sponsor” a while back. After reading a post where their head moderator shared his questionable views on a controversial major league sports mascot, I emailed the sponsor with a link to the post expressing my concerns that they sponsored a site where those views were tolerated. Within a week I noticed that sponsor’s image was missing from their sponsor’s page, but what’s funny is that 6-9 months later, the image is gone but you can see the html frame for it in the upper-left corner of the page and the link still works.
Maybe if they spent less time trashing other people and more time on web development, they wouldn’t have these issues lol!
This “conflict” is quite entertaining seeing as except for the regularly scheduled “custom run” announcements not a lot of model train activity right now.
***ETA*** Printed thread to a PDF.
@laz1957 posted:Hi GUYZ,
Yes I was part of the OGF until recently being banned there. I was banned telling the truth in which the management could not own up to.
As one that respected you as a person, enjoyed your weekly videos and supported them, I cannot believe you have stooped so low as to print falsehoods. Lets clear things up, you were not "BANNED" your account is still active. You have not asked to be removed. The truth is you just left, I can't see why its so hard to say, even indicate why you left. But to outright write a falsehood is unbelievable for an adult as yourself but rather the words of a child who doesn't get his way. Same for the post deleted you are so fond of. The original poster asked for its deletion for whatever reason. Even though you left, I would have still respect you, your reasons for leaving are not my concerns, but to outright lie as you have done, is unacceptable.
@josef posted:As one that respected you as a person, enjoyed your weekly videos and supported them, I cannot believe you have stooped so low as to print falsehoods. Lets clear things up, you were not "BANNED" your account is still active. You have not asked to be removed. The truth is you just left, I can't see why its so hard to say, even indicate why you left. But to outright write a falsehood is unbelievable for an adult as yourself but rather the words of a child who doesn't get his way. Same for the post deleted you are so fond of. The original poster asked for its deletion for whatever reason. Even though you left, I would have still respect you, your reasons for leaving are not my concerns, but to outright lie as you have done, is unacceptable.
I do believe he did ask as I have in the past but it seems I'm still a member, but probably won't be after the letter I sent Brian today. I honestly believe Laz believed he was.
A general comment about these banning claims.
On the MTF board a thread like this was posted with screenshots showing a person still had an account. However, that person then showed a screenshot of his login try and it wouldn't let him login saying the account was banned.
Could part of this banned/nonbanned controversy be attributed to a software glitch?
@rtraincollector posted:I do believe he did ask as I have in the past but it seems I'm still a member, but probably won't be after the letter I sent Brian today. I honestly believe Laz believed he was.
Laz knows better. Besides, check facts before making statements. Seems to much time taken up belittling Forums and people, rather then using it and the Forum for Train related posts. If I was an outsider and seen what is going on and reading, I would be turned off from joining or participating. What I'm reading are a lot of innuendos, rather then facts. I feel there are a lot of children here, that need to re-think their posts. Unless closed or deleted, will be a part of their heritage.
@tripleo posted:A general comment about these banning claims.
On the MTF board a thread like this was posted with screenshots showing a person still had an account. However, that person then showed a screenshot of his login try and it wouldn't let him login saying the account was banned.
Could part of this banned/nonbanned controversy be attributed to a software glitch?
Two different people. And yes, maybe a glitch. I am an administrator and Moderator for 2 History related Forum and a Flying Forum. I tried on 2 one time to get on after buying a new laptop and it said I was "banned". It took forever to find the glitch and what was causing it since several complaints came in with members also saying they were banned. We laugh about it now and when we disagree, we jokingly remind them and me that one time we were banned.-
@tripleo posted:A general comment about these banning claims.
On the MTF board a thread like this was posted with screenshots showing a person still had an account. However, that person then showed a screenshot of his login try and it wouldn't let him login saying the account was banned.
Could part of this banned/nonbanned controversy be attributed to a software glitch?
