Switches: Manual vs Automatic

I don't have a layout yet. I used to think I wanted all 022 auto switches. After years of thinking and building Christmas layouts, I now plan to use 042 manual switches. At least for most of them. 

If they are close enough, I might twist a lantern. But that's it.

  I really hate my manual brown 0-27s with the low to ground slide lever. Too hard to reach over the housing if faced away. One of these days I might ad a wire to throw them without reaching in.

In general I like my antiderails. I have some of the 0-27 wired for constant voltage which means the always snap and are never slow to move because the loco is creeping or loco needs lower volts to not "fly".

Actually, the lamps are usually the only big draw from a bunch of turnouts. You only use one turnout at a time normally.  (unless they are grouped close, then the antiderails might operate at the same moment and really effect the trains a lot... Which is why constant power is used on the full O line turnouts).

I'll second the hatred of those 027 switches. Luckily the I gauge manuals I speak of have a robust cool looking lever on top.

With decades of "walk around" layouts with manual switches under my belt, I will offer the following:

* IF the layout is linear, then for long-term satisfaction there needs to be the ability to walk along with the train. (I can't imagine having to get up from a stationary control stand, walk over to a switch, throw it, then walk back to the control stand, etc, etc.)

* All manual switches MUST be within easy reach. Depending on bench work height, that will mean no more than 24"-30" from the edge of the layout.

Given the above two factors are met: Manuals switchers are a much more "hassle reducing" alternative to powered switches.

Best of luck!

Andre

Of the seventeen switches on my layout, three are automatic due to reach.  The rest are thrown as I walk with the train.  Back in the day when we were tied to a control panel auto switches were desirable, command control frees us from that constraint.

@necrails posted:

.... command control frees us from that constraint.

Concur.  I am using powered switch machines for my main line (central iPad control, crossovers, non-derailing), but many yard and siding switches are in easy reach for switching operations.  With command control, you are right there with the engine.

I looked at using powered switches on my O27 “door layout” but the conclusion I came to, was that they were more trouble than they were worth. Don’t forget that you also need to allow space so that the train doesn’t sit on the switch rail, constantly powering the solenoid. Those inches add up. 

Even when there was 30' of straights, I never walked with the trains unless I was an observer vs engineer. 

I usually sat at the control panel and threw the points.

Ahh, command remotes... that explains some of it.

And I do follow them on room to room carpet layouts, but that's because it's out of sight for so long. I just as often sit in my bedroom and wait for the return trip from the kitchen while messing with something else. 

For me it is a matter of aesthetics. My fat giant hand inserted into the scene destroys my suspension-of-disbelief and it is no longer a tiny  actual train. Thus I use remote control track switches. For the same reason I use remote uncouplers for all that work. I rely on my home-brew car-stoppers to make coupling of lobster-claw couplers reliable at slow switching speeds, again keeping the gigantic 0-5-0 hand out of the picture.

Although they are way out of scale I find the Fastrack switch lanterns believable:

The Panhandle now has 42 switches planned.  One is totally unpowered and will be mounted in the correct aspect.  The rest will have both pushbuttons (mounted in the fascia) and be controlled via TMCC.  A large number of switches are along the main line and can be thrown by operators following their trains.  

I am hoping that all will function correctly (yeah, I know Murphy is a real SOB ).  If I encounter a problem that simply won't go away, I plan to look at manual controls like Bluepoint.

George

You’ve asked a really good question, manual versus remote control switches? My nod is for remote control TMCC command version  with a push button option placed near the switch if possible, as all of my switches are Ross or Atlas O. My Ross Switches (DZ1000’s) are wired for Non-Derailing, the Atlas O frog springs allow for non-derailing built into the switch. I have 44 switches, 10 of which are wired in pairs with 1 button control both. Now that I’m retired and hopefully this fall I can work on the layout more, I plan to make sure each switch works perfectly, and use the Route button on my Cab 2/ Cab 1L. Remote control can be troublesome, but, that’s just part of the fun in playing with toy trains. The Lionel 022 electric switches with connection to the voltage plug should work pretty good, my issues are it’s just to small a diameter, I wanted wide radius curves to enable me to run almost any O Gauge locomotive or car made, so far I’ve been blessed. I’m sure there’s good reason to go manual, it’s simply an operators choice. Happy Railroading Everyone.

For reversing loops, there is no sense paying extra and having extra controls for remote control switches.

My L-shaped layout has 11 O42 switches, all of them RC by K-Line except for one manual switch which goes to a spur siding where the DINOSAUR TRAIN is parked when not in use by my 7-year old great grandson. The 10 RC switch controllers are mounted on a convenient pull-out drawer at the control center. I rely on the anti-derail function to keep a train on its route.

Mike Mottler      LCCA 12394

@Old Newbie posted:

For reversing loops, there is no sense paying extra and having extra controls for remote control switches.

