Problem with two of my MTH Engines

If they take off without you starting them up, it's sounding like a board problem.

Do they run normally in conventional mode?  If they run in conventional, can you reverse directions?  Do they have sound?

Try a conventional reset: 1W5B. Drop voltage to slow it down if you can't get neutral 

The GE Evolution engines are both PS3 Premier. Is the Premier J also PS3? If so, check the DCS/DCC switch on each engine and make sure that it's in the DCS position.

This and a whole lot more about DCS is all in MTH’s “The DCS Companion 3rd Edition!" This book is available from many fine OGR advertisers and forum sponsors, or as an eBook or a printed book at MTH's web store!

The Premier J is also PS3, the switches are all in the DCS Position, I even flipped the switch to DCC then Back to DCS to make sure it is on DCS position. I will try the conventional running when I get home later tonight, as well has conventional reset. 

I was able to hook up a conventional loop tonight to running it in conventional and try a conventional reset. I was unable to do a conventional reset using my cw-80. The still take off as soon as I put power to the track, then slows down to the current voltage. It eventually will have the sounds it just seems to go around the loop I set up a couple of time before the sounds start playing. I was unable to change direction. So going off what I am seeing other people say and what I had happen, the diagnosis seems to be board problem. Unless someone has other options that I can explore. 

If they take off immediately in conventional or command, I am pretty sure you either have a short to the frame of a motor lead or the board has a problem.  I don't know why they'd suddenly fail like that unless they got stalled and cooked the motor drivers.

I don't know how they would stall and have the motor cook. I usually don't run many cars behind it, maybe at most eight cars, I don't think that would be to much for the engines to pull, and my layout is pretty much flat, may not be completely level but there is maybe a deviance of at most 1/2" , probably less than that. I pulled the Diesel Shell off, and didn't notice anything that could cause that. I can double check though.

Not the motor, but the driver FET on the circuit board is the suspect.

The MTH engines don't like the cw80!!

Have you tried the engines alone on a test track?

Maybe something is killing the DCS signal?

Engineer-Joe posted:

The MTH engines don't like the cw80!!

I remember reading that on here but that is all I have for an transformer that can run conventional. Since I mainly run power bricks, 18 volts to track is all I need since I run mainly command control.

Engineer-Joe posted:

Have you tried the engines alone on a test track?

Maybe something is killing the DCS signal?

Only problem with that is my other MTH Engines work fine, so I don't think the DCS signal was being "killed", that also doesn't explain why they took off as soon as I applied power to the track, since usually the just are in neutral and get the sounds ready to go. I had them running solo on  the conventional layout, no other cars or engines on the track.

How are you powering your TIU?

A Z-1000 to fixed in #1, then an out put to the track through Fixed #1 out

When they get locked into a direction, they will run as if in conventional mode. To fix, you would try a conventional reset. The problem is, the CW80 may just confuse them more. Have they been run with the CW80 in the mean while? (when they acted up?)

Only when I was testing to see if they run normally in conventional mode. Other then that I usually don't run conventional.

 I had a brand new MTH PS3 Conrail SD80MAC get locked in reverse. It happened when I assigned it to lead a consist in command DCS.

I did a conventional reset with my Z4000 and everything went back to normal.

 I had another engine come brand new in the box that did the same thing as yours. Again, I did a reset and it was cured.

That does not mean for sure that's your issue.

Here's a great video from Stan on the forum

Maybe you could take them somewhere with a different Lionel or MTH transformer?

Not many areas around where I live that have o-scale model trains, nor is their really a LHS nearby. I usually have to drive one hour plus for a LHS.

Wow, I see you are in Ohio. I would have hoped some shop would be closer.

http://mthtrains.com/20-3571-1

That J has a bad rep on this forum I swear! I wonder if the tether or the track has caused the engine to get confused by constantly cutting and applying power?

Of course, it could be a short, or board failure as John has stated.

Engineer-Joe posted:

Wow, I see you are in Ohio. I would have hoped some shop would be closer.

