3volt conversion issues

The symptoms are the tach reader or wiring first, then the power supply board if those are OK.

For openers, you did not need a 3 volt harness.  All you had to do was take the black connectors off the 5 V board and put them on the 3V board.   Each board is the same pin for pin.  Put in a 4 ohm speaker, proper battery and operate.  I agree with John on the tach reader.  What did you solder????  

You could have just put in a PS32 board and you would have PS3.

Marty Fitzhenry posted:

For openers, you did not need a 3 volt harness.  All you had to do was take the black connectors off the 5 V board and put them on the 3V board.   Each board is the same pin for pin.  Put in a 4 ohm speaker, proper battery and operate.  I agree with John on the tach reader.  What did you solder????  

You could have just put in a PS32 board and you would have PS3.

 

 

I didn't know that. I have a 5-volt PS2 Mikado with a blown board and a couple of 3-volt upgrade kits. I was getting ready to send the unit out for repair. I guess I'll take a crack at swapping out the boards, battery and speaker.

Matt, if you have the parts you can save a few bucks.  One tip on removing the connectors.  They are a tight fit and I found that a small paint brush dipped in light oil does the following.  Take the brush and wipe over the pins at the base.  This makes the job very easy.  On the two pin battery connection just leave the white plug in place.  Everything else is pin for pin.

Thanks Marty.

Chris, you were using an old tach reader so it may be bad, as long as gap is correct and flywheel tape good.  Is gray wire on square pad? Orange in middle and blue on other end?  

Matt, you need to figure out how to mount the new PS-2 3V board, that is the hardest part of this conversion.  Remember to change speaker and battery also.  G

Another tip on removing the connector shells from the boards.  I use a little heat from a heat gun to warm up the plastic shells, makes them much easier to slide off.  Like Marty says, you leave the battery connection as you'll be using a different battery.

John, I have never tried the heat.  I have a box of junk boards and was thinking about spending time harvesting all the connections.  I will give the heat a shot.

We're in the same boat Marty, I've never tried the oil.

The engine has to be the issue. I tried on a good known  3 volt tender and it did the same thing. Super fast. And the smoke or lights did not work. And when I tried the smoke. I think it blew the tender fet heater. Because when I put tender back on the good engine I did not have the smoke heater now.   Anyhow, yeah the tach gotta be an issue. I matched wire colors. So I thought I was good.  Would a bad tach also cause the lights not to work, the smoke too?  I'll take a pic of the tach setup. Wires.  Thanks for your input guys. 

Chris

Ohh... bad idea swapping tenders on PS/2 unless you know they're configured the same.

If you have a bad smoke motor, that can cause all sorts of problems as it loads down the power supply.  I just had a repair that started with a shorted smoke motor, and ended up taking out a bunch of stuff.

Unplug the smoke unit and see what the symptoms are.

Chris, unless the tender is the same item number, never swap MTH tenders.  It is the kiss of death.  On Lionel, swap tenders all day long if they have the IR  tether.

yikes,  didn't know that.  just wanted to see if the engine wiring was a success.  Now I wonder about the smoke unit entirely but the headlight not working.  ill never do it again.  ill get a steam kit next time.  I got the comet as a dead engine and thought I could just get a board and redo it easy.  I was wrong on that!  this is been nothing but a problem!

yes I have changed many 5 volt boards to 3 volts boards as Marty n John stated no problems at all as long as you change the speaker n battery they work perfectly did a steam engine last mth 4-8-4 number 844 cab number great running engine and I switched over to bcr instead of battery

Alan  

Chris D posted:

yikes,  didn't know that.  just wanted to see if the engine wiring was a success.  Now I wonder about the smoke unit entirely but the headlight not working.  ill never do it again.  ill get a steam kit next time.  I got the comet as a dead engine and thought I could just get a board and redo it easy.  I was wrong on that!  this is been nothing but a problem!

