What would be a good retirement area in the southwest for model railroaders?

Sacramento, CA comes to mind. Several toy train clubs, lots and lots of real railroading, summers are hot, but winters are not that cold. Plenty of hiking/fishing/traveling opportunities. Lots of antique cars, if you are into that also.

 

Affordable housing, especially out in the country. Cute girls everywhere, but way too young for a retiree.

 

 

Ace, you should at least check out the Phoenix area, depending on how well you tolerate the summer's heat.  Otherwise, eight months of delightful weather.  Lots of train activity with a very active TCA division, an independent club active with modular layouts and another independent club with their own permanent layout in the fabulous Scottsdale Railroad Park.

 

If you would like a more four season climate, then here in the Prescott area we also have a very active all gauge club and tremendous outdoor activities.  Lots of railfanning opportunities just north of on the BNSF main line too.

 

Finally if your main criteria is the wealthy widows, then Sun City in the Phoenix area is your bet.  Even there, the surviving males have a couple of nice scale model railroad clubs when you are not too busy being chased by the wealthy widows.

In years past it would have been San Diego at the top of the list, San Diego Model RR Museum. Although there are still some areas nearby that aren't to over priced thanks to the real estate bubble burst, but we still have some crazy tax policies.

Now, if you don't mind summer heat, the Phoenix/Scotsdale area would be at the top. Here's a link http://therailroadpark.com/ .

Seattle....

 

Attributes: wonderful temperate climate, fresh foods, natural surroundings, good train history, only two hours to Palm Desert in winter...

If I come out of here, the midwest, I will head for the Phoenix area, if not there, then the Tucson are is fine with me too.

 

Outside of these 2 areas, then the Tampa Fla area comes to mind, not the west, but nice weather and people.

 

Rod

By plane, of course.

I set out to move to Phoenix right out of school.  No jobs so went on to San Jose,

ran out of money so fled back to the Midwest.  It was 100 plus when I was last in

Phoenix.  My favorite part of the SW is SW Colorado..the Silverton and train history

galore, but, I have never been in Durango in the winter..(was in sub-zero Denver

helping people jump start cars).  With a ski area just north of Durango, and Telluride not far away, there are no palm trees around the old D&RGW station.  I have thought maybe Albuquerque or Santa Fe, as warm enough in the winter, and close enough to Durango in the summer to get up there on weekends if not daily.  Dunno about train clubs, doubt if Santa Fe has anything...was at a TTOS? convention in Albuquerque, so know there is train interest there.  Ideally, it is Colorado in the summer, Arizona in

the winter (as practiced by some motel owners), but maintaining two homes has all

kinds of hassles, security, etc.

I would want to visit all these places in the winter before I committed, spending some time there...fly before you buy....

my pick............anywhere along the bnsf "transcon"........jim

I just retired this past year and there is no place like the North east about 35 miles west of Philly. I like the four seasons and I hate the heat so the south west, south is out and somebody mentioned California----are you kidding me!!!!! How could I move from my family any way. If I did move, it would be north, the colder the better for me.

As a life-long California resident, the situation in California is becoming untenable (don't get me started.) If you absolutely have to have the nice weather, you'll pay a hefty price.

 

I'm trying to get to Texas. North Texas has a climate roughly comparable to San Bernardino, CA -- warm to hot summers, cool to cold winters (maybe some snow and hail.) I've been there during all four seasons. Houston is a little cooler, but more humid. Train stores are a bit sketchy as to O scale/O gauge, but a little more H.O. is available. There are a few O gauge clubs in the Dallas Area -- DFW O Scalers (2-rail), Lone Star Hi-Railers (and a couple I can't remember now that I'm posting.) An H.O. Free-Mo group just started -- NTxF for North Texas Free-Mo (a great modular concept for pure operation, but impractical for O gauge for now.)

