New Dead Rail battery R/C forum

If there isn't, there should be. RCBP will reap the benefits in battery advancement from the automobile industries move to electric cars. No track wiring, and no 3rd rail if you don't want it.

Simon

Why limit the new forum to just O gauge , G gauge uses battery power also. The more people the better in my opinion.

Sorry Bob, I had forgotten about the expanded multi scale forums.  Actually G gauge battery R/C has been the major propeller of Dead Rail for years.

I spent 9 years in G before I had discovered 2 rail 0.  Still have G display pieces around the home.

No problem Tom Tee just wanted to expand the forum to help with its success

This sounds like a fine idea. Things are always changing........... and I have never enjoyed wiring!

Jim K

Sure.

I recently started thinking about this topic as I contemplate my next layout. With all the unknowns right now with manufacturer's control systems, now seems the right time to consider battery R/C. The money saved in wiring and control systems could be spent on battery R/C conversions. If I did decide to go that route, I could you use a forum section here because I would need a lot of help since my knowledge on this is very limited.

They're putting BPRC in HO and S as well, according to the guys on the FreeRails forum.  I have a couple of old spare BlueRail boards that might have a place to go in some of my old HO engines.

Absolutely agree. I have been fooling around with several applications (using 2-rail Gargraves, O gauge) for a number of years. I would love to see some interaction and have the opportunity to share knowledge on this forum. Thank you for suggesting it!

This is an area I have a lot of interest in. The controllers I am working on are RF and battery focused but also useable on powered rail installations.

I think the ideal controller would be something that gives the user the option to operate on legacy (not Legacy) systems but includes features not available on current systems.

I suggested a BPRC forum topic to OGRR staff 6 months ago. Maybe the time has come for it to happen.

I'd be a frequent reader.

VERY INTERESTED!!!  It would be my bookmarked landing page.

It could be an easy programing fix, just by editing the nomenclatures of the existing forums.  MTH (Now Atlas) has their control system and Lionel has TMCC, Legacy, ERR.  And then Lionel get's another forum with LionChief.  Why not just lump LionChief in with the other Lionel Control forum and make the existing LionChief and other R/C Systems the Battery and other R/C Systems?

As a matter of fact, I'm hoping to wrap up my next BlueRail Battery project shortly to share with you all.  I just need to decal and clear coat the engine shell.  Here is a sneak peak of my battery tender.  I posted a thread about this Kitbashed Transfer Caboose here.  It would be nice to post it in the newly created Battery forum.  It does not feel right posting something like this in the LionChief forum.

Being somewhat new to battery R/C,    I am still trying different things as far as switch and charging port locations.  

Having some delicate powered units I do not desire to remove them from the track for switching or charging purposes.

My favorite  access is under the water fill lid on a tender.  Push buttons on the angled face of a chamfered fuel tank, a discrete mini toggle just behind a brake shoe hanger.   2.5mm port tucked into the inside void of a fuel tank.

At this point none of my R/C units need to be lifted off the track for on/off or charging  purposes.

Dear TOM, et al ,

I also would follow the new Forum. Great Thread started by a Great Modeler.

The other night heading to the Cherry Valley 2 Rail Club , one of our younger members- age 24- driving up with me asked what I thought the future of scale model railroading would be and my reply was very simple-

BATTERY POWER. !!

I should mention I was driving my 2020  Tesla Model X while stating that and my cell phone was in my shirt pocket and I am replying to this thread on my battery powered lap top computer !!!

I wish the NMRA would take a look at creating standards for Battery Powered R/C as they did years ago that made DCC interchangeable and choice of manufacturers to choose from for scale model railroaders.

It is a shame that the 3 railer O Gaugers  have to either choose DCS or TMCC or invest in both systems.

Who said you can't teach a old dog new tricks !!!

See you at Strasburg on 04/17/21.

Regards, John

I have 3 battery powered engines.  All of them work better than my track powered engines because there aren't any conductivity issues from the track to the engines.  Yes, most of my track powered engines work just fine.  However, any engine that has a circuit board fail is going to get battery power.  NH Joe

We upped John's battery applications a notch to a pair of battery powered Catrike Dumonts (in my profile), exploring the old R.O.W.s  of  abandoned railroads at 30 mph.

Quite a variety of Battery R/C controls are available.  Many folks have been choosing the non sound units due to the economy and the fact each set includes it's own remote key fob style controller.  Five basic sets will provide five controllers which means five visiting folks can each run their own power unit which can also have added basic sound features.  All that for under $100 each, plus a battery.  Full feature units can be had for around $300 + battery and install.

Plus you will not need a $800. transformer.  Also, no track wiring at all, no blocks  or power zones, no insulated rails, any kind of complicated track work, turntable reversing is seamless.

I added several extensions to my RR and have no intention of running any track power to them.

@Tom Tee posted:

Being somewhat new to battery R/C,    I am still trying different things as far as switch and charging port locations. 

Having some delicate powered units I do not desire to remove them from the track for switching or charging purposes.

