GGD SP Daylight cars Stateside and SHIPPING

From the video, the interiors look especially well done !!!   And multiple versions to boot !!!
Yah anxious to see !!!!  

@TrainBub posted:

From the video, the interiors look especially well done !!!   And multiple versions to boot !!!
Yah anxious to see !!!!  

Yeah, although (I know this is a mindless detail), I hope my Daylight dome's interior has the pictured details like the ash stands, which are definitely prototypical, and the few contemporary photos that survive show them. I did not understand the two different interior scheme versions mentioned on the GGD website, but I trust Scott. Anyway, I hope someone posts a description of these cars before I see mine - Yah, I'm that anxious!

@Hancock52 posted:

Yeah, although (I know this is a mindless detail), I hope my Daylight dome's interior has the pictured details like the ash stands, which are definitely prototypical, and the few contemporary photos that survive show them. I did not understand the two different interior scheme versions mentioned on the GGD website, but I trust Scott. Anyway, I hope someone posts a description of these cars before I see mine - Yah, I'm that anxious!

The two versions of the interior is correct. I think one was more for viewing scenery (chair seating) and the other more of a glorified lounge with tables and chairs.

My set is due to arrive on tuesday. I’ve got the 8 car set, articulated coaches, and a dome. Hopefully there are no delays or SNAFU’s with the signature requirement. Once I get them I’ll post some pics.

Just got my 8 car set plus 3 add on cars unboxed. Took about 45 minutes to unpack everything and get it on the track. Haven't installed the diaphragms or add on details yet. More pictures, videos, and thoughts to come. Pictured with a Lionel Vision GS-4 for color reference.

Beautiful!  Note that the "Southern Pacific Lines" lettering is prior to 1946.

Yes I'm aiming for a 1941 prewar consist, although I'll admit I'm not entirely sure what the order of cars should be.

Overall I'm very pleased with this set. The cars are gorgeous with great interiors and a lot of figures. A couple paint issues, mostly with the silver stripes. My one big complaint is with the diaphragms. The colors on them are dull compared to the cars, and they just look goofy. Too much fabric so it just bunches up whether on curves or straight track. The good thing is there are plenty of extras so I can experiment with making shorter ones. All in all, super happy with the set. The only way to get accurate SP cars in O scale!

Has anyone seen the dome cars yet? I hope those cars are NOT lettered "Southern Pacific Lines" as the domes weren't built until 1954 and 1955, long after the "Lines" was dropped.

@Will Ebbert May I recommend

The relevant bit for your question.

That's perfect! Thank you!

Will, the “extra” diaphragms aren’t extra’s. It was intended that a cloth diaphragm would go at every coupling.

Below are prelimary photos of my set including the dome lounge. The domes were not offered in SP Lines so the purists can relax. Personally I like the cloth diaphragms as they close up the “leap of faith” gaps on 3 rail cars, although I haven’t placed the cars on 0-72 curved track yet so I’ll have to see what that looks like. I did do some futzing with the diaphragms already. Some of them were bunching up weird which caused the fabric to bulge outwards making for an ungainly protrusion beyond the car sides. Adding a small spot of hot glue to better secure the fabric to the face plates seemed to do the trick. I think some more futzing will be in order to improve their appearance.

Since I don’t have a layout yet, I will need to set up my floor layout to operate them.

Erik, your overview of full width diaphragms in the O scale market was very intersting. The Pecos cars look amazing! But the massive radius needed is a big deal breaker. I have plans to construct a building for my train layout and intend to lay larger curves but I’ll be lucky if I can keep the minimum to 0-96 and not be stuck with an oval. Hopefully my Daylight set will look good enough on that size curve.

Not many hobbyists have access to a large warehouse to build our layouts in to attain the minimum 15’ diameter curve to run a train that fine looking.

Thanks for all the photos, in particular of the domes. I have one of the Daylight ones coming soon although I am not entirely sure about the interior seating plan. I think that it is probably “A” by the car numbering.