Unless you truly love baking, IMHO avoid the Phoenix/Scottsdale area. It's true that 8 months are delightful but from mid june to October, heat of 110 degrees upward is not uncommon or fun except for the most hardy elderly. In the northern USA people cocoon during winter, but likewise in Phoenix the hot summer months are when the residents also retreat, albeit to their air-conditioned home cocoons. As for it being a dry heat with no humidity, open a hot oven door and breathe in for awhile, that's dry heat too! What's to be said about an area where road crews work during the dark evenings when the 2-3 am temps dip to 105-110 degrees because working under the hot summer sun is unbearable. And the outside strip shopping centers and malls, with their outside misters constantly misting, any mist coming from them evaporates before it even touches one's skin. I've a stepdaughter who's lived there for 5+ years and am speaking from experience. (Their sales tax certainly isn't the lowest to be found either.) As for summer storms, don't fret about rainstorms but did you happen to see today's news reports of the red dust storms which just blanketed that area again. At least thick fog will not cause or aggravate breathing, but dust cutting visibility to near zero while leaving a reddish coating on everything - the aftermath and cleanup for that IMHO is not my idea of retirement fun. 

I've got my sights set on the Prescott AZ area. I spent some time out there late last spring and liked what I saw. Looks to have a good change of seasons with as much winter as I'd ever want. Plus, you can take a day trip north for snow (if you really want it!) or about the same distance south for really milder temps.

 

Craziest thing was that I'd been wanting to scout out Prescott for years. So there I was in my motel room in Sedona getting ready to head out and finally see Prescott.

 

I turn the TV on and the top story was the big fire on Whiskey Row in downtown Prescott. I thought to myself --- figures!!! --- I waited one day too long --- the place went and burned down just before I got there!

 

But, things were under control when I got there, and I still had a great time, and hope is still alive for an escape from northeast winters someday.

 

Jim

Having lived in Phoenix, Atlanta, Nashville, Lexington, Philadelphia, NYC, NJ (Bergen Co.),Long Island, Hartford, Albany and Syracuse among other places, I'll take the Adirondacks of Upstate NY (where i now live) or Vermont. Hate the heat - don't mind the cold (can work on the model RR in the long winters!!), and find the actual cost of living is lower than ALL the previously mentioned places.

jackson

Many Thanks for all of the interesting input. I'm still years away from a full retirement but I am seriously looking for a wintering area for perhaps January through April. I appreciate warmer/milder winters which help keep my BP down - I am more active outdoors if it isn't cold and wet or snowy. Sacramento and Arizona are the possibilities I am leaning towards so far.

 

Many Thanks again, and any further suggestions or details are greatly appreciated!

If your a liberal California is paradise, if not its the worst place in the world. I don't like rain but it does get afully dry and dusty by the middle of summer. I see on the news huge dust storms in the Phoenix area. They have books in big librarys that tell of the weather, taxes, cost of living, house prices and so on for different areas. If Calif. expect constantly increasing taxes and all kinds of screwball laws to aggervate you.

Having lived in Northern New Mexico for a period of time in my life, and spent time exploring places to call home in Colorado, Arizona, Utah, Texas/ Oklahoma, and California, from my perspective I would choose either New Mexico or Colorado.  Climate lets you experience all 4 seasons, but at the same time its dry and depending on the altitude, varies from hot to not so hot during the summer months.

My wife & I prefer the mountainous region/ Front Range corridor ourselves (ABQ, Santa Fe, Colorado Springs, Castle Rock/ Denver Area).  There is plenty to do outdoors wise, and there is plenty of railroad history in both states.  Cost of living is quite reasonable in both states.  Santa Fe is pricey, but the Duke City is pretty moderate, and in Colorado its fairly reasonable across the state except in the Ski Resort locales.

Did anybody ever tell you that you look like Freewheelin' Franklin?

 

I went through the same decision process about 10 years ago when I retired from an international career. Spent several months over a period of three or four years driving around the interior West, finally narrowed it down to a choice among Tucson, Boise, and Albuquerque. All three offered nice scenery and outdoor recreation, reasonable cost of living and real estate, and fairly low taxes. Trains were not actually a consideration, I figured I could play with trains anywhere. I ruled out California because of cost of living, taxes, and gun laws. I had lived in Phoenix for a few years before going overseas. Wasn't interested in going back there due to extreme heat, pollution, congestion, and some problems with access to outdoor recreational areas I had enjoyed back in the 70's.  

