Let's talk about cell phones at York

I dont think this is any type of response you're looking for, but you cant use/have your cell phone at York???

The problem is that the cell phone rule is outdated and a bit too heavy-handed.  But like many things in life it wouldn't be necessary to have a rule if people exercised good jugment and basic manners.  Personally, I would alter it to a recommendation that cell phones can be answered but conversations should take place outside the main room of the hall or in a place where you are not in people's way or otherwise causing a disturbance. 

Allan,

  I started fussing about that a long time ago, and for the life of me I don't understand the rule. Seems to me it would PROMOTE the hobby that can always use new blood.

 

AM I that far off base here? I don't think so.

 

Rod

I'm basically a Luddite when it comes to smart phones. My flip phone still functions adequately. I joined TCA accepting the No Camera, No Cell Phone, No Stroller rules. To me, it's like buying a house next to an airport and then complaining about the noise. If you open up on cell phones, then the camera ban is out the window too as most phones are now also cameras.

 

That's my $0.02

 

Gilly

 

BTW, after having both ankles whacked numerous times by stinking strollers (drawing blood) at a Greenberg Show, the No Stroller rule is one rule I truly applaud. 

Outside, yes. Inside the Halls, NOPE.

I may be wrong, but I thought phones were OK at YORK but must be answered outside of the selling areas.

 

Just for the record O scale trains mag. does print articles from 3 railers who model to scale ie structures etc.

 

  

I have never been to York but I do go to the Amherst Train show at the Big E. That is a huge show. I have only used my phone maybe three or for times in all the years that I have been going. Most of the time to find Eddiem or Superwarp so I can meet them for dinner.  Only once that I used it when I thought I found a car someone was looking for.

 

It is not a big deal but I do agree it is antiquated.

I thought it was a pretty good article. I actually think that his articles are one of the top highlights of the magazine.

Hi Allan,

 

I read Lou Palumbo's column when I received that magazine and enjoyed it very much. I also agree with your take on the subject and fully agree.

Alex

I did not see this coming from you......but yes....cell phones are here to stay!! I have a dumb phone. I still use a 2004 vintage Razor. It works 100% of the time so I see no need to replace. BUT....even this dinosaur of a phone comes in handy at train shows. I put in notes about things to look for. Often at shows I get overwhelmed by all the stuff and layouts. Having just a list is a good thing. I'm not a TCA member so it does not effect me now....but I'd like to attend someday so......

NO cell phones in the halls. That'a the rule. Either abide by it or don't go to the meet. Why must you Allan, which supprise's me, start something like this on the forum. If you don't like the rule don't GO. This is really stupid. You & Rich don't like the way York is run because neither of you are COLLECTORS. It's a collectors meet. TCA do you know what it stands for? You are lucky you have the Orange & purple halls to promote the new stuff. 

I don't mind the rule.  Maybe I can offer another perspective.

I do not have a stand at York, but I do work in Retail sales.

There is nothing more annoying and rude than a customer walking into your store on their cell phone.  I would imagine the same would go for a seller at York.  They would be trying to make sales, and they would have some yahoo talking to their wife on the phone in front of his stand.

York is holy train ground..... I don't use my cell phone at church... do you?

I thought this was resolved? Smarts phones are allowed to use paypal to purchase items from dealers and individuals. 
But to answer a call this was to be done in a designated area, and no cameras allowed in the manufactures display areas.
We are adults here and don't need to bicker about this. Just make it so.

Eddie, Eddie, Eddie...

 

Please don't shoot the messenger!  I just relayed info about a column written by a well-known and highly respected York participant/dealer/Hall Captain that appeared in a competing publication.  I found it very interesting and worth sharing simply on its own merits.

 

So, I'm not a collector, huh?  Just what led you to that conclusion?  I'll happily put my collection of select O gauge (road name specific now), contemporary O gauge tinplate, Marklin MAXI, and Marklin HO, up against most others I have seen or heard about. 