If I remember correctly, the diaphragms became a bone of contention with the first run of these cars, as in they did not have any despite the large gap between articulated cars. The solution was peel and stick paper accordion-style constructs, the problem is how they look on short radius (O-72) 3rail curves. Frankly I
don’t think there’s a better answer for 3rail curves.

The diaphragm look as good as I expected IMO.

I am little concerned about the paint quality. Has anyone else seen problems with the paint application as the previous poster?

@naresar posted:

@Will Ebbert May I recommend

The relevant bit for your question.

I ordered an 8 car set and 4 sets of the 2 articulated chair cars to match this. Excited to receive them all and can't wait to have the ultimate daylight train with the Vision GS-4.

Congrats to all that have gotten theirs and thanks for the pictures. Beautiful.  

Erik, those GS models are gorgeous! Thank you for sharing.
Also having access to a 30’ x 50’ layout to operate that set is pretty awesome. I’m hoping I’ll be able to get a 24’ x 35’ room for my dream layout but I may be pushing my luck a bit on size.

On a side note as an SP details obsessive, I don’t quite understand why all model manufacturers imediately associate the forward position train indicator boards with SP Lines lettering, especially on GS-4/5 models. This essentially restricts your modeling era to late 1941/42. SP started moving the train indicator boards mid-boiler on the GS-4’s in 1942 because the original forward position made them hard to read at night because of the added MARS light blinding station personnel. By 1943 all GS engines had their indicator boards moved mid-boiler so the position would be standard.

@Erik C Lindgren you’re in luck, Stout Auctions has a couple of those GS-4s in an upcoming auction.

That upcoming Stout auction has everything needed to make an SP fan’s dreams come true (if they’re an O 2 railer) and bankrupt them at the same time. If I were in 2 rail I’d be in deep doo doo.

Beautiful set!  Curious, but whose tender will be the closest match color wise to them? My uneducated view is that the GS locomotives we have are all pretty 'rich' in color whereas these cars are not quite so intense;  might that be prototypical?

I agree that the cars aren't as vibrant as the Lionel locomotives. While I can't speak to the MTH version's color match, Scott said that the cars were intended to match the GGD cars and 3rd Rail GS-4 done several years ago, so if someone has one of those, then they should be spot on.

@Will Ebbert posted:

I agree that the cars aren't as vibrant as the Lionel locomotives. While I can't speak to the MTH version's color match, Scott said that the cars were intended to match the GGD cars and 3rd Rail GS-4 done several years ago, so if someone has one of those, then they should be spot on.

I just had mine delivered and will unpack later. Yep it will be interesting. I will be comparing paint to my run one 5 car and 2car articulated. I hope they DO match !!!  Scotts Daylight paint is a bit subdued too.
This gets interesting as the run 1 cars were manufactured in South Korea - not China. I’ll also be interested in the upgrades.
The cars will get used wth my GS2 and4, MT4, and Alco PA. The match won’t be critical as I like to run late consists with mixes of cars from different GGD runs. I’ll mix Harriman head end with Daylight, Sunset Ltd, and Silver/red stripe - all GGD. Quite a handsome mix. The addition of a 3/4 Dome will be a super addition. Only lack a Lark car. (A new run of the night train Cascade would be a Nice Next GGD SP Offering )

Have fun !!! 😬👍

@Erik C Lindgren

Hello Erik, I have admired your work for some time, but to date had never commented. The other day you shared a link to a video of your Daylight cars circling a layout. Can you share that link again? The whole video was impressive but I was taken with the structures. I liked the city scape in which it appeared you had two rows of buildings. I am in the process of finishing my train room and I want to emulate that scene! Did you scratch build those structures?

thanks for sharing!

Well for what it’s worth …… YAY !!!! To my eyes in a lit room, my Run 1, Run 2  2 car articulated cars - Daylight colors MATCH. The Run 2 roof colors Are a bit more shiny black. This doesn’t bother me.
There are a few minor differences. Run 1 car ends are black - Run 2 Daylight red. Run 2 coupling on the articulated trucks are closer (nice). Roof vents are different. Run 2 has some do-it-yourself add-on pieces that’ll be tough for me /steps and it looks like hoses. The Killer is tiny Tiny TINY Screws  !!!  🤭😳😖  

Run 2 is another Gorgeous Effort from Scott and Sunset Golden Gate !!!  I’m grateful that I am able to add on with “extras” (3,2 car articulated, domes) to my partial (5 car plus 2 car articulated) Run 1 set and finally have a beautiful “full” consist !!!  And the Run1 -Run2 color Match is big, Big, BIG !!!!  Well Executed !!!

