A little honest advice needed....

I would get a Legacy 990 system and a Legacy Powermaster.  You can run conventional locomotives and tmcc/legacy with this setup

Option #2 would be to get a MTH DCS system and connect it to a Legacy command base. With one remote you'd be able to run PS-2, TMCC, Legacy, and conventional.

 

MTH 50-1032 Cable ~ $20

MTH 50-1001 DCS ~$300

LIONEL 6-37156 ~ $100

 

You have lots of choices for transformers, that's for another thread...

 

Gilly 

 

 

 

Gilly

I agree. Get a Legacy system and a Legacy PowerMaster.  If you want to ease gently into command control with a simpler system, and at a lower cost, you could consider a Legacy CAB-1L system. But the full Legacy 990 system with the CAB-2 offers the full 'Legacy experience', and would probably be a better purchase in the long-term.

What should a DECENT price be for the #990 system?

About $300 IF you can find one... Availability of the Lionel system is a point of consideration when comparing it to the MTH DCS system. Regardless of how nice the CAB-2 is, how much good is it if it isn't available???

 

Gilly

Unless you want to go on a bit of a hunting expedition, you'll have to wait a bit longer until the Lionel 990 Legacy System is readily available again.  Should be a relatively brief wait.  You've waited this long, so I would recommend waiting just a bit longer to get the latest and most up-to-date system (if you elect to go that route).

I like Nichole's suggestion of the Legacy 1L - save a few bucks while remaining compatible.   You can use the savings to justify a MTH DCS controller and have your bases covered.

Was that a pun?

I think the new Legacy 1L would fit your needs. Unless you want MTH remote, you have nothing else to buy.

The original post made no mention of a desire to buy/operate DCS equipment, so I don't quite understand why anyone would feel the need to move into an area he is not, at this time at least, particularly interested in.

 

As I see it, his options are the full Legacy system or the CAB-1L/BASE-1L configuration.  My own recommendation would be to go with the 1L setup and then, if/when he gets the urge to expand his roster with some Legacy locomotives, to consider investing in the full 990 Legacy System.  A logical and affordable way to get into command control operation of Lionel (and certain other TMCC-equipped) trains.

Jim and Allan have steered you well.  I agree with them.  Start with the Cab1L/Base1L and see if that fills your needs.

Earnie,

 

I find myself in a somewhat similar situation, as I plan on moving from conventional to command.  In my instance, however, I have six (Non-Lionel) engines with TMCC. 

 

If I planned to purchase several Legacy engines I would probably wouldn't hesitate to get the Legacy 990 system.  In my case, where the command engines I already have TMCC and may purchase only one or two Legacy engines, I'm trying to decide to go with Legacy or TMCC.

 

If you have, or plan to get some MTH engines, then Gilly's suggestion is also one to consider.

 

Jim

 I agree with Nicole, but let me add this, I have both the 990 and the Cab-1L and let me say, I have not picked up my CAB-2 remote since getting the CAB-1L.

 

Art

Earnie,

Stay with your original choice or that which Allan described. Stay away from adding any frills until a later date. I currently have both systems installed on my layout. I have yet to operate either one. I made the mistake of listening to others. By doing so I wasted a healthy sum of money.

 

It sounds like you're a devoted Lionel fan. If you do as Allan suggests, I honestly feel that you will be much happier in the long run.

I have a questionthat might help him make a decision. I'm a person who buys something once. I don't want to buy something then find out later I either need more or a upgraded system to what I have. I never buy a lite version of anything. it sounds like the cab1 l is a lite version of the 990 there is also DCS. now from what I have read tmcc legacy cab1 and legacy cab2 can not control the MTH stuff. am I correct on this and also from what I have read tho the dcs system can control the mth and the tmcc and legacy stuff. so if I was in a position to start fresh with command I would purchase the DCS system that way no matter what I buy I would be able to control it. now this is based off what I have read about legacy and dcs but I could be wrong and if I am please correct me .

 

Nope. You're spot-on. That was the basis of my first post on this thread. And, don't forget you can also run conventional locomotives with your DCS system too.

 

Gilly

But in hind sight last summer when everything came out of the attic. I went to my favorite auction site and found a tmcc setup 100 bucks couldn't beat it. bought it why not right it will be in the attic in a month anyways . well now I wish I would have gotton dcs LOL. Oh well live and learn. another approach I was told to do would be  buy proto 1.0 engines and upgrade them with err products to get nice engines with good details and at a discounted price then do the upgrade to get the new control and new sounds haven't done it yet to see if there's a cost savings yet or not.

 

You can operate conventional locomotives with a LEGACY CAB-1L or CAB-2 Command Set and a LEGACY PowerMaster.

 

If you need a TMCC base, Base-1L or 990 LEGACY Command Base to operate any TMCC/LEGACY engine with a DCS in command mode then I don't understand why you wouldn't just use the accompanying remote that came with said base and run both systems simultaneously.