BINGO!! Plus I asked to be removed, as a member from OGF before seeing the screen saying banned from this site.
@laz1957 posted:BINGO!! Plus I asked to be removed, as a member from OGF before seeing the screen saying banned from this site.
You are not banned, asking to be removed or leaving is another thing. If you asked to be removed, then maybe banned came up. But, you were not banned and you know better. Be an adult and leave it, your words are what you will be judged by me and others that know. So less you write, might help. The hole you dug is deep enough.
Handling this in the manner in which Brian chose to tells you all you need to know about him and that forum. Many instances of posting his side and then locking the thread or in the case of Steve, asking him not to post due to a supposed conflict of interest. He opened that can of worms when he posted about Steve.
There must be a reason that forum only has 27 people viewing their forums as of a few minutes ago.
I'll stick with this forum - the gold standard in model railroad forums. Yes, I've had disagreements in the past with management but they've always acted professionally and treated me with respect even when it was me who was out of line. Relationships worth having allow for disagreements.
-Greg
@josef posted:You are not banned, asking to be removed or leaving is another thing. If you asked to be removed, then maybe banned came up. But, you were not banned and you know better. Be an adult and leave it, your words are what you will be judged by me and others that know. So less you write, might help. The hole you dug is deep enough.
Josef....all I can say is that you obviously have been drinking the OGF coolaid. I can tell you without any doubt that the banning is taking place and I think you know it. It is official as of 5 hours ago I got an approval notice that my OGF account was approved and yet when I try to log in, I get the banned notice. So "@josef", since you decided to take the posts here to a different level, you are now "banned" from this forum. Yep, I am dishing out a little of what I as well as others on this forum have received from those of you on the OGF. More to come if necessary. As your leader over there likes to say, get your popcorn and drink out and sit back and enjoy!
Three thoughts after reading this interesting thread.
There is a reason I deleted Facebook and other social media platforms.Thank you Steve for posting this.
Harry is a good friend and we talk often. We are pleased to have a number of his creations. I am glad to see the truth finally being told on this subject.
We have not been on OGF since we resigned and we too were locked out which is fine. Our E-mail has been jammed with comments in the last week about numerous negative topics that have appeared and many friends have posted here.
Beware what is written elsewhere. It seems that the truth is obviously like trying to catch a greased pig.
Thanks Alan for allowing this thread to be published. Paula and I appreciate your friendship.
In the FWIW category I was a member of OGF for a couple of years. I posted a little and lurked a lot. I would watch the board really light up when ever there was a chance to trash talk the OGR. During a discussion about the possibility of the OGR raising fees, which was not even accurate, there was a reference made to the OGR always quickly deleting "any" reference to the OGF. I felt driven to comment that it is the TOS of the OGR to do that. Holy smokes did I get trashed (and ALL IN CAPS) by people. I quickly removed my avatar and deleted as many posts as I could. I did not totally leave since they monitor when you post and if you don't do so within a certain time frame they will delete your account. Fine I thought, YOU keep track and YOU do that. Perhaps it will happen sooner now. Some of the original members seem to have an extreme hard-on for the OGR. Many are nice but man there are a few that ruin the entire thing. So I will continue to forego that board and stay with the quality offered herein. Thank you OGR forum and thank you OGR forum members.
To Bill and Bogie's point,
There are (on the other forum) no less than five (5) of these very recent trashing threads (opened or closed) at this moment. I shudder to imagine what would be discovered should one delve into the past.
This is all just terrible. Not good for the hobby or either OGF and OGR. To witness people I like and respect attacking each other is disheartening. We are all better than this.
@Traindiesel posted:This is all just terrible. Not good for the hobby or either OGF and OGR. To witness people I like and respect attacking each other is disheartening. We are all better than this.
I agree Brian. I definitely thought it was important for Steve to express Harry's side of the story but I think this thread is starting to do more harm than is worth it. I can understand Alan's frustration and pretty much like a dam breaking is letting off steam from years of mud slinging at this forum but I vote for the thread to be closed, even pruned and remain posted but I leave that to the admins.