 

I consider myself a collector and operator, but my background in hobby publishing since the late 1980s has been far more oriented to the collecting aspect (Greenberg Books, Kalmbach Books, Antique Trader Books, Landmark Books) than to my brief 5-1/2 year stint with OGR where we have an intentional operating emphasis.

 

I thoroughly enjoy York, and they can run it any way they care to.  I'll attend whenever I possibly can, and gladly support the event with my registration fee even if I can't attend.  But I do not live with my head in the sand, and I'm not afraid to express my opinions if/when I feel they may have some impact over time.

 

Eddie, I realize you don't give a hoot.  But just imagine the drop in attendance/membership if there were no Orange or Purple Halls at York.  Aside from meeting with old and new friends, the Orange, Purple and Brown Halls are the ONLY halls I visit at York.  Despite the TCA name, it's an OPERATOR's world now, and we all do a bit of collecting along the way.  So please get over the "collector" attitude.  

 

Changes are a comin' (albeit eventually)... and there's nothing you can do about it.

 

David

What I heard some time ago that the rule applies to communication devices in general, and was originally written for walkie talkies. The idea behind the rule was that groups of collectors would/could/did co-ordinate sweeps of the meet and buy up all the desirable pieces before the majority of the attendees had a chance at them.

 

Nowadays collectors are less prominent than operators, but you know what they say about old habits. The part where it sinks into absurdity is when you have halls where no sales take place (meaning the Black hall layout displays). I suspect that had the ED really thought this through, they might've killed the idea of having layout displays altogether, and avoided the extra attention to these rules.

 

---PCJ

It is time for the TCA ED to move into the 21st century. Cell phones are a very important part of life now. I think it's time to take matters into our  own hands and ignore the rule.  Be nice but just use your phone without going outside. Maybe they (ED ) will get the hint. 

 

I use my smart phone for lists, keeping track of friends I came with, and many other things. Hey fellows and gals it is 2013, lets enjoy it. 

Two thoughts here (and while I have a blackberry for work that I am required to carry, I am generally not a fan of people who obsess over technology and constantly walk around on the phone):

 

1.  I understand your point about being permitted to answer, and then take outside, cell calls.  My experience is that I have, a few times, not been given the opportunity to do that before having someone say something.  This then relates to point #2.

 

2.  The rule is emblematic of an "old school" attitude that is a turn off to new blood.  I'm generally an "old school" kind of guy but at the same time the hobby will die off if you don't case a wide net.  Stated a bit differently, TCA's eastern division has a reputation of being a bunch of grumpy old people.  Hostility towards cell phones doesn't help this perception, and it drives away new people from the hobby.  That's why I would take the rule and soften it in someway to not give off the same level of hostility. 

 

Is the rule just for talking on the phone?

Or is it also against texting, checking out prices, lists, things like that?

Dang it Allan,

 

Eddie is the self anointed judge on who is or is not a collector and keeper of the York faith. If he says you are not a collector, you are not. If he deems the Orange hall is nothing but interlopers and the layouts in the black hall are occupying space that should be used by sellers, they better consider the errors of their ways.

As for the phone talking itself, yea that is annoying  but not that big of a deal. I do have a problem if they say we can't even look at our phone inside, since I use it for my shopping list and a quick look to research an item I am unsure about or need to see about a price. I have also sent payments to vendors PayPal accounts with it

Also I saw more people jerked around about the new "No Large Backpacks" rule last time than I did thrown out over phones

 

There is no TCA against those, these are local rules

 OK, here goes. Let me see if I can make my point.

First, it's their club and their rules, so whatever they want goes. You know what the rules really mean?? No body's invited that's not there for trains only! No nonsense approach I guess.

I have not joined and probably won't. I just can't see the price of joining some frat like this.

 What I believe should happen is another show like this established where all the dealers come to show their products, and antiquated rules don't apply. A show where the hobby is welcoming new comers, not saying we need references first.