 

Here are some pros and cons among the three:

 

Boise

Pro: Great climate. Warm and dry in the summer, mild winter. It can snow in the morning and be 50 and sunny in the afternoon. Very scenic. Fantastic outdoor recreation year-round. Hiking, river running, skiing, you name it. Friendly. Very cool downtown, but small. 

Cons: A small town, a long ways from anywhere. Nearest decent shopping in Salt Lake or Seattle. Non-diverse. A long way from most of my friends and family.

 

Albuquerque

Pro: Nice climate. Skiing nearby. Easy run up to Santa Fe, a neat place to spend a day or a weekend. Decent outdoor recreation, not as good as Boise but still attractive. Right on major east/west and north/south Interstates. 

Con: Kind of gritty. Highest crime of the three finalists. Least scenic of the three. The high altitude moderates the climate, but with the thin air and brilliant sunshine the sun can bake your face while the rest of you freezes.

 

Tucson

Pro: Very scenic, nice reddish color to the rocks. The Sonoran Desert is the world's greenest and most lush because it has two rainy seasons. Nice vegetation, saguaro cactus, mesquite and palo verde trees. Interesting wildlife - coyotes, bobcats, javelinas, hawks, owls, assorted reptiles. Lots of good places to hike, plus attractions such as the Sonora-Arizona Desert Museum and Saguaro National Park. Convenient to the Mexican border if you like to go to Mexico every now and then. Better shopping than Boise or Albuquerque, but still not great. Reasonably convenient location on I-10, good for me because I have family in Phoenix and an XGF in San Diego. The most upscale of the three, depending on where you live. Hot in the summer, but way cooler than Phoenix where I used to live. Climate is fantastic October through April. Good university, as well as a highly regarded community college where I picked up a part-time teaching job. 

 

Con: Hot in the summer. Lousy skiing; there's a local area but it's only open when it snows. You have to drive up to Flagstaff for half-decent skiing. Downtown is kind of crummy but improving. City government is run by imbeciles and lunatics. Town is really spread out; you burn a lot of gas getting around. Anglo and Hispanic communities are very separate, almost like two different cities. That was a disappointment to me as I am bilingual and used to live in Mexico, I was hoping for more of a blend. 

 

I finally moved to Tucson and I am quite happy here. As far as trains go, we have the Gadsden Pacific Toy Train museum which is kind of a hybrid between a train club and a museum. There's a big 0 gauge layout, plus all the other gauges and an outdoor 7-1/2" gauge loop that will be opening later this year. Phoenix is 2-3 hours away, with an assortment of clubs and train related activities. San Diego is an easy day's drive with an interesting railroad museum in the east county plus the excellent 0 and HO setups in Balboa Park. 

 

Here's a picture of the o gauge part of the  toy train museum.

 

This is the view from my neighbor's balcony, showing my back yard and the Catalina mountain range beyond. 

 

 

And here's the view from my backyard, during one of our very rare snowstorms.

 

And finally, a local critter that showed up outside my workshop one fine morning. Gila monsters spend most of their lives underground, but this one was enjoying an excursion in the shade of a mesquite tree.

I've got my sights set on the Prescott AZ area. I spent some time out there late last spring and liked what I saw. Looks to have a good change of seasons with as much winter as I'd ever want. Plus, you can take a day trip north for snow (if you really want it!) or about the same distance south for really milder temps.

 

Craziest thing was that I'd been wanting to scout out Prescott for years. So there I was in my motel room in Sedona getting ready to head out and finally see Prescott.

 

Jim, Great that you are looking into the Prescott area!  If you make another scouting trip here, let me know and I will introduce you to some of the tinplaters in our area and offer any information or help I can.