CHEERS !!!!

Run 1 is upper

Run 1 upper

Run 1 black end, Run 2 Daylight red

VERY NICE !!! 🙂🙂😜😜

These two cars have different interiors in the elevated sections. The Daylight has more “lounge” seating while the silver has “benches”.  The area closest to the non-dome flat is lounge in both  

Wow! It appears that 3/4 dome is the "talk of the forum"! I can't wait to get my Amtrak version next month!

@prrhorseshoecurve posted:

Wow! It appears that 3/4 dome is the "talk of the forum"! I can't wait to get my Amtrak version next month!

Pretty spiffy models for sure. I’ll bet any of these will be scarce. I’ll be anxiously awaiting its arrival too !!!!

@TrainBub posted:

Pretty spiffy models for sure. I’ll bet any of these will be scarce. I’ll be anxiously awaiting its arrival too !!!!

That was one of the motivators that pushed me to pony up the bucks and order one. I figured they would be hard to find later and would be sought after. I’ve never spent that kind of money on a passenger car before but I’m glad I did

@Ryan Selvius posted:

That was one of the motivators that pushed me to pony up the bucks and order one. I figured they would be hard to find later and would be sought after. I’ve never spent that kind of money on a passenger car before but I’m glad I did

Oh yeah! Trust me. I know!

@c.sam posted:

Beautiful set!  Curious, but whose tender will be the closest match color wise to them? My uneducated view is that the GS locomotives we have are all pretty 'rich' in color whereas these cars are not quite so intense;  might that be prototypical?

All of the recent Lionel Daylight engine colors will be much brighter/more vivid than GGD/3rd Rail's, including the recent VL Daylight GS engines. The only GS Daylight I know of that will match these GGD Daylight cars is 3rd Rail's own brass GS-4, which has been issued a couple of times. Its colors are pretty subdued and I always thought that they are prototypical. However, recent repaints of the real #4449 use a more modern paint than in its original operating days and this has a fairly deep gloss to it. I understand that it has the advantage of cleaning up more readily, especially from fuel oil spillage, than the original finish did. So what is prototypical depends on the period you model.

P.S. I don't think that any manufacturer has tried to replicate the modern Daylight finish I describe above; all their schemes use a fairly matte finish.

Speaking purely for myself, I am not troubled by the color difference with Lionel Daylight engines. The GGD Daylight cars I already have are such attention grabbers that the difference does not matter.

Would tend to agree with you Hancock52. I remember we had several of the Williams brass Daylights when they were introduced and they had a fairly high gloss finish if memory serves me. They were beautiful and sold for almost $2000 within a few months of introduction. I think they were $795 or $895 retail.

@T4TT posted:

@Erik C Lindgren

Hello Erik, I have admired your work for some time, but to date had never commented. The other day you shared a link to a video of your Daylight cars circling a layout. Can you share that link again? …thanks for sharing!

Sure thing, sorry about the removal of the link.

Scott has the seating and numbering correct. 3601-3604 all have the same seating arrangements - lower lounge and rows of “benches” in elevated section. In 3605, 3606 the upper area is like an expanded lounge area with half circle seating in different configurations - like conversation areas with different orientations. (No pix yet for CP and we await the Amtrak. We will see what those interiors hold)
The cars were originally assigned to specific routes - I’ll let someone spill that info. I don’t have access to my SP ref books right now.
The cars ARE Stunning. The first clue was in the video Scott posted in December. Incredible interior details. Multi colors. Lots of drink tables.

wow, Wow, WOW !!!  