My favorite  access is under the water fill lid on a tender.  Push buttons on the angled face of a chamfered fuel tank, a discrete mini toggle just behind a brake shoe hanger.   2.5mm port tucked into the inside void of a fuel tank.

At this point none of my R/C units need to be lifted off the track for on/off or charging  purposes.

All my steamers have charging jacks on the tenders under a removable coal load.  Diesel charging jacks were installed wherever I could find a place, under a removable hatch, on the side or bottom of a fuel tank, or on the rear of the unit, like on a F3 or E7.

Here's where I have the jack and the on/off switch on my Weaver RS3:

Steamers stay on the layout, diesels are on a roll-around only because I don't have the space for them in the yard and run steam 95% of the time anyway.  I have 1 diesel that has the jack on the bottom (MTH NW2) which I have to turn on it's side to charge.  I hate it but until I figure out where else to put it....

I drew this "charging jack column" a while back but never did anything else with it.  Put the cord on a spring loaded spool that you could pull out and plug into the jack, then when done charging disconnect and let it roll back onto the spool:

Inductive charging would be ideal I think, just like charging a cordless toothbrush only at 9.6 to 12.0 volts, depending on what battery is used.

You have a great idea there. May I suggest that you don't need to use a spring-loaded wheel, but just do what the old telephone company switchboard used: A weighted cord that hangs down under the table. fewer things to go wrong, and much simpler.

@Arthur P. Bloom posted:

You have a great idea there. May I suggest that you don't need to use a spring-loaded wheel, but just do what the old telephone company switchboard used: A weighted cord that hangs down under the table. fewer things to go wrong, and much simpler.

The challenge with a weight is then you won't have any slack in the cord that is visible when plugged in.  Depending on the angle from the spout to the charge port, there could also be some added stress to the structure and the charge port.

Here is a neat modeling idea.  Just let the cord lay on the ground.

new dead rail forum would be nice

We do not have a forum as yet but we sure do have a strong thread with a specific title.

It is becoming quite apparent that battery powered operation is here  and increasing in popularity. My first venture was in 2011 with a NiMH battery. Since then, I have tested seven wireless RC systems with both NiMH and LiPO batteries and have authored eight published articles on battery power for OGauge. Think a forum topic on this subject would now be highly appropriate.

Here's one of Ed Reutling's videos on his RC engine.  Ed said the sound/noise was mainly from his oxygen system he had to use:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3tPXM1rHd0A

Alan has said he will add a BPRC forum topic for us. Hopefully, there will not be any technical issues with getting it going, keep an eye out for it.

Once it is available, I will be posting our design parameters for your comments.

Speaking of radio control, many decades ago I attended a "York-type" large meet/show in NYC that was entirely devoted to the model R/C hobby. I bought a few Robbe servos and a cheap xmtr/recvr combo to do some experimenting.

I have Googled to find out if such meet/shows/expos still exist, but have not had good results. Is there anyone here on the forum who has a parallel R/C hobby in planes or trucks or boats who might know what's up with the R/C hobby right now, and if there are public meets where the manufacturers all show up to display their products?  Or is all on-line marketing?

I received a battery power/RC locomotive from Trainworld today. It's not O gauge, but is a G gauge engine from Piko (made in Germany). Actually, this makes the second battery power/RC Piko engine I have. The first is a track cleaning locomotive, and the one that arrived today is also a 25-ton switcher, but without it's sister's track-cleaning capability. Both will be used on the small--very small, unfortunately--garden railroad I am planning to place in the fenced-in garden area we have outside our condo's sunroom. I have several G gauge building kits that will also find a home there.  I will stick exclusively with BP/RC simply because we do not have a convenient electrical outlet in the area at present, and although that may change at some point, for the time being I will stay with battery power. Also, of course, makes track maintenance much easier (meaning virtually none at all). I will post some photos once I get things up and running.

These small Piko locomotives require six AAA batteries. Rechargeable batteries are recommended by the manufacturer. Supposed to get 1-1/2 hours or so of running time per charge, which is fine with me. I will, of course, invest in a good charger and a number of extra batteries. The pocket-sized controller uses one of those flat, round watch-type batteries.

As long-time readers of the magazine may know, I have been a garden railroad enthusiast for many years, dating back to when LGB first became available in the U.S. I wrote the book "Getting Started in Garden Railroading" back around 1990, and I understand it sold very well.

I predict that battery power R/C will likely become commonplace in O gauge in just a few years as battery technology continues to advance.

@Arthur P. Bloom posted:

Speaking of radio control, many decades ago I attended a "York-type" large meet/show in NYC that was entirely devoted to the model R/C hobby. I bought a few Robbe servos and a cheap xmtr/recvr combo to do some experimenting.

I have Googled to find out if such meet/shows/expos still exist, but have not had good results. Is there anyone here on the forum who has a parallel R/C hobby in planes or trucks or boats who might know what's up with the R/C hobby right now, and if there are public meets where the manufacturers all show up to display their products?  Or is all on-line marketing?