@Traindiesel posted:This is all just terrible. Not good for the hobby or either OGF and OGR. To witness people I like and respect attacking each other is disheartening. We are all better than this.
Excellent point Brian, this is supposed to be fun! I still try to make it fun most of the time.
And you do, John!
Agreed... hopefully, there are lessons learned.
@gunrunnerjohn posted:Excellent point Brian, this is supposed to be fun! I still try to make it fun most of the time.
Yes and you and the others do, John. Unfortunately, some times the air has to be cleared by all sides.
So, IMUA or “forever forward,” which is The Kamahameha Schools’ (of Hawaii) motto.
The last thing I'm going to say is I nearly fell "hook, line and sinker" for the mindset of the other forum and its leader. I even canceled my membership here during the beginning of the pandemic because I didn't like some things that were said. Fortunately, I came to my senses, saw the error of my ways and asked to have my membership reinstated. The events of the past few days indicate that was a good call. Thank you, Alan, for agreeing to reinstate my OGR membership.
John
@BlueComet400 posted:The last thing I'm going to say is I nearly fell "hook, line and sinker" for the mindset of the other forum and its leader. I even canceled my membership here during the beginning of the pandemic because I didn't like some things that were said. Fortunately, I came to my senses, saw the error of my ways and asked to have my membership reinstated. The events of the past few days indicate that was a good call. Thank you, Alan, for agreeing to reinstate my OGR membership.
John
I'm glad you are back here, John!
A little humor: When I first read the OP's post, I thought that "the other forum" was referring to MTJ but do not remember seeing Harry's name mentioned there; especially a whole thread's worth. Upon further reading I found out that it was referring to OGF; which I had never heard of before.
@Mark Boyce posted: ...snip... I just deleted my account over there, so if anyone hears I was kicked out, I wasn't. I left on my own.
Wouldn't that be a badge of honor?
@PRRMP54 posted:Wouldn't that be a badge of honor?
😆😆😆😆
@gunrunnerjohn posted:Excellent point Brian, this is supposed to be fun! I still try to make it fun most of the time.
John...don't get me started on this topic...you and I have discussed the MTF and how similar but worse threads over there are allowed to go on and on.
@Yellowstone Special posted:Yes and you and the others do, John. Unfortunately, some times the air has to be cleared by all sides.
So, IMUA or “forever forward,” which is The Kamahameha Schools’ (of Hawaii) motto.
EXACTLY!
@BlueComet400 posted:The last thing I'm going to say is I nearly fell "hook, line and sinker" for the mindset of the other forum and its leader. I even canceled my membership here during the beginning of the pandemic because I didn't like some things that were said. Fortunately, I came to my senses, saw the error of my ways and asked to have my membership reinstated. The events of the past few days indicate that was a good call. Thank you, Alan, for agreeing to reinstate my OGR membership.
John, I always regarded you as one of the good guys, so I'm glad to see you back.
FWIW, you have to have a somewhat thick skin for many Internet forums, but there's only a handful that you need a suit of armor to participate in. I choose to avoid those forums.
@MartyE posted:I agree Brian. I definitely thought it was important for Steve to express Harry's side of the story but I think this thread is starting to do more harm than is worth it. I can understand Alan's frustration and pretty much like a dam breaking is letting off steam from years of mud slinging at this forum but I vote for the thread to be closed, even pruned and remain posted but I leave that to the admins.
Marty....PLEASE be patient. This thread NEEDED to happen. You know as well or better than anyone else. This time, I am bending our TOS a little and letting some steam go off for not only me but others that have been harassed by certain members of the "other side". We and I mean all of us at OGR have discussed this situation and are going to let this thread continue for a few more hours as we believe that Steve and Harry deserve at least one full day for folks to see the other side of the story.
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