@Erik C Lindgren Special thanks for another of your outstanding sets of photos and the vid. Quick comment since you mention detailing the Daylight version interior:

I have roughly the same set of historical photos of these cars as you and of the original 10 window #3600, but only a couple of them are in color. From these it looks like the lower lounge area was wood-paneled, including the enclosed counter at the end, and the dome interior painted light passenger car interior green. There was also carpeting throughout and at least the larger seating fabric upholstered. (The dome interior photo might have discolored with age as the green and blue shown in it have fairly deep tones.)

I would like to produce at least a reasonable facsimile of the interior scheme. Although I haven’t got my version yet, I have actually started work on prints of the leaf panels based on one particular sepia photo of that end of the lounge I have found. What I don’t know yet is how the dome car disassembles, in particular whether the frame has to slide out of channels in the body extrusion. Any ideas on that?

@Hancock52 posted:

@Erik C Lindgren Special thanks for another of your outstanding sets of photos and the vid. Quick comment since you mention detailing the Daylight version interior:

I have roughly the same set of historical photos of these cars as you and of the original 10 window #3600, but only a couple of them are in color. From these it looks like the lower lounge area was wood-paneled, including the enclosed counter at the end, and the dome interior painted light passenger car interior green. There was also carpeting throughout and at least the larger seating fabric upholstered. (The dome interior photo might have discolored with age as the green and blue shown in it have fairly deep tones.)

I would like to produce at least a reasonable facsimile of the interior scheme. Although I haven’t got my version yet, I have actually started work on prints of the leaf panels based on one particular sepia photo of that end of the lounge I have found. What I don’t know yet is how the dome car disassembles, in particular whether the frame has to slide out of channels in the body extrusion. Any ideas on that

I cannot per OGR policy share the good references for this project; my advice please do go and check out the following book.

https://sphts.org/product/sout...ge-dome-parlor-cars/

@Will Ebbert posted:

Yes I'm aiming for a 1941 prewar consist, although I'll admit I'm not entirely sure what the order of cars should be.

Overall I'm very pleased with this set. The cars are gorgeous with great interiors and a lot of figures. A couple paint issues, mostly with the silver stripes. My one big complaint is with the diaphragms. The colors on them are dull compared to the cars, and they just look goofy. Too much fabric so it just bunches up whether on curves or straight track. The good thing is there are plenty of extras so I can experiment with making shorter ones. All in all, super happy with the set. The only way to get accurate SP cars in O scale!

Will,

I had a similar blemish on the skirt of my observation car, I was able to gently remove it with my fingernail.

It appeared to be some kind of adhesive

@Erik C Lindgren posted:

I cannot per OGR policy share the good references for this project; my advice please do go and check out the following book.

https://sphts.org/product/sout...ge-dome-parlor-cars/

Thanks, I do have that and a couple of other volumes of the series. When Scott was developing the dome car project, I sent him info on the original #3600, although ultimately he went for the later, longer and more numerous 12 window domes.

What I am lacking is precise interior color info but I can suit myself in that respect.  Also the method of getting at/out the interiors of these cars, which remains a puzzle to me.

Hancock- there are a few color company photos of the 3601 and later cars in this book
Also the conceptual artwork and drawings are reproduced showing color schemes and trim. Also Amtrak is covered and the complete disposition of the series. I have the whole collection of these books; some of the best passenger car books published. John Signor is a genius.

@Ryan Selvius posted:

On a side note as an SP details obsessive, I don’t quite understand why all model manufacturers imediately associate the forward position train indicator boards with SP Lines lettering, especially on GS-4/5 models. This essentially restricts your modeling era to late 1941/42. SP started moving the train indicator boards mid-boiler on the GS-4’s in 1942 because the original forward position made them hard to read at night because of the added MARS light blinding station personnel. By 1943 all GS engines had their indicator boards moved mid-boiler so the position would be standard.

Ryan, we’re all adults here on OGR, after a few days I’ve pondered responding to your statement regarding the “correct way” to do number boards on a GS-4; did it ever cross your mind that maybe for a moment someone other than yourself may prefer the earlier version of GS-4 or they may model an era predating 1943? 🤔 Opinions are like that, if I may be blunt to remind those in interest everyone has them and none of them are right, or wrong. ☝️ Just saying, as the old saying goes. -Kindest of Regards 🙂