 No grumpy old men saying no children should be allowed to get in my way. No hoarding of new technology while trying to hold the hobby at hostage. No.....

 well it's hard not to bash when there's so much material out there. If this club doesn't adapt, they will die off I guess. Maybe not? Even the Catholic church adapts.

 Ok, fire away. I said it. There's a lot of great people in the club so it's not all that bad. It's just out of my league by choice, for cost vs. benefit reasons.

Who takes calls now anyway? We all text or IM

 

quote:

There is no TCA against those, these are local rules

 

Yes, many people forget that the York train meet is run by the Eastern Division of the TCA, the national TCA does not manage the event in any way. But many people on this forum only belong to the TCA so they can attend the York show, so the difference for many is moot.

 

At a recent show I was a bit down the isle from a person ignoring the cell phone rule. Elbow out, not paying attention to where he was walking, he knocked over a tableholders stack of paper material. He just kept walking on, either oblivious or unconcerned about the mess he made. Good thing it was only paper, and not a fragile item(s).

On another thread, a poster is bemoaning the fact that he cannot call a friend to see whether he should pick an item up for that friend. As I posted there, the York show is for the people in attendance. Attendees devote time and money to make the trip. They deserve to be able to purchase what's there, not someone who is at the other end of a cell phone.

BINGO! Right there, in a concise and well-written sentence is the biggest reason to do away with the rule.

 

The TCA is not going to attract any new blood with this kind of old-fashioned, "grumpy old men" attitude. If you are satisfied to remain in the 1960's while the rest of the world passes you by, that's a big problem for the future. It almost seems that some of you don't WANT any new blood in the TCA.

 

Whether you like it or not, people today use their cell phones for everything, phone calls, email, texting, sharing videos and pictures, keeping their schedule, maintaining their modeling want lists...you name it.

 

People today also work differently than they did 50 years ago. The new work habits in place now are closely tied to the cell phone. People today expect immediacy in their communications and if they don't get it, they move on to the next contact on their list who can give them what they want. From a personal point of view I don't particularly like that, but it is what it is. As an example, if one of my corporate flight clients calls me while I'm in a hall at York, I am going to answer the phone! That call is BUSINESS for me, and puts food on my table. I'm not going to let some paranoid and silly rule like this get in the way of legitimately making a living.

 

It may be a dead horse to some of you, but there is a reason why this subject comes up on a regular basis. It is because the rule is outdated and silly in the context of today's world. You cannot hide your head in the sand and pretend that the world has not changed. Lou Palumbo's column in CTT is an indication that the dis-satisfaction with this rule goes far beyond this forum, and I support his views 100%.

My take:

A lot of cell phone users I've been behind cannot walk and talk at the same time (a real pain in a crowded aisle).

 

I'm sure the world will survive when I leave my cell phone in the car...but then, I'm not as important as some of you.

Come on folks, is this forum about trains or is it about cellphones? 

LOL!

Thanks, guys, you all have brought a chuckle to my day.

Yup, York must be getting close!

I am a gen-X'er and I agree with Rich and Alan.  For my generation (and moreso the Gen-Y's behind me) cellphones and social networking are the normal everyday way of living and communicating.  They are not specialty tools and we do not leave them at home or in the car. 

 

Its like asking someone not to bring their wallet with drivers license, credit cards, cash etc into the show.  We are moving to a point where our cellphone (with builtin camera) will soon render my leather wallet unnecessary.

I'm such a bad boy, stirring up all this fuss!  

What's a cell phone?

100% agree with you Rich. I am 39 and while I'm young compared to the average person here, not so young. These antiquated rules are a very large part of why I never bothered to join the TCA. I prefer the LCCA personally.

 

IF the TCA wants to continue as an organization in the future they will have to change IMHO. My 6 yr old uses my iPhone, iPad, computer, Netflix, Blu-Ray, etc... These kids are growing up with this technology as an integral part of their lives. Our schools use tablets as learning devices and most teens have cell phones at school with them. You talk about taking candy from a baby.... just try to get those kids to attend a show like this with the current rules. Not going to happen. Ok, so many will say "York isn't for kids" That mentality certainly kept me from taking my son a few years ago with the stroller issue. But who do you think is the future of this hobby? They are the next generation of hobbyists.

