Forgotten The Joy Of Conventional Running

Having options are nice.

We have the Legacy system and really enjoy it. However, since building our current Holiday layout (which is still running in the basement) we've run strictly in conventional mode with the ZW. 

StPaul,

   I am a lot like you in this regard.    I have TMCC/Legacy/DCS.        I have designed my layout to be able to run in conventional or command mode, depending on my mood.    I have a ZW-L and a ZW-C.       I often find myself simply grabbing the big handles and shutting down the Command modes and running as I did as a kid on our first Christmas layout in 1965.

Both my Lionel and MTH command gear runs just fine.  I just like the option to run the so called old fashioned way.

I like many others have both DCS and more recently TMCC  but I still enjoy running conventional. I have many Williams and Lionel postwar units and do sometimes enjoy taking them out for a run. I purchased this 665 just last Sunday at a small local train show for $90.00 ...it runs very well !  

The main reason I went to TMCC is so my passenger car lights always stay uniformly lit. Other than that, I'm happy with conventional. My passenger cars of full of hand painted figures.

I have legacy and conventional, both run at the same time.

Brent

It's that F-N-R business that gets me. Harder to run something gracefully.

StPaul,

    Because I run my old Conventional Tin Plate Engines with the DCS Z4K Mode, I still get all the old smells from the Engines, and on top of that they even run smoother than ever before.  The Z4K Remote Commander Side Receiver allows this to happen,  even gives a little slow speed control to the old Conventional Engines, and operates everything  with the Hand Held Remote Control, or I can also run straight from the Transformer, if I so desire.  Having all the different options is great stuff.  No Forgotten Joy when set up in this manner.  Tin Plate Conventional via Remote Control, a little boys dream come true.

PCRR/Dave 

The latest purchase of the Conventional Post War CoCa Cola Train, operates fantastic in this manner also.

I have been running conventional through track voltage control in the dcs.  Its a lot of fun but not quite as smooth, starting at 5 volts.  I also put in a toggle to run through a conventional transformer.   

I have to say, running a marx commodore Vanderbilt with the dcs handheld is a hoot! !

For me life is complicated and frustrating enough; I want railroading to relax and unwind...therefore the simpler the better. So count me for conventional...seemingly a trend toward the minimalist attitude in a lot of things I do.

I like conventional.  Hell, I like anything that's simple.  Kinda fits my brain power.

I've been running "unconventional" since last May, with Battery-Powered, Remote-Control.

Other than some fairly simple wiring of the components, IMO it's much like conventional, only better.  I simply turn on the transmitter then the receiver/battery in the engine, turn a knob for the direction I want, and advance the throttle knob.

I had to read less than a dozen pages of installation instructions, which IMO made it easier than either DCS or TMCC.  Once the system was installed and running, I haven't had to look at the instructions at all.  Plus, there's no wiring at all presently on my layout.

I spend my time running trains, instead of pouring thru an operating manual, tracking down a wiring problem, or cleaning track and wheels.

It's simple and it works.  I can run a train for over 2 hours before charging, if I'm charging 1 engine I can run another. With 2 transmitters, I can run the mainline engine while switching with another engine.  If I had a transmitter for each engine I could run them all (if I had more hands!).

D500 posted:

It's that F-N-R business that gets me. Harder to run something gracefully.

That's why I prefer 2 position E-units. When you stop the train, a quick bit of reverse to bunch up the slack and then it's in forward "gear" ready to roll when the time comes. 

How's this for conventional running???

It's that F-N-R business that gets me. Harder to run something gracefully.

In my experience, it only takes a brief, minimum application of power to cycle a 3-position e-unit. In most cases the train does not move at all. I find that I rarely want to back up on my small, simple layout, so I leave the e-units turned off most of the time.

I too enjoy the simplicity (for me, after a workday with electronics) of conventional running. Hook up the transformer and off you go. I certainly appreciate TMCC / Legacy / DCS but like 'jockeying' an old fashioned conventional throttle dial to pick up a heavy wagon or move up a grade.

I too like the two position E-Units for the same reason as Andy.  However, with the electronic E units, the cycle is vastly smoother than traditional three position units.  So it's almost as simple as the two position cycle.  

My first conversion to an electronic E unit was way back in 1988.  I converted my C&O switcher to a Dallee E unit.  What a difference it made for me, particularly as an operator of an accessory filled layout. 

Not me, the more confusing it is the better I like it. I have not run in conventional since Tmcc came out in 1995. 

Popi posted:

How's this for conventional running???

Is that fan to cool you or the transformers?

Looks like a fun setup either way!

jhz563 posted:

I have been running conventional through track voltage control in the dcs.  Its a lot of fun but not quite as smooth, starting at 5 volts.  I also put in a toggle to run through a conventional transformer.   

I have to say, running a marx commodore Vanderbilt with the dcs handheld is a hoot! !

Yeah, I like running conventional w/ DCS . I'll tell ya, it's a whole lot more enjoyable when I upgraded to version 4.3, cause now it starts at 1 volt, very cool. I think the reason DCS originally started @ 5 volts was because most postwar loco's wouldn't budge until at least 5 volts was applied to the track.

Being inspired by this post, last night I was playing around with double heading small steamers locked in forward.  The trailing engine was a lionel dockside 0-6-0 from just a few years ago.  Unfortunately I found out that the front coupler does have as much swing as the rear coupler and the tender trailing truck of the lead engine kept getting derailed, even on 042 curves.  I tried to lock the docksider into reverse, but it didn't seem to work.  Anyway, it was still alot of fun, plus in conventional double heading, when one whistle goes off, they all go off!!