 

Peter

AFTER READING ALL THE RESPONSES , I SEE NOTHING IN ANY THAT WOULD TRUMP THE TEMPLE TO DALLAS /FORT WORTH CORRIDOR . TEMPLE HAS A STRONG SOUTHERN PACIFIC HERITAGE AND A GREAT CLUB , WACO GREAT CLIMATE , WITHIN DRIVING DISTANCE OF BOTH DFW AND HOUSTON , BOTH HAVE NUMEROUS FANTASTIC HOBBY SHOPS AND MANY MANY CLUBS OF ALL BENTS. NO INCOME TAXES , GENERALLY THE CHEAPEST GAS IN THE COUNTRY , A FEW HOURS AWAY FROM MEXICO FOR YOUR PRESCRIPTION DRUG AND MONTHLY BOOZE RUNS , OVERALL IT COULDN'T BE BEAT BY ANY PLACE ELSE IN THE COUNTRY.

 

Peter,

 

Thank you. I hope to get out there again in the next year or two. Will definitely take you up on your offer. I'm still a few more years away from being able to make any move though.

 

Jim

Basement!!??  What I haven't heard mentioned is basements.  What I'd long heard

about the world's largest old folks home (Florida) is that there were no basements,

so not a good place for model train nuts.  My brother kept a condo there for years

but I only made two visits to Fla., one on business, and another circle tour in which

I hit train, scenic, and historic sites.  Having been to the SW many times before that, Fla. did not and does not appeal.  But what about basements in these other sites?  I finally, and a lot later in life than I would have liked,  got a house with a decent basement and garage.

I am not sure basements are common in some of these SW locations, either?  In

the heat of some of these areas attics would be no answer. So....???

Remember to take into account the elevation of an area when looking at paces in the south west.  The low humidity (dry heat) also makes for a dry cold.  You could be very unpleasantly surprised by very large over night temperature swings which will not be reflected in daily "averages".  There will also be no warning of frost since there is little or no moisture.  We were driving across the New Mexico/Arizona border in late October a couple of years ago.  It was brisk when we went to bed at 10PM (like 48 degrees).  It was 17 degrees when we woke up at 7 AM.  We were in Gallup NM which has an elevation of 6500 feet!

North Texas (DFW area) has a lot to offer.  Check out cost of living, taxes, great quality of life, reasonable weather (yes it does get hot in the summer).  There are a couple of modular train clubs in the area, and our local TCA chapter has 130 members and is quite active.  The Lone Star division in Texas is also active.  The division has 4 train shows and meets each year.  Train shops are virtually non existent in the local area.  If you decide to give us a look, contact me.

IMHO-before i state my say, i would like to state that i was born & raised in Tx(traveled in the navy) Stay out of Tx!!! To hot, to humid, to far to drive, to many tornado's Ive been to all the places mentioned, my pick would be- Idaho, Arizona, New Mexico, i say visit them in both winter & summer then decide! Just my 2¢!

 

That's one reason I started looking at the Prescott area. Higher elevations to the northeast and lower to the south - not a bad drive to either climate zone when you're in the mood for a change.

 

Jim

To address the question of basements - most houses in the interior West are built on slabs. Basements are rare. The reason for this is quite simple - the ground out here is as hard as concrete and you would need explosives to dig a basement. The basic complement of garden tools around here includes a pickaxe and a digging bar. When the crew from the nursery comes to plant a tree in your yard, they bring a jackhammer. The  reason houses in the Northeast and Midwest have basements is that you have to dig a foundation anyway in the soft ground, and once you have the hole dug, it's easy and cheap to add utility space by putting in a basement. 

 

The good news is that builders in the West understand the need for utility space, and medium to larger size houses frequently have a "bonus room" that is intended for flexible space - home office, billiard room, entertaining, etc. A bonus room is generally big enough for a decent size train layout with a small workshop area. Bonus rooms are typically located away from bedrooms, so noise and dust do not become a problem. 

 

The other option, if you have a reasonable size piece of land, is a separate building. A lot of properties in Tucson feature a guest house or "mother-in-law house" for winter visitors, etc. I got lucky when I bought my place - a previous owner was a contractor and he had built a 1000 sf workshop out back, with a garage door, four skylights, a home office, a 3/4 bath, and full plumbing stubs for a kitchen so it could be converted to a guest house. There's even a 230v outlet in the floor for the table saw. The home office is now my train room. Outbuildings like this are pretty common in the Southwest and provide an ideal solution for trains. 

