Wiring question

Don't run a bare wire. I recommend these wire connectors. Simple to use and reliable. They are available in different configurations.

https://www.amazon.com/Wago-22...nSA%3D%3D&sr=8-4

"Using an insulator to keep the wire off the table, im thinking of running 2 bare wires under the layout table."

One guys opinion this is a recipe for problems.  Why install wiring this way?  Installing insulators will be more effort than using wire with insulation.  Just use a wire stripper for wire ends and sharp knife for connections in the middle of wire.  Just wire it all up by twisting connections and do all the soldering at one time.

Charlie

The connector your looking for is called a " tap splice" or "suitcase connector".

Some do not like these but I have them connecting all of my feeders without issue. They splice right into insulated wire and make a nice neat connection.

@Chinatrain99

I’m with Rick. I used the blue suitcase connectors for my under the table layout wiring 11 years ago with never a problem. They’re simple, cleaner, and safer.

Example of T-Tap (splice) and Suitcase connectors ....

I would highly recommend against bare wire feeders.  Too much of a chance of something bad happening and releasing the magic smoke.  This method is useful for rodent mitigation, but only at voltages higher than we use for toy trains.

First choice: Strip off a half-inch of insulation and solder branch wires to feeders.

Second choice: "suitcase" splices, as described in the above posts.

Third choice: Wago connectors but use the kind that allow a pass-through without cutting the main wire, if they make such a thing.  Or leave some slack every few feet along the main wire, to allow cutting and splicing with the Wago.

The industry term for the most reliable (non-soldered) connection is "insulation displacement connection" or IDC. The theory is that the insulation, being displaced, provides a mechanical grip, and the metal blade makes a gas-free connection to the copper wire. That's what the suitcase connectors, in theory, provide, but in damp and various temperature environments, such as under a truck or trailer, they're not reliable. Under the trains -- recommended.

Thanks.  I knew I didn't want a bare wire.  I'll look for suitcase connectors

Here's another tapping option that uses a threaded piece to make the connection rather than a crimp, Come in different styles and wire sizes, Used these under the hood on my Corvair, clean and tidy.

PosiTaps

On my layout i just ran a wire all the way around underneath my layout for building lights ,street lights & just drop a wire down to that wire & using my wire strippers i just put the strippers on the wire & it opened up enough space to connect a wire to it & i would just solder the wire on ,very easy to do ,no need to be using any connectors .  Just the way i do it .

Many years working on cars and seeing the results, I don't like the splice or suitcase connectors.  On 12v DC they corrode or even cut the wires partially.   They were usually future trouble spots.   We soldered all connections or used soldered on plug or screw connections when doing repairs or additions.   

I would run multiple distribution blocks under the table.  With wire of proper gauge you could daisy chaing them around the layout underneath.   Then when you need a connection point it is only a short run.   Screw the wire down and done, no soldering unless you want to put an end on the wire.

The bare wire method worked for the wiring in the attic in the house I grew up in.  Done in 1905.  There are reasons wiring codes no longer allows this in your home.  Primarily to protect you.   Being sweaty working under the table a 14v bare wire will still zing you.   

I'll second NJCJOE and Mr Bloom's suggestions regarding Wago's.   My soldering skills are marginal, and the idea of soldering wire while laying on my back under the table doesn't have a lot of appeal.   I've been using them for my rebuild; they're inexpensive, easy to use, and wiring changes are a breeze.  

@VHubbard posted:

Many years working on cars and seeing the results, I don't like the splice or suitcase connectors.  On 12v DC they corrode or even cut the wires partially.   They were usually future trouble spots.   We soldered all connections or used soldered on plug or screw connections when doing repairs or additions.   

An indoor layout shouldn't see much weather(much less road salt) like a car does to cause corrosion. If it does, you've got bigger issues.

They may not be great for alot of applications, but imo, they are ideal for train layouts where you can drop in a feeder/power supply at any time with minimal disruption of existing wiring.

My suitcase connections are 18 years old, if you remove them, the wire looks like it did the day I installed it.

@NJCJOE posted:

Don't run a bare wire. I recommend these wire connectors. Simple to use and reliable. They are available in different configurations.

https://www.amazon.com/Wago-22...nSA%3D%3D&sr=8-4

Joe, in the product above, may I assume the application is to use these when running a hot (red) wire bus under the layout. One wire from the transformer goes to the the left side, the feeder drop goes in the middle, and the right side goes to the next hot drop area  until it is terminated at the last drop?

There is another product from the amazon link shown below that looks like it would allow the incorporation of a common drop at the same time. It appears you run the wire in one side with the drop and the connector) out the other. I don't know if you can put two wires of 16 G in one side to accomplish that example.

Did you just double up the ones you referenced for the common bus?

Thanks Joe.

Paul

Suitcase connectors are easy and fast.

Funny how easy and fast are never the best and safest.

Charlie

@Railrunnin posted:

Joe, in the product above, may I assume the application is to use these when running a hot (red) wire bus under the layout. One wire from the transformer goes to the the left side, the feeder drop goes in the middle, and the right side goes to the next hot drop area  until it is terminated at the last drop?

There is another product from the amazon link shown below that looks like it would allow the incorporation of a common drop at the same time. It appears you run the wire in one side with the drop and the connector) out the other. I don't know if you can put two wires of 16 G in one side to accomplish that example.