Penn-Pacific posted:

jhz563 posted:

I have been running conventional through track voltage control in the dcs.  Its a lot of fun but not quite as smooth, starting at 5 volts.  I also put in a toggle to run through a conventional transformer.   

I have to say, running a marx commodore Vanderbilt with the dcs handheld is a hoot! !

Yeah, I like running conventional w/ DCS . I'll tell ya, it's a whole lot more enjoyable when I upgraded to version 4.3, cause now it starts at 1 volt, very cool. I think the reason DCS originally started @ 5 volts was because most postwar loco's wouldn't budge until at least 5 volts was applied to the track.

My dcs is version 4.3 and still starts at 5 volts.  If yours starts at 1 volt then either I need to change a setting or something is wrong.  I would be much better if it started out at a lower initial voltage.  Looks like I just got a question for the dcs users group. 

I rather doubt I would have returned to trains at all were it not for command control.

However, I am not so keen on the undeniable and inexplicable things that seem to happen anytime a computer is connected to anything!

So these electronified and computerized toys are great . . . until something goes wrong!

Funny, I don't recall anything  going wrong with my Lionels in the 1950s! EVER!!!

They "just ran!" My DCS and TMCC engines? Well, "not so much."

Ahhhh . . . but when they run, they are such a joy!

handyandy posted:

Popi posted:

How's this for conventional running???

Is that fan to cool you or the transformers?

Looks like a fun setup either way!

Both!! playing with toy trains works up quite a sweat!!

well 3 for 3 the 2046 needs new power rollers and 2 rs-3's that are newer can motors in truck well 2 couplers are kaput so I ordered the rollers and coupler's [sp] should be here in a few days. 

have an email to another parts source for parts for my lionel 671 steam turbine.

as to the f-n-r that is easy use the lockout so only goes forward issue all gone, well for me anyways.  I had forgotten the fun running conventional engines.

thanks for all the replies have a fun train day all.

I still have all the PW Lionel my father and I acquired, starting with my first Scout set in 1958.  Before that, we had some Kusan and older Marx, so I did have some 3R O Gauge, and I can run my Kusan on the Gargraves, on a separate track, naturally.  I also have Lionel TMCC engines (25, including ERR conversions) and MTH PS1, PS2, PS3.  However, I do not have DCS or Legacy, and I am fine with that.  I am still building my "final" layout, can run multiple trains on 3 levels, but it looks like Elliot's, not much  scenery or a lot of buildings, just track and bridges, trestle, etc.  But, really enjoy running conventional. With all the numerous PW engines I have, and rolling stock, it is relaxing to simply use the ZWs, KWs and stay on my toes with the throttle.... sorta like running for real.  Keeping your eyes sharp and throttling as necessary.  The ZWCs and 180 bricks are great, but nothing like a couple of PW ZWs and knowing what throttle runs what engine and consist.  Exercise for the brain and wonderful memories.

Jesse  TCA

One thing for sure about conventional trains . Like the Timex watch "they take a licking and keep on ticking". Voltage surges,mag pulses and spikes are no problem and the whole mechanisms are "rad hard".

I am happy people can be satisfied running conventional.    I do not know many who do that.  Great hobby with something for everyone.

I put my pre-war American Flyer Hudson on the track the other day and had a blast running it around the layout. But I still used my remote... 

Brought back lots of memories.

I always run in command. I have a lot of trains parked on powered sidings and ready to go. I build large consists to have fun with.

For testing, I got a MTH Z4000. I connected it to a loop of realtrax and plopped some three rail engines on it one at a time. It was fun watching them go thru their start ups and running them. It was enjoyable to have that throttle for control. So I learned why some guys don't wish to switch to command. I didn't enjoy it as much with smaller controllers until I got the Z4000.

I enjoy conventional operation.  I designed a few high amperage dc power packs and i use them to run modern era (can motor) locomotives that have had their boards removed, regardless of manufacturer.  

It is an interesting test of the mechanics (motor, gears, rods) to see how silently (or not) the new stuff will run. 

Lou N

Lou, always good to see you post.    Please keep me posted if you are going to be in my area.  I have a wall and Train America sign that still needs your signature.  For those who do not know Lou, he was a huge player in Right of Way and Train America.

StPaul posted:

well 3 for 3 the 2046 needs new power rollers and 2 rs-3's that are newer can motors in truck well 2 couplers are kaput so I ordered the rollers and coupler's [sp] should be here in a few days. 

have an email to another parts source for parts for my lionel 671 steam turbine.

as to the f-n-r that is easy use the lockout so only goes forward issue all gone, well for me anyways.  I had forgotten the fun running conventional engines.

thanks for all the replies have a fun train day all.

if you haven't contacted Jeff Kane for parts, he's the man.

www.ttender.com

Marty Fitzhenry posted:

Lou, always good to see you post.    Please keep me posted if you are going to be in my area.  I have a wall and Train America sign that still needs your signature.  For those who do not know Lou, he was a huge player in Right of Way and Train America.

Thanks Marty. I'm a little behind right now. I broke my wrist and am getting used to doing alot of stuff one handed. That doesnt excuse me from paying you a visit however. Soon I hope. 

Lou