WOW....I figured my (novice) question would open the "box" but now I've lost what

little understanding I had prior to asking.....let me digress just a little...but first let me truly thank all of you for offering up your opinions....what a GREAT value this forum has!!!  

So...as a follow up question...would someone be able to explain just briefly the pros and cons of DCS vs Lionel systems?

1. Will either run BOTH conventional and non Le

Sorry....continuing legach. kids!!   Will Both DCS and Legacy systems run conventional

and non-conventioal engines?

2. Someone mentioned future growth......do both systems allow one to start small and

grow larger or by starting smaller and growing does one end up spending 3x as much in the long run?

3. How about equipment other than Lionel...with both systems operate whatever engine or accessory that is dropped to the track/layout or is one system "locked" to brand specific.

 

I see a #900 over on the Bay for about $600-$650...your thoughts....supposedly new.....thanks again....pushing kids back this time.

 I mainly have Protosound 2/3 engines, but there are a few TMCC in their as well. Wanting to be able to run everything, this was before Legacy, I went with DCS and can run conventional, TMCC, and Protosound 2/3, can also run Legacy but not with all it's wonders. One fairly straight forward system, total investment about $360.00.

 

Reads as if you've waited a long time to make this leap, welcome, it is great to run them from a remote and soon a tablet or smart phone. 

 

Good luck no mater which way you choose to go.

No one knows where their interest may lie in time to come.

 

If you go with the exclusive Lionel system you exclude MTH comand features.

 

If you go with the MTH DCS system you include the Lionel system. 

 

Sounds like a no brainer to me.

 

Alan; Earnie stated he wants TMCC compatibles, DCS is TMCC compatible.

 

 

I'm able to run all my trains with Legacy and TPC unit even my MTH.  The only thing I am not happy about is the way new upgrades to my CAB-2 are being released, by computer and no hard copy.  I suffer with PTSD and being computer challenged is an understatement.  I wish Lionel would notify me (my unit is registered) of an upgrade and I would be more than happy to purchase modules I can plug into my base and hand held and a hard copy manual.

 

Steve, Lady and Tex

 Steve....Someone....uh..."TPC" unit?

BTW...I mistyped the Legacy system on Ebay...its a 990 (not 900)...says new..#14295...asking $650...looking for best offer....what say the group??

 

Earnie

No, don't buy it!  Be patient.  The 990 sets from Lionel will be arriving soon.  You can and should wait before investing that kind of money in the system.  It's your money, of course, but I sure would recommend waiting a bit longer.

Plus, if you buy from an unauthorized Lionel dealer, the warranty is voided.

 

$650? That's about twice you would pay if/once the 990 Command Sets appear on dealer shelves.

They will soon be available brand new, latest electronics and firmware for around $300-350 street price. With full warranty from an authorized dealer. You should definitely SKIP the older model for $650!

If you have only Lionel conventional and TMCC/Legacy locos, your best choice is the Legacy system for about $300-400. This includes a handheld and a command base.  You will still need a power source for your locos, which you no doubt have already (e.g., ZW or other transformers).  You will not be able to use the Legacy handheld to control your conventional locos unless you buy something called a Legacy Powermaster, or a  Track Power Controller (TPC) which responds to the Legacy handheld to raise and lower the voltage on the track.  In the beginning you will probably want to keep separate loops for your command loco and conventional stuff as running both on the same trackage is complicated in comparison.  If you like the Legacy handheld for command use, you can then consider buying the TPC or Powermaster to use the handheld for conventional remote control.

 

If you buy the DCS system first, it will not control TMCC or Legacy locos in command mode without adding the TMCC or Legacy command base to the system, which makes the initial investment significantly greater to start.  Purchasing the DCS system makes sense only if you plan to use MTH PS2 or PS3 locos in addition to your conventional and TMCC/Legacy locos.  Since you apparently have none of those yet, I'd wait on DCS until you do.

Ok I will try to explain the different systems and what they do

 

Lionel Legacy 990 - Controls all Lionel Legacy and TMCC features in command mode. Can operate conventional equipment from anyone with the addition a Lionel Powermaster (I think that's all you need anyway). Will not control MTH PS2-PS3 in command mode. 

 

Lionel Cab1L/Base1L - Controls all Lionel Legacy and TMCC engines in TMCC command mode only (not all Legacy features are available). Can operate conventional equipment from anyone with the addition a Lionel Powermaster (I'm not sure about this with the Cab1L/Base1L and Powermaster). Will not control MTH PS2-PS3 in command mode. 

 

MTH DCS System (TIU and Remote) - Controls all MTH PS2-PS3 features. Can control all Lionel Legacy and TMCC engines in TMCC command mode (not all Legacy features are available). A cable and Lionel Base unit are required for the Lionel TMCC features. Can operate conventional equipment from anyone through the variable channels of the TIU.