Oh c'mon, Southwest Hiawatha.  Is that fair to make all us train afficianados drool over the description of your train building??

 

I wouldn't give .02 for any of the several TX cities I've been in.

 

Ace, I won't mention the attributes of southeast Virginia and North Carolina, since you specifically mentioned that your interest is in the southwest.  You started quite a discussion, though, one that I'll bet goes on for a while.

I'll throw my two cents in for Colorado...particularly the Upper Arkansas River Valley (Salida, Buena Vista) in central Colorado. I retired here after living in Chicago all my life.  Why? Two reasons: summer and winter!

 

Advantages over AZ, NM,Texas and other SW;  Not as hot and low humidity.  We in fact are over-run by Texans in the summer coming up to escape the TX heat. Even though it does get hot in the summer, not as hot as Denver or the front range because were at 7500 -8500 ft., it cools significantly at night. We've been here 8 years and do not need AC at all.  Home is well insulated, and oriented and designed to stay cooler in summer and warmer in winter.  Also designed it with a walkout basement which includes the "train room"  There are basements here, mostly walkouts when homes are built on sloping land.  They are great for getting in light and being cooler/warmer due to insulating factor of the earth around it.

 

Winters are mild which is why we are called the "Banana Belt"  300" of snow 30 minutes away at Monarch Ski Area but in the valley you can play golf and bike after skiing!  The reason?  There's a 14000' ft high "snow fence" on our West - the Continental Divide.  I have a 600' foot south facing driveway and in 8 years I've onlyhad it  plowed three times.

 

If you are a outdoor enthusiast it's perfect; cycling, hiking, skiing, snow-shoeing, fly fishing, rafting (the Arkansas R. is the most rafted river in the US).  Golf courses are pretty basic stuff.  You'd eed to go to Denver or CS for top level courses.  Also, Coloradans are noted to be the most fit and least obese of all the U.S. That was on ABC just this morning. Not sure if that rubs off on transplants when they move here.  Ha Ha. 

 

Cost of living is quite low compared to many places.  Real estate taxes are a dream compared to the East and Mid-west. 

 

Great Railroad history and lots of tourist trains nearby.  Amtrak is as close as Denver, Glenwood Springs (the CZ) and Lamar and Raton, NM (the SW Chief) Lots of old roadbeds on which to hike and explore; the Alpine tunnel, Marshall Pass, Tennessee Pass, Monarch Spur is now a short paved  trail leading out of Salida.  Salida had been a division head for the DR&G, with both std and narrow gauge yards, RH's, TT's and shops.

 

Disadvantages:  Few model train shops.  There's Caboose in Denver, and Mizell's we know has closed.  I need to check out the one in Louisville.  CO Springs has two.  The one on Garden of the Gods is fine.  Owner is a former Chicagoan and is a fun guy to talk with.  I've ordered an item or two with him.  The other shop is on Academy BLVD. and has limited O-gauge. It has lots of books and other scales.  They use to have lots of used O-gauge but now the selection is way down.  Also, getting to an airport, DEN or COS, is a pain, especially in winter when mountain passes close or get difficult.  You'd be 2-3 hours from an urban area for shopping, typical city entertainment, etc.

 

The Salida train shop is on US 50, as mentioned in a prior post,   is seldom open.  There's a phone # posted on the door to call if you want the owner to come over and open up!  He's a transplanted Texan who owned a shop in a city down there.  As was said earlier, he's into narrow gauge and  I believe does custom work.  He was at one of the Rocky Mountain Division TCA shows a year or two ago.  He did have a storage trailer with O-gauge inventory from his prior shop.  It was pretty old stuff and the prices were list price.  I wasn't interested so I didn;t see if he would negotiate on them.

 

More than you wanted to know on Salida, CO!!

 

And I don't work for the Visitors Bureau!  In fact I'm risking "life and limb" by not keeping our pleasantt little place a secret from the "city slickers" and "flatlanders!"