 

A bad smoke unit fan motor can do a lot of bad things.

ok, unplugged all.  smoke heater, fan, headlight.  The engine still spins full throttle and no chuff.  so my guess is the tach reader. 

So I can get the parts for this?  can I test the smoke fan with some outside source of power?  who knows this may be out also.  ill get the tach reader parts and use a new fan motor that I have.  

I will open up the shell tonight and report the wire position that you suggested GGG. I might need some parts again from you!

GGG posted:

Chris, you were using an old tach reader so it may be bad, as long as gap is correct and flywheel tape good.  Is gray wire on square pad? Orange in middle and blue on other end?  

Matt, you need to figure out how to mount the new PS-2 3V board, that is the hardest part of this conversion.  Remember to change speaker and battery also.  G

paging through brasseurs parts.  I saw many tach reader tapes avail.  27mm and 30mm.  then I saw PS2 upgrade. 33.7,31.8,30,27.7, 27mm.  WOW!  did not realize there were this many tapes.   guess I will need one for the factory 3 volt steam board. and a tach reader for that also. 

Why not just print the tapes on shipping paper.  That works fine for me.  Download the graphic file and print it at 100% scaling on the gummed full page shipping labels.

john,  why did they have so many variations? .  flywheel size? how would I know if the existing 5 volt tach reader is good or bad? or is this even compatible with the new 3 volt board I have?  I think that maybe I need to send this out for the pro's! 

gunrunnerjohn posted:

Why not just print the tapes on shipping paper.  That works fine for me.  Download the graphic file and print it at 100% scaling on the gummed full page shipping labels.

The different tapes are indeed for different flywheel diameters.

All the PS/2 tach readers are compatible, 5V or 3V.  There are some variations, depending on the usage.  They were also used for Locosound, I believe that's the resistor model.

Chris D, I just finished a PS3 upgrade on a RK 0-8-0. I only used one of the 5 tach tapes. If the one you need is not the same one I used I will send you the tach tape. 

You can look at it while powered up with a camera to see if LED is lit.  More elaborate to look for an output signal.  Usually better to just swap it with new.  Yes, 3V and 5V are the same.  G

ok,  I didn't know, I bet its a bad tach then.  Here is another thing I thought about.  now this may not have to happen since it was a PS2 engine, but do you have to cut any spots on the smoke unit board like you do if your converting a PS1 to PS-2? 

here is the tach pic from behind. grey, orange, blue. wires. seem right? 

Hudson J1e posted:

Chris D, I just finished a PS3 upgrade on a RK 0-8-0. I only used one of the 5 tach tapes. If the one you need is not the same one I used I will send you the tach tape. 

I don't think I need any tapes. seems like its per the flywheel diameter.  so the existing should work fine.  I think its the tach itself.  I need a new one.  thanks for the offer!

Chris D posted:

ok,  I didn't know, I bet its a bad tach then.  Here is another thing I thought about.  now this may not have to happen since it was a PS2 engine, but do you have to cut any spots on the smoke unit board like you do if your converting a PS1 to PS-2? 

here is the tach pic from behind. grey, orange, blue. wires. seem right? 

PS/2 smoke units are all the same, you don't have to cut anything.

gunrunnerjohn posted:

Chris D posted:

ok,  I didn't know, I bet its a bad tach then.  Here is another thing I thought about.  now this may not have to happen since it was a PS2 engine, but do you have to cut any spots on the smoke unit board like you do if your converting a PS1 to PS-2? 

here is the tach pic from behind. grey, orange, blue. wires. seem right? 

PS/2 smoke units are all the same, you don't have to cut anything.

ok, that's a relief.  John, can you test the fan motor with a battery?  whats the voltage that powers these things?  I wanted to test it like you said with it going bad could present a bunch of issues. 

I use my bench supply to test them, they'll frequently run but still be defective and drawing too much power.  It should spin quite well with 3 volts DC on it, and if it draws more than about 40-50ma current, it's bad.  I new motor will run on 1.5 volts.