Did you just double up the ones you referenced for the common bus?

Thanks Joe.

Paul

Paul,

You need one connector for your positive run and another connector for you common run. All the ports are tied together inside the connector. I use these mainly for accessory wiring, but they would work for track power wiring as you described. With the ones I use, I have been able to get two 18 ga. wires in one port. The type you referenced I'm not familiar with.

@Choo Choo Charlie posted:

Suitcase connectors are easy and fast.

Funny how easy and fast are never the best and safest.

Charlie

Different strokes for different folks I guess.  Often times (around here) what's "best" is a matter of opinion.

Having said that. I never stated they were the "best". I merely mentioned I had a good experience with them.

As far as safe. Well after 18 years my layout is still standing and my house is too. Voltage at the track is the same as well.

@RickO posted:

As far as safe. Well after 18 years my layout is still standing and my house is too. Voltage at the track is the same as well.

Rick,

It appears that we have two extremes here. In spite of this I tend to agree with you.

However there is a problem with your impression of "safe" based on your lone experience.   You may be the most lucky person in the world, in which case your avoidance of disaster has little to do with your choice of connector.  Time to buy a PowerBall ticket?

On the other hand Charlie's implication that suitcase connectors are unsafe, without providing any evidence at all is equally problematic on the other extreme.

Neither of these help the rest of us determine whether they're safe or not.

I tend to stick with you, but not because necessarily of your individual experience with them.  Unfortunately, we still need to know that the vast majority of those who've used them, in addition to you, have also had no problems with them.

Statistics are the name of the game when trying to estimate failures and exposure to hazards.  They are compiled based on including everyone.  If stats had indicated, over the years, that these were unsafe, leading to fires, then there would have many individual lawsuits, or likely one class-action, coming from them.

Having seen none, I'd say they're fine.

Mike

Good points Mike, and of course  there are many other variables to consider. I.e. transformer type, wire size, etc.

I've tried running wire everywhere and terminal strips.   Eventually I have no idea what runs where.  I was just looking at one main wire and going off of that.  My soldering skills are horrible.   My knees stink so I'm planning on running the wire prior to actually putting the wood in place. I'll let you know how the suitcase wiring goes.  

For those among us who constantly say that they can't, or won't, try soldering because of whatever reason, I suggest that you just take a little time, some scrap wire, a medium heat iron, and some appropriate solder, and learn how to do it.

I learned at the age of six. I'm sure you can do it!

Step one is a good mechanical connection. The solder is not used to fasten the wires together. it is used to create an amalgam of metals that conducts electricity efficiently throughout the splice.

Twist the wires together so that they can't be pulled apart easily. Arrange the splice so that it supports itself. You have only two hands, and you will need both.  Hold the soldering iron in your dominant hand. Hold the solder in the other. Apply heat from below the splice (heat rises.) A second or two is sufficient. Apply the end of the solder to the intersection of the splice and the iron. The solder will melt, and when it does, pull the iron and the solder away at the same time. if the splice looks shiny, you did it correctly. If it looks cloudy or granular, just heat it again, without more solder.

It's not rocket surgery.

I used these lever nuts from Amazon, I had 3-position and 5-position, they worked great.  Cheaper than the name brand, but UL certified for residential wiring, so I suspect they're good for train layouts.

Search Amazon for B07FT33Q19 for the 5-position, 32 cents ea.  Search B07FT68SN2 for the 3-position, 23 cents ea.

All,

I spent some 15 years of my career wiring different electronics into vehicles.  Everything from car stereos to complete police car installs.  I don't use suite case connectors or any sort of connector that pinches wire to make a connection.  Why?  With automotive applications while voltages are similar (12-14 vDC to ~18 vAC) conditions such as temperature swings, humidity changes and even current requirements differ significantly from what we experience in our train rooms.  Suite case connectors very often isolate in automotive applications.  Whenever I would see them in an installation I had to fix, I would replace them with butt connectors and more often than not, that would fix any issues.

Because we don't see the extreme temperature and humidity changes in our train environments is likely why they last years as RickO points out. 

I don't see any sort of safety issue using these for train layouts.  In automotive, I once saw a suite case connector used for powering a trailer brake controller.  That's a REALLY bad idea and a safety issue.  If and when it isolates, you have no trailer brakes.  Worst case with our trains, they don't run or run correctly. 

Tony

@Railrunnin posted:

There is another product from the amazon link shown below that looks like it would allow the incorporation of a common drop at the same time. It appears you run the wire in one side with the drop and the connector) out the other. I don't know if you can put two wires of 16 G in one side to accomplish that example.

Any of the lever nuts only accommodate a single wire in one position.  Trying to put two wires in a single position will likely lead to a poor connection.

@Tony_V posted:

I don't see any sort of safety issue using these for train layouts.  In automotive, I once saw a suite case connector used for powering a trailer brake controller.  That's a REALLY bad idea and a safety issue.  If and when it isolates, you have no trailer brakes.  Worst case with our trains, they don't run or run correctly.

Well, not totally true.  Although I don't think it likely, if you have a poor connection in the wiring, there's enough current to start a fire, and that's been demonstrated a number of times over the years.  As I said, not that likely, but something to consider.