Arthur,  Check in with almost any general hobby shop.  Ask them where local flying clubs gather.  There are several hobby shops in our area who are deep into R/C.  The vast array of equipment is startling.  My neighbor has his own R/C business with battery, piston and jet powered planes.  He sees model train R/C control as a rather basic & simple application.  His models admittedly only go forward however they also have to move left, right, up and down and then safely land.

We are concerned when we dent a model after a 42" fall,  flyers have total destruction when one of their models dive straight in to the ground at high speed from maybe a hundred feet or so.  All in all ours is a rather timid game.

I'm in ....I dabbled with it in large scale, several systems were available.

Airwire was a neat dcc based system a little more expensive but most large scalers had less locos than O gaugers!

Battery technology has moved forward   creating small and more powerful batteries

You can use smaller and easier to hide  audio jacks for charging connections

I used JST plugs on some applications and left them hang loose under rear of tenders

I had  r/c and batteries in trailing car and ran JST plugs to loco that way I only needed 1 system for multiple locos

Are the batteries and electronics on board a battery powered R/C locomotive electrically isolated from the trucks? Just wondering if one might safely run one of these on a command layout with the track voltage at 18V. It would be great if Legacy/TMCC engines could run along side battery powered ones on the same track at the same time.

Bob

Bob:

That is a design goal of our locomotive controllers; however, there is a twist.

We are exploring using the rail power to provide the energy to the motors on these systems. This would work when the rail voltage exceeds the battery voltage. The design goal is to have it work on AC, DC, and DCC with the same hardware.

In addition, in a full prototype-style dead-rail installation, the trucks have small resistors across the axles to make the block detectors work. These are small enough to not affect the track voltage system so again no interference.

We will be posting more details soon.

@Ron045 posted:

Actually, LC+ lends itself to battery power very simply.  I took the LC+ Camelback and in an hour I had a battery powered locomotive with full functionality, even smoke and electrocouplers.  It runs for well over three hours on a charge, and is even switchable between track and battery power.  It has two of the 9.6v 2000mah batteries in the tender, that's all that will fit.  The charging jack is on the side, so it meets Tom's criteria of not taking it off the tracks to charge.

Click on Graphic to enlarge.

Thanks, Jonathan. It would certainly be a plus if both Legacy and Battery R/C could be operated simultaneously. I would quickly embrace battery power if I knew that I did not have to abandon all my Legacy control equipment.

BTW, this is an informative thread and would support a dedicated forum for it.

Bob

I was thinking "neat idea" - but was also thinking it might be one of those sub-topics that gets a hit every three days.

I never check the "suggestion box" except now, by accident.  So it is great that management has agreed with Tom's suggestion.  And the "G" folks have hands-on experience, so include them.

I am with Alan - this is the future.  Ten years ago I predicted that it would take five years.  I was wrong.

What would kick-start it is a beginner toy train setup using Radio Shack type control along with realistic (maybe scale?) car bodies and toy train wheels and couplers - to get some kind of volume.  Best if Lionel does it - they have more of the market?

Then guys like me could gut the locomotive and re-install the cheapo equipment in our 2-rail scale models - you know, the ones without smoke, bells and whistles and chuff - and quit cleaning track for our once-a-month circuit around the loop.

I personally would rather spend $500 for an old Lobaugh Challenger than the same amount for a sophisticated 120 channel RF unit that can be addressed by the smart phone I am avoiding.

But in short - congratulations, Tom!  You are getting your wish.

What would kick start it is if you could simply unplug a dead DCS or TMCC system and install a BPRC into the same plug.  Come to think of it, that may be doable but I've always gutted my engines and started clean, other than the motor.

As GRJ mentioned, LionChief is an easy conversion to battery power. I posted a battery powered LC+ conversion on the forum in 2017. Details on this setup were published in the LCCA magazine in 2019. For the ultimate in low cost, in 2011 I constructed a loco RC  powered by a NiMH battery  and based on a 49MHz 2 channel receiver removed from a $10 Newbright toy car. This setup is still running perfectly today. Also, As Bob D. mentioned, except for the LionChief conversion, I have always stripped down to the motors and a bare chassis for each conversion.

We are in the process of making some forum category changes and will be offering this as a category and/or part of a combined category.  Stay tuned!

I agree regarding stripping the loco down. If you leave the original board it makes it easy to go back, but now you have to find a place for the new board. Ideally, the new board would replace the old board and use the same mountings. It would also be convenient to use the same motor and power connectors.

@OGR CEO-PUBLISHER posted:

We are in the process of making some forum category changes and will be offering this as a category and/or part of a combined category.  Stay tuned!

Alan. It's been awhile since you posted the above. I am in total favor of having a DeadRail fourm . Could you please acknowledge when this could take place? There definitely seems to be more interest in deadrail. When posting questions on the subject and having to do so in other Forums ( 2 rail , 3 rail, for example ) I feel that it causes congestion in those fourms and maybe some resentment with those members. It would also give those who want to share and discuss there ideas on a assigned forum .

Bill Grafmiller