Unfortunately, since I leave in the area of the northwest corner of Ohio not many LHS around here, since it takes roughly an hour to the east to get to Toledo, an Hour to the West to get to Fort Wayne, like 3 - 4 hours to get the Stockyard Express, or if there is some in Columbus, OH that is also 3 - 4 hours.

Engineer-Joe posted:

http://mthtrains.com/20-3571-1

That J has a bad rep on this forum I swear! I wonder if the tether or the track has caused the engine to get confused by constantly cutting and applying power?

Of course, it could be a short, or board failure as John has stated.

I have had that engine in for repair once before, since the rear coupler wasn't work like it should have, as well as problem with the firebox flicker. That was repaired and has worked fine up until a few days ago.

 The only thing that crosses my mind is to get a Z500 or even better just the Z1000 controller for your brick. Then you could do the reset.

There's no guarantee that will cure the issues though. But you could recoup some cash if you sold the CW80. They just don't work with MTH very well that I've heard. Maybe something could be added to smooth out their power??? (too choppy?)

I wonder if you could post for help here on the forum for anyone close to you?

Do you know anyone then, with a different Lionel transformer?

I wonder if you could trigger a reset with a battery pack putting DC voltage down the rails? ( where's Stan??)

I am not sure anyone is close to me on the forum. No, I don't know anyone with a different Lionel Transformer

I had an engine do exactly as yours. A conventional reset would bring it back, but not permanently. It would also lose signal strength with a lighted dummy paired with it that a choke would not fix. I sent the board to GGG, he did his magic, and I have a great engine again. If you can't get to a conventional transformer, my advice is ...........see above.

get a hold of GGG, he fixed all my mth locos......great guy!

Could be several things here.  Remove all trains and place one of the PS-2 engines that work on the track and power up and while train is running around track run a DCS signal strength test.  What do you get?

As far as the PS-3, you really need a transformer that you can lower track voltage and also have a bell and whistle button to do a conventional reset.

If you can put just the PS-3 on track and run voltage at about 10-12 volts so the train does not run away.  Does it have speed control or immediately full speed?  Does it start up with sounds after running for 8-15 secs after the capacitor charges?  Can you do a DCS start up on the engine  with DCS to gain control, or does it not respond?

You could have two engines that failed together, but seem unlikely.  I am thinking something on your layout is effecting the DCS signal for the PS-3 engines and they are starting up in conventional, and are locked in a direction and move.  Getting them to respond to the conventional reset or unlock sequence is one method to test.  The other is gaining DCS control at a lower voltage and do a feature reset, and or factory reset.  G

I know it has taken me a while to get back. Been working on other things not train related. When I do the DCS Signal Strength Test, I get 9 and 10s for signal.

When it comes to running the Conventional control as soon as I start applying power to the track they take off at full speed. Then it will change and match the voltage I have on the track. It does get the sound after the 10 - 15 seconds, then it has the sound catch up to the current speed.

If I remember correctly, seeing as I haven't run any trains for a while, I believe I can hit start up on the DCS remote and gain control of the Engine, so perhaps I should try doing a factory reset that way. If that doesn't work I guess I look into getting a different Transformer.

Can't he do a conventional reset>lock direction in neutral which wouldn't solve his problem but might prevent the "run away" when power applied?

willygee posted:

Can't he do a conventional reset>lock direction in neutral which wouldn't solve his problem but might prevent the "run away" when power applied?

Good idea...

 Although slightly complicated  the dcs remote can do a conventional reset ... Set up a var channel to var mode.... turn off the dcs signal..... scroll the voltage up to around 10 volts..... Use the horn & bell buttons on the dcs remote for the reset combination.  

I got those to engines running mostly. The GE Evo runs like it should after a factory reset on the DCS Remote. The N&W 611 I got working again for a while then one time when I shut off the track power, it took off again. Got that one working again. I think I need to add a few more power feeds, that may help stop it from doing that in the future.

I'm not one of the experts, but I don't think power feeds have anything to do with your problem.

I am not sure they do either, I just know I need to put some more on

You mention using 18V power bricks...what brand?