?....Even if right they're right in front of you, that's were the electrics shine with anti-derail. You really don't need any controller at all unless you want run the rev. loop the same direction twice in a row and a third pass does that even if no contoller is there.

Even real turnouts used powered methods to throw some points more remotely.  (funny though, proto, the remote turnouts are more likely manual and the ones "close to the controller" (person) would be the powered ones. We do the opposite, lol)

@Adriatic posted:

  I really hate my manual brown 0-27s with the low to ground slide lever. Too hard to reach over the housing if faced away. One of these days I might ad a wire to throw them without reaching in.

 

@MattR posted:

I'll second the hatred of those 027 switches. Luckily the I gauge manuals I speak of have a robust cool looking lever on top.

There is one real advantage to the MPC 1970 and on, designed brown-color base 027 manual switch track: That low horizontal slide lever makes it real easy to string them up for operation using nylon fish line. Then I use a couple of cut wood dowels with a small hole drilled in the center, one painted red and the other green, as my direction indicators.

For switch tracks within easy reach, and in areas I want the extra space, I have gone to the trouble to cut down the 027 switch base. It does open up more layout track configurations and frees up valuable space on a small layout. Though I no longer go to the trouble of painting them as I did with this one.

Caboose Industry manual throws.  2008S  works best.  

Having just gotten back into this "sport" after a 50 year absence, I'll throw in my experience.

My original huge HO layout way back when had all automatic switches.  Pretty neat when you are 14 or 15, to sit with all of those switches in front of you, pressing the buttons, hearing the buzzes and then the clicks.  You feel like "an adult."

But now, getting back into it on an O scale basis, I have just completed a layout with 6 switches, and I made them all the old-style Lionel 041 switches, with the revolving lantern and the big red upright lever.  A key here is that they are all within easy reach, no further than 12 to 16 inches from the front edge of the layout, and all within about a three foot horizontal area.

I find that I just LOVE reaching over an pulling those red levers when the train is coming around the big bends, heading for the switches.  The switches make a nice click sound when you throw them, and you really feel like you are involved with the moving train and layout.  In modern terms, they make it a more "interactive" experience.  I also like seeing all of those red and green lights come on when I plug in the transformer.  It makes the whole board come alive and lets me know that current is running everywhere.  And, best of all, it makes you feel like "a kid."

I would suggest that you buy a couple of these old switches, install them in places within easy reach, and just see if you like operating them.  You may be surprised.

As a caveat I would add, that I don't "do" railyards.   I've never liked them.  Nothing under the sun more boring to me than backing trains up over switches and turning the tracks off.    And, I just don't think anybody would enjoy hand throwing the switch levers just to back engines or cars in or out of a yard.

Does anyone have any experience with the TinMan 027 switches?  These are Lionel or K-line switches modified to include the non-derailing feature (if necessary) and operate off accessory power. I am working on an 027 layout with some 042 &  054 curves. I know I need to optimize switch performance as much as possible. 

CAPPilot, I’m interested in Ipad control in the near future, tell us how that’s working out for you if you would. Also CAPPilot, do you use route control on your neat layout?  Although Caboose Hobbies hand throws are convenient, I just can not use them as many of my switches are out of my reach. I have 5 levels interwinding through my layout and my Aim is Route Control through the Legacy System. We run 5 to 7 trains at one time snd via Legacy Command it’s smooth and fun.  All of my track is connected together, it takes quite awhile to go from the bottom to the top, and back. My layout is 24 years old, most all of the track is ballasted, and trains run smoothly. I would think anyone getting into the hobby today would want all the bells and whistles available, such as Lionels Legacy System.  (Everything on my layout can be controlled via the Cab 2 or Cab 1L., blocks, Switches, all engines with ID’s, Lash Ups, Trains, etc.) I would not want to sit in a chair with a control panel to run trains, it’s to much fun walking around the layout watching the trains run through the scenery, up the hills, into the tunnels, around the mountains over the bridges, you see the picture. I’m 76 soon and love the exercise staying in shape, we have to stay active or we won’t be able to have the fun that this Hobby offers. Great thread, I like the automatic switches. Happy Railroading 

Because TinMan deals in refurbished and rebuilds, his stock can vary. Most likely original Lionels for the shear numbers produced; but you should ask if you have a preference, he may have both.  They were always fast to respond to mail in the past.

He posts here too; pretty freindly. I think he is tinman3rdrail vs Tin Man.

Learn to modify the 0-27, etc. turnouts to accept constant power vs track power. That's #1; the rest is mostly odd equipment combo situations to tackle when they appear.  

Larger dia turnouts can give you better angles in the S to parallel, and closer parallel lines, off a Y 

Fat Driver Marx want metal frame Marx 0-27 turnouts.