Discussion of Kadee couplers in OGR Run #295, December 2017.

Interesting ............I never broke a plastic coupler because of too many cars and I pull trains 100' in length.. I'll have to do this test again  

As a 2 rail modeller, I completely agree with Hot Water.  Train length does not have any effect on plastic Kadee couplers.  The only time I had to replace a plastic coupler was when two locomotives were accidentally rammed into each other.  Replacing knuckle springs is another matter, but I've had to replace them no matter what the scale.  And yes, plastic couplers are very handy for electrically isolating pieces of rolling stock from each other.

I model 2-rail (DCC) and use Atlas/Kadee metal couplers and have never experienced any electrical issues. The gearboxes are plastic.

Hot Water posted:

I wonder where Mr. Jean obtained his "facts" about the plastic Kadee #804 couplers?

Fake news.  Total fabrication w/o any facts behind it at all.

catnap posted:

I model 2-rail (DCC) and use Atlas/Kadee metal couplers and have never experienced any electrical issues. The gearboxes are plastic.

I haven't bought any O Kadee couplers recently, so I can't say about current stock, but I have used Kadee O couplers since before the plastic ones came available, and the metal couplers I have all came with metal draftgear boxes. The metal & plastic ones are the same (and interchangeable), so if you want the metal ones to be insulated, you can substitute the plastic draft gear for the metal ones. I believe Kadee sells the plastic draft gear separately for just this reason. You can also insulate the metal box from the car with thin sheet plastic, and use nylon 2-56 screws/nuts to attach them to a metal floor or frame. 

Bill in FtL

It's frustrating when some people put out false information about quality products.  The Kadee industrial plastic couplers and pockets are rock solid when properly installed.  My experience:

For reliable hands off coupling and uncoupling of cars on my coal branch I found I needed to standardize the couplers on my hopper car fleet (90 cars, 10 different makes, plastic, die cast, brass).  In fairly extensive layout testing I found that the 8xx series couplers coupled and uncoupled better over magnets on curving mine sidings sidings  than the newer (better looking)  7xx series couplers.  The extra inter knuckle "slack" also facilitates uncoupling with a pick in areas without magnets.  I standardized on the plastic 804's over the metal 805's as they provide 2 rail insulating properties for brass cars with metal trucks.  An added plus is that the  freight car color 804 draft gear blends well with PRR red car bodies (someday they'll get weathered).  All the hoppers weight at least one pound, and I've had zero issues with broken couplers running 35 car coal drags on 2.2% grades.  

I use the plastic couplers in O and also have never broke one. I used them in HO scale and never broke one. Now I also use them in G scale and have never broke one. They only have the plastic version in G scale.

 Anyways what the heck is he talking about .....more than 4 cars? I've pulled 50+!

Engineer-Joe posted:

I use the plastic couplers in O and also have never broke one. I used them in HO scale and never broke one. Now I also use them in G scale and have never broke one. They only have the plastic version in G scale.

 Anyways what the heck is he talking about .....more than 4 cars? I've pulled 50+!

I think what is more confusing to me is, why didn't someone at OGR question such an incorrect  statement, after more than 8 years of VERY in-depth discussions here on the 3RS Forum, covering the addition and use of Kadee couplers?

Keystoned Ed posted:

It's frustrating when some people put out false information about quality products.  The Kadee industrial plastic couplers and pockets are rock solid when properly installed.  My experience:

For reliable hands off coupling and uncoupling of cars on my coal branch I found I needed to standardize the couplers on my hopper car fleet (90 cars, 10 different makes, plastic, die cast, brass).  In fairly extensive layout testing I found that the 8xx series couplers coupled and uncoupled better over magnets on curving mine sidings sidings  than the newer (better looking)  7xx series couplers.  The extra inter knuckle "slack" also facilitates uncoupling with a pick in areas without magnets.  I standardized on the plastic 804's over the metal 805's as they provide 2 rail insulating properties for brass cars with metal trucks.  An added plus is that the  freight car color 804 draft gear blends well with PRR red car bodies (someday they'll get weathered).  All the hoppers weight at least one pound, and I've had zero issues with broken couplers running 35 car coal drags on 2.2% grades.  

 

And my designed boxes for Ed are also plastic.  I’ve used them without issue, and I like the Kadee 740-series couplers and Protocraft for the look. 

Thanks!

-Mario

I have never had a Kadee coupler, metal or plastic, fail, PERIOD. On the other hand, my use of Atlas couplers has no doubt increased the size of the caboose market. Several failures of Atlas couplers resulted in caboose damage, since my layout is "circular"...

Maybe there will be a correction in the next issue. Does OGR have a reader feedback section likes most train magazines? Maybe a subscriber can mail or email in the correction. 

BH

up148 posted:

Maybe there will be a correction in the next issue. Does OGR have a reader feedback section likes most train magazines? Maybe a subscriber can mail or email in the correction. 

BH

Like a "Letters to the Editor" column?

Hot Water posted:

Although I have not seen/read the latest issue of OGR (December 2017, Run #295), I understand that there is a nice article on Kadee  couplers by a Patrick Jean. However, on page 59 Mr. Jean apparently makes a statement, "Plastic couplers (#804) can be used for short trains up to four cars. Longer trains require metal couplers (#805)." 

Although, I personally do not have very many of the plastic Kadee #804 couplers throughout my rolling stock, I am aware that many/most modelers in 2-Rail SCALE, tend to use the plastic #804 couplers exclusively (due to the 2-Rail DC electrical power). Maybe it's just me but, I have NEVER heard of Kadee plastic #804 couplers breaking/failing, regardless of how many cars are in the train. I would be willing to bet that the vast majority of 2-Rail SCALE models that use the plastic #804 couplers, have not experienced breakage/failures either.

I wonder where Mr. Jean obtained his "facts" about the plastic Kadee #804 couplers?

Is it at all possible the "four" in question is simply a typo? 

Mark Diff posted:

Hot Water posted:

Although I have not seen/read the latest issue of OGR (December 2017, Run #295), I understand that there is a nice article on Kadee  couplers by a Patrick Jean. However, on page 59 Mr. Jean apparently makes a statement, "Plastic couplers (#804) can be used for short trains up to four cars. Longer trains require metal couplers (#805)." 

Although, I personally do not have very many of the plastic Kadee #804 couplers throughout my rolling stock, I am aware that many/most modelers in 2-Rail SCALE, tend to use the plastic #804 couplers exclusively (due to the 2-Rail DC electrical power). Maybe it's just me but, I have NEVER heard of Kadee plastic #804 couplers breaking/failing, regardless of how many cars are in the train. I would be willing to bet that the vast majority of 2-Rail SCALE models that use the plastic #804 couplers, have not experienced breakage/failures either.

I wonder where Mr. Jean obtained his "facts" about the plastic Kadee #804 couplers?

Is it at all possible the "four" in question is simply a typo? 

As compared to "forty"?

 Forty cars is NOT a “short train”.   Doubt it is a typo.

My article was about heavily filed down kadees, among other things.
These modified skinny couplers are a lot weaker than original ones.

That is why I recommended metal 805 couplers for longer trains on my experimental switching project

I've been using standard 804 on all my 2-rail brass locomotives and rolling stock for
many years. Never had any problem with them.

Patrick Jean

A scene on my layout  ....