George Stock PRR H10 steamer

As was posted on your YouTube channel: "You have some of the best stuff". I can't imagine how and where you find these perhaps one of a kind models, but thankfully you share them with we mere mortals. Stunning.

Mark in Oregon

That is a beautiful model.  Late Saginaw or early CLW with beautiful hand lettering.  But do not despair - this may be the second most plentiful model in O Scale, behind the Varney ten-wheeler.  I think I have three, with three more under construction.  They just keep "dropping in . . ."

What a find.  I have three of George's HO GG1s including one unbuilt kit in the box from 1946.  I have yet to track down a steam locomotive.  Two run across one of his O pieces would be a real treasure.

Did George do the hand lettering with a drafting pen?

A striping brush, I think.  Drafting pens are usually one way.  Leroy and Koh-i-noor made ink pens with very fine footprints, but it is difficult to find paint that works in them.  I have done models with Leroy lettering using some very special artist water-base paint, but Leroy looks too much like Futura for my tastes.

Back to the H10 - here is the first kit-built model I ever tackled.  Bob Smith sent the kit, and was very quick to replace missing and incorrect parts.

@bob2 posted:

That is a beautiful model.  Late Saginaw or early CLW with beautiful hand lettering.  But do not despair - this may be the second most plentiful model in O Scale, behind the Varney ten-wheeler.  I think I have three, with three more under construction.  They just keep "dropping in . . ."

...we should ALL be so lucky...🙂

Mark in Oregon

George did his lettering with a brush from everything I've read and from the people I've talked to who knew him.  When I got my first Stock GG1 in 1995, I had recently moved to Phoenix from one of the suburbs and found it at a local swamp meet for $10.  It was missing a lead truck, one of the pantographs and the motors.  Lou English senior was the one who ultimately helped me identify it around 1995, but even he told me "I never knew George made a GG-1".

Not to steal this thread, but an article I put together for my TCA Division newsletter years ago on the GG1s.  Posted here before, but not in a while.  In the years since I wrote this many have corresponded with me to fill in the back story on George and his wonderful contributions to this hobby.

Hello all ..and Bob ...the castings are much more crisp than the Saginaw one  I have .... and the chassis is totally different ..and no is not a CLW chassis ...  When I picked it up thought   just another Saginaw  ..but bottom of tender signed by Stock   ... and everything seems to be to the nines casting wise over my Saginaw .... unknown if Stock  tweaked the mold  or ?  different roof hatch on cab ...

here is a link to see a Stock B6A switcher introduced in 1936  ..running past the Stock E 6  introduced in 1935 ...first commercially available HO engine made in America ...

https://youtu.be/UXBBqtyUkV8

cheers Carey 

Jeez, Carey you are a fountain for all things vintage. I suppose the Atlantic behind that switcher is a...? 🤔🤔🤔

Mark in Oregon

I stand corrected.  It was just that everything I could see in the picture looked like early CLW, before he went to steel frames, plastic drivers, and etched tenders.  He used a different casting process, but I think he used the Saginaw patterns, cleaned up and skinnied up.

Here is a cleaned up Saginaw H10 locomotive bed:

Bob2, when did CLW go to steel frames? How many different materials did Smith use for the driver centers on his H-10? How successful were the “plastic” driver centers?

Lee - don't know the first two.  I do know he at least used cast iron drivers at first.

Plastic driver centers were very accurate and quite stable.  I did not like them because they were plastic, and because electrical pickup was more difficult.  I have them on several H10s and one I1sa.  All pickup is from tender wheels on mine.

Hello all ..Bill Lenoir  produces the 3 Saginaw engines 1940-41 ..Bill in invited to serve Uncle Sam ..   3 Saginaw steamer parts and patterns go to Pioneer of Chicago ...they sell off some bits ...  by 1948/9 The Saginaw patterns are with Bob Smith  CLW ... claiming production soon ......no .... Smith and Lenoir both in FLA   by the mid 50's ...  Smith announces the new and improved H10 about 1958 ...  guessing Lenoir helped with the tweaking...   Smith gave/ sold  Saginaw patterns to Steve Neil .....  I now  have several of the Saginaw patterns ... another post down the road . ....

Cheers Carey

How neat!  Let me know when you find a foundry.

Have you captured the G5 and E6 yet?

I love learning about the old models and the people who got O scale started.

Would be excited to see those patterns Carey, and like Bob wouldn't it be great to have them put to work again. Im anticipating your post. The E6 and G5 are of great interest, I cant recall seeing an example of the G5.   cTr...... ( Choose the Right )

I have one semi-complete, and parts for another.

Probably no future in casting more.  Foundry work is no longer cheap, and there are enough used Saginaws out there for all of us.  Here is my unfinished G5.  Needs a new firebox, new motor, and paint.  And valve gear.

Guess I better finish this up - the first is a converted H10 with Saginaw main frame, sprung, and Lobaugh drivers.  Scratch tender.  Second - Long Island - is a stock Saginaw H10.  Last is a Saginaw E6 from the Schwanda collection.  It has many happy miles on Max's PRR layout.  His daughter sold it to me.

On the first photo, if you look hard enough, you can see that I added 1/4" to the firebox.  The E6 is apparently a bit longer than the H10.  Also, only the very first E6sb locomotives had the larger sand dome characteristic of the H10.  Saginaw made a different casting for the front part of the boiler for the G5 and E6.  Firebox was sheet metal.

All terrific looking...👍

Mark in Oregon

Thanks Bob for the pics of the G5 and another look at the E6, H10, never gets old. Im sure the "Pearly Gates" ( some time in the distant future ) will be held open for you, by a couple of very nice door stops, just my opinion.     cTr... ( Choose the Right )

@bob2 posted:

Guess I better finish this up - the first is a converted H10 with Saginaw main frame, sprung, and Lobaugh drivers.  Scratch tender.  Second - Long Island - is a stock Saginaw H10.  Last is a Saginaw E6 from the Schwanda collection.  It has many happy miles on Max's PRR layout.  His daughter sold it to me.

Odd coincidence, I just (yesterday, the seller is in CT; that car got some miles put on it!) fished an observation car out of the 'bay that has a sticker on the bottom that states "built by Max Schwanda" and another with a San Diego address, unfortunately no build date is visible. Anyway, it appears to be reasonably well-built and is lettered PULLMAN, named DIPLOMAT, and carries a tail sign for the L&N.

Too bad nobody ever did a magazine article about Max's layout and operations.  It was a well-detailed and large "switching" operation.  Unlike me, he kept everything clean and lubricated,and it all ran on a schedule.  He used Roundhouse couplers with the "hose" cut off.

It was almost all PRR, with Saginaw locomotives predominating.

I barely knew him when I was writing for OSN and OSR.  I really didn't do layouts, anyway.  But somebody should have . . .