 

Jim

Salida, The Heart of the Rockies

 

 

 

Southwest?

 

There is but one ideal choice:  Hawaii!

 

Just ask forum member Don McCuaig.

 

A bit costly, but well worth it!  And you can't get more "Southwest" than the 50th state.

Hawaii is a long way from real trains!

 

A friend of a friend who lived in Hawaii for four years found it less than perfect with humid summers and volcano belches.

 

I like Oregon in the summer but am looking towards probably California or Arizona for a possible wintering area that I can readily drive to. I've experienced parts of Texas but that's a bit too far east for me. I heard first-hand stories of cars being destroyed by large hail in Texas.

 

Many Thanks again for all the suggestions - they are all appreciated!

The perfect climate and close to being the perfect city for retirement (if the real estate can be afforded):  SANTA BARBARA.

 

Second choice would be the San Luis Obispo/Central Coast area.

 

Both are on the SP/UP Coast Route.    Neither has a good OGauge train shop.    Basements?  You want basements?  There are no basements in California.    Don't have to worry about flooding....  LOL!

 

Taxes?  Cali taxes seem to have evolved into mythical status by others as an excuse not to move from zero-degree winter weather.  Property taxes tend to be far LOWER in Cali than most other states.  Sales taxes vary by county/city.  We pay 7.25% in my area.  There is a personal income tax (which is ugly), but Cali is not alone in that.  

 

We currently do have an extremely dysfunctional state legislature.  But that's what you get when you elect 120 (80 state assembly & 40 state senate) self-serving morons to office.  Unfortunately that paralysis is coming to a state near you soon--if not arrived already.

A basement would be nice but that's one price you pay living in Tampa but when we had this house built we did have one of the bedrooms made to be my train room no closet to allow for more shelving but it can be added for future owners to convert back to a bedroon or you can have a upstairs room added but remember as you grow older stairways can be a problem but a small elevaitor or a chair like a friend had installed for his mom to go up and down the stairs can fix that, but Florida is the best place for me to retire.

Stay away from California unless you have a lot on money for just about everything and you are wiling to pay out on a lot of taxes, learn spanish and live with crime all around you, no where is safe. The first opportunity I got I left, I left a great train club AGHR that I loved but the family came first. I left a lot of good friends there also and I miss it a lot. The state has gone to far to the left. I hated to go but when the job opportunity became available I got out of Dodge.

You've obviously lost it, John.    

 

None of what you posted is true.  Simply not true.  

 

Note that five of the ten "safest" cities in the U.S. (>100,000 pop.) are in Cali according to the FBI.

 

But, that's enough.

JP:

 

Does this mean I can have your reserved parking space until I move to Texas?

 

RT:

 

You're in Ventura County as I recall (nice area; my sister lives out there.) Los Angeles has gone into the tank and the way the City is incorporated, even the San Fernando Valley is getting sucked into the drain. Hopefully, Ventura and Santa Barbara Counties can keep their tax costs in-line since the State has cut off funding to the counties while passing off a lot of state services to the counties. Orange County is nice, too, but OC's bad parts are really bad parts.

While I don't know if I could live in the desert, if I did I would definately want to have an outdoor layout!

 

Jim

I love visiting California, and have done so many times, but have no desire to live there.  Many of my California-based friends (but by no means all) are hoping to get out or have already left.  I imagine the tax rates have a lot to do with that, along with problems with local and state government and burdensome regulations.

 

Lots of truly great garden railroads in the western states, for rather obvious reasons.  The smaller scales are by no means neglected in that part of the country, but there's little doubt that the heaviest concentration of O, for example, in terms of participating hobbyists, dealers, and clubs, is east of the Mississippi and north of the Mason-Dixon Line.

Examine Southwestern North Carolina in the environs of Asheville or nearby which has four seasons and a rich railroad history. 

Interesting. 

Keep in mind that Arizona and Nevada took heavy hits in the recent recession and have yet to figure it out. I guess it all depends on the price you want to pay for your sunshine. IMO.