Had it with Marx 666 front pilot

Marx will usually track on almost anything, except for switches with guard rails.

Something on the loco is bent. Will the wheel on one side travel up and down the exact same distance as the other wheel? Will the pilot truck swing from side to side exactly the same amount each way?

Makes me wonder why so many 666’s you see don’t run a front pilot.

@Dennis Pateras posted:

Makes me wonder why so many 666’s you see don’t run a front pilot.

Because Marx made them that way. Some company buyers wanted to cut costs, so Marx offered them with all sorts of deletions, pilot trucks, trailing trucks, smoke systems, lack of white stripe running boards, and on and on.

Did you find anything bent on yours?

Another reason some don't have pilot trucks is the over-and-under trestle set.  There was a problem with the change in elevation.

Actually Dennis you have discovered (the hard way) why so many Marx engines are 0-4-0.  Mr. Marx designed them that way because in his testing he found that the front truck, which did nothing for the toy locomotive was constantly coming off the tracks.  So he fixed that problem by making the engines without a front truck, despite what the prototype might have had. Remember for much of the Marx lineage, they were the "cheap" trains and Marx was making TOYS not models.  He was after all the largest toy maker in the world.  He felt that a locomotive that constantly de-railed would spoil the "play experience" for the young owner, so he eliminated the problem.

Best wishes

Don

Nothing was bent.. everyone’s reply makes sense..  thank you all

Well guys I took all your advice.I took out the front pilot truck, ran flawlessly. Didn’t have to take out the trailing truck.Thanks again to all of you.

Dennis :  You and Mr. Louis Marx came to the same conclusion, remove the trouble making front truck.  Now you can run that 666 until the cows come home (even if you don't have any cows!).  What are you pulling ?  Freight or Passenger?  What kind of cars (Marx pulled just about anything with this loco)?   Here are some examples from my collection and some other Marx engines for you to peruse.

(Pre-War) Marx Commodore Vanderbilt (1930's for this one but the CV was made both pre and post war)  0-4-0 pulling lithographed frame Bogota type passenger cars and an 8 wheel type 51 tender from around 1935.

The 400/490 plastic 0-4-0.  This is likely the most common Marx locomotive.  This locomotive was made 1953-54 then as the "490" vice the "400" from 1962 until 1975 (When Marx stopped making trains and like Lionel sold the rights to use its tooling and name to Quaker Oats.  Today the majority of sets you see advertised on e-bay use the # 400/490 locomotive. It is incredibly reliable and durable and has the almost unbreakable Marx motor.  To give you a personal example, this Christmas we had met at our family's summer home to celebrate the Holiday with family (COVID having prevented this last year) and my fancy expensive Lionel engine pulling the "around the tree" train suddenly gave up the ghost!  I was separated from my collection but luckily I had the very cheap 1960's vintage Marx set I had bought for my 6 year old nephew to play with.  So I grabbed the #490 engine that came with this set and hooked it up.  In an instant we had Christmas trains again as that 490 pulled the quite heavy Lionel freight consist around the tree with no problem.

Breaking the mold is the magnificent 333.  Made by Marx in the "golden age" of toy trains, 1949-1958, primarily to compete with Lionel's middle grade die cast engines but at a significantly lower price.  A 4-6-2 all die cast, highly detailed model that came with a fully die cast tender so heavy you could use if for a book end!.  While this violates the "no front truck" rule, Marx must have researched then followed a study on weight distribution because my 333 front truck does not de-rail. The 333  runs like a top and at this weight can pull almost anything I can hitch to it.   I personally think this is the best engine Marx made.

Best of luck, hope you enjoy your Marx trains...I know I do!

Don

Thanks Ron for all this info . Always have had and still do,  Lionel including a freight set I got for Christmas as a kid in the 50’s.Still runs like a top..I had Just Started  getting interested in Marx after reading Louis Marx history. So far besides the 666 I have two tin boxcars, the red UP Challenger and the brown New Haven with the original NH script, really cool, so your info and pictures will be invaluable. I do love the them so far and already enjoying this partial set. Thanks again..take care

I have 4 Marx 666, 5 Marx 999 and 3 Marx 333 engines, all have front trucks and all have front trucks that do not have derailing problems.  My layout has used Marx and Lionel 027 track and 31 Marx 1590 metal frog switches and is 44 years old.  So front trucks can work.  Yours must have  undetermined issues with the truck, wheels or track.

Do you have other Marx 666 engines to run and test for front truck derailments?  If so you and the do not derail you may be able to determine the difference between the two front trucks.  If both derail it may point to track issues.

The the wheels must be gauge correctly.  Push the truck wheels on the track to get one to go to inside of the track rail and the other wheel must have its wheel edge at least as wide as the middle of the other rail. It the rail gauge is too small, widen it with shims to the inside of the wheel and axle with a single loop of solid copper bell wire or a piece of thin tin can metal drilled and split to act as a wedge to widen the wheels between the wheel inside and the axle wide part holding them apart.

If they measure proper gauge for typical track, test the front wheel gauge at the spot of the derailments.  Correct the track gauge if you find a problem here pinching in with a pair of Channel Lock pliers to narrow the track gauge.

This issue may test your patience, investigation, observation and problem solving skills but there is a cause of the derailments.

Charlie

I only have the one 666, I did adjust gauge once on the pilot truck with channel locks worked temporarily. I will try your suggestion making sure on wheel edge is at least as wide as the middle of the rail..my Lionel Scout doesn’t derail  so I don’t think it’s a track issue…thanks, appreciate it

https://ogrforum.com/...1#159519380386351931   Charlie I looped s piece of solid copper wire around the front pilot axle to keep it on the rail like you suggested So far so good.. Thanks so much !

Dennis

Glad it worked for you.  I must have 8 or 10 wheels sets on various cars/engines with that fix.  Narrow wheel gauge is common with 50 year old trains and popular with Marx Tin cars.

Charlie

Charlie…. Yea first I tried the copper on both wheels, didn’t work.. one was just right and it looks right with the front pilot back on. I’ll have to remember it for other stuff..thanks again.           Dennis