 

MTH DSC System - Around $280-$320

Lionel Legacy 990 - Around $300-$350

Lionel CAb1L/Base1L - not sure, but I think they are about $100-$150 or so less than a Legacy 990.

 

This should give you an idea of what each system will do. The required parts can be determined when you decide what you want to do. I have DCS, no Legacy so I am not up to speed on the Lionel parts. I have had a Legacy system ordered for quite a while and hopefully it should be here soon.

 

Others have given better advice than I can, but if you want to ever run MTH PS2-PS3 and Legacy/TMCC, both a DCS and Legacy 990 system would be needed to get full use of all the features from each manufacturer. That's what I am trying to do.

 

Here's a video explaining DCS/TMCC/Legacy from Eric's Trains He explains it better than I can. Maybe this will help you a little. Eric also has many great videos! Watching them can be habit forming - Subscribe and enjoy!

To run Lionel with DCS you still have to buy one of the Lionel remote systems. So a Lionel system is where he should start for what he has to run.

How big is your layout? How many loops and feet per loop?  I have both Legacy/TMCC and DCS.  The DCS remote works best for MTH engines and the Legacy remote works best for Legacy/TMCC engines.  I have 3 and 1/2 loops, two of my loops are big enough to run two trains per loop. So that means I will run 5 trains at a time.  You can easily switch between two engines per remote Lionel or MTH because of the way the remotes work. I also have a Cab 1 system.  One loop will have 2 legacy engines, the next will have 2 DCS engines, and a TMCC engine on the last loop.  Works for me.  Your setup may be different.

A DCS system with a Lionel base will run a Lionel TMCC/Legacy engine but I don't find it any fun.  Your mileage may vary.

Dan

You can also just use your transformer control for conventional, and when you want to run a TMCC or Legacy Engine, just plug in the Legacy / TMCC base into the wall and the one wire will feed the signal to your normal conventional layout and you can run any Lionel Command Control engine.

 

You don't have to control your conventional engines through the legacy remote if you don't want to.  You can have your cake and eat it too.  This also means you need to still wire your track like you would conventionally, but the Legacy or TMCC will not care either way.

 

Personally, I would get a Legacy 990 Remote and base for around $300 at one of our sponsors above (2 have it at this price that I'm aware of) and are willing to wait until it arrives and that's it.

 

If you decide to want to run your conventional locomotives with the Legacy remote, you will have to spring for a Legacy powermaster or TPC, but that is optional.

 

Should the day come in the future, you want to run MTH ps2 or ps3 locomotives, you can then add DCS to the mix and a special wire connecting it to the legacy base so now you can do everything.

 

 

Earnie;

Wow, there are lots of opinions offered here. Good luck on whichever route you decide to go.

For my money I operate TMCC and Legacy stuff using the old Cab1 system, and MTH stuff using a DCS system. They all work just fine together, and as a bonus you can operate any TMCC/Legacy engines using DCS, as stated above.

I will likely add a 990 system when they are made available again.

One thing is relatively certain: when you make the jump to command, you will likely find yourself hooked on it forever!

Be ready for lots more command engines on the roster.

 

Rod

This thread is great.....I went from lost to totally lost to seeing a little light to starting to see sunshine....all in a matter of a few hours....maybe false security..LOL....I really do appreciate all the feedback and help. This hobby is an expensive one and good planning makes all the difference in the long run.

 

So my next question.....a couple of recommendations of WHERE to get in line to purchase the 990....naturally most cost effective. As I suspected there are more than one way to "skin the cat" however to each his own. My layout will change and will continue to do so. I really love the old post war items and want to "blend" them with the newer ones (operating accessories as well). My emphasis will be on my new Lionel items AND my older conventional Lionel, Williams, Atlas, and MTH locos.

 

So, directions please as to the best all around 990 source?....Again, thanks to everyone...you guys are the best!....hopefully I can have something to contribute in return one day soon.

Earnie, what I'd do at this point is spend a bit of time digesting all the opinions.

 

First stop would be do do some reading about the command systems on their respective sites.  There are advantages to both TMCC/Legacy and DCS, so making an informed choice would be the best option for you.

 

I know it's tempting to "pull the trigger" immediately, but you'll make much better choices with more understanding of the features and limitations of each environment.

 

 

Just wait for the 990 to get back on the shelves at $300...probably next month. And I would avoid the DCS since it cannot do Legacy. If you find that you want some MTH engines later, then buy the DCS.

Sorry but that information is incorrect.

DCS will run Legacy engines in full TMCC mode.

You will not be able to access all Legacy features, but all TMCC features are available.

Just to clarify; don't shoot the messenger!

 

Rod

Ernie,
Just do yourself a favor and listen to Allan. The title of your post asks for honest advice and he is the only one not using the thread to push an agenda.
Remember.    Keep it simple st----!!