 

Or is the average TCA member just a self-centered older person that only cares about completing their "collection" before they die?

 

I'm not accusing.... just asking a valid question that has been posed to me by fellow modelers as well as non-modelers alike.

If you are a serious Train operator or collector and live in Ohio, and don't join TCA and go to York because you can't use your cell phone inside the building's, you are missing out on a great experience. Your loss.

Pointless discussion. 

 

All these threats of another "forward thinking" entity establishing a meet like this never seem to happen.  There's been quite a while for someone to take this opportunity since people have been whining about the cell phone rule for at least 10 years (maybe longer) now.

 

I don't see a thread on the TCA forum about how silly the avatar rule here on OGR is.  (it truly is silly, though I will of course abide by it while here)

 

Same principle.  You play in someone else's sandbox, you play buy their rules.  Or you build your own sandbox with your rules and invite people and see how many show up.

 

-Dave

I have a different view...

 

My reasons for not joining are not solely limited to the cell phone rule. All of the rules helped form my decision. I won't get into it here. I will say that I feel that it is the TCA's loss, not mine. I spend thousands of dollars every year on model railroading. I have for over 15 years now. I've been in model railroading since I was a child. I'm pretty sure that the vendors at York would welcome my revenue stream. Since I didn't feel welcomed by the TCA, they are the ones missing out. Not me. I still manage to find what I want and remain happy in the hobby without the TCA.

 

I support the TCA's right to define it's own rules. Just don't be surprised when membership starts to dwindle over time. I don't need the TCA to be a modeler, but the TCA needs modelers to remain in existence. Ask yourself whom in that equation should be the party most interested in being flexible?

Spot on Martin H & JonnySpeed!

 

Yet, another generational type issue with the York train meet. Most people I know use FourSquare and Facebook check-in’s, this would promote the hobby to all their contacts and could (should) be used by the larger manufactures to promote their brands – ie, “Jason Checked In at the OGR booth at York,” which then has a link to the publications web site and just exposed the fact that I am at York – again with a link to their web site – and OGR Magazine to the more or less 500 people I’m connected with via Facebook multiplied by the 10K plus folks at York who are connected and 5 million connections are made. Why would any business, club, or event not want to promote itself far and wide to possible customers, members, etc.?

 

Last year there were over 250 million photos uploaded to Facebook a day! Many of which are tagged, indexed, and searchable – again giving younger people looking on the web for trains a means by which to find, publications, dealers, clubs, and events. Why other than “just because” would the TCA, York, the dealers & manufactures, publishers, & clubs, not want to use the most powerful media tools currently in existence to market themselves and the hobby?

 

Tens of millions of smart phones are being used this very second all around the world, to talk, e-mail, text, IM, Tweet, update Facebook, access the internet, and in commerce – buying, selling, and banking.

 

People of a certain age have connected most of their lives to their smartphones, mine tracks my marathon training runs, monitors my expense reports (through a quick photo/scan of a receipt), contains my personal and work calendars, is connected to my bank and brokerage accounts, is linked to both personal and business e-mail accounts, not to mention Facebook & other social media, and even to this forum – I’m writing this from my phone now.  Asking me to leave my cell phone at home is about as practical as asking that I leave my life outside while I enter train la-la land. Sure is going to hard to run the trains at the MTH Booth via my cell phone, as Mike promised at last year’s York, with it out in the car or at home – heck I use it for GPS I would not even be able to find York if it were left at home.

 

Rich Melvin – How about a big QR Code at the OGR booth with a free subscription give away, scan the code to sign up? You clearly get it, and your publication has done a wonderful job on going electronic and offering electronic solutions to meet the expectations of those under 60.

 

Good luck with this one, I too am shocked to see Alan posting this.

Jason

If I receive a call while in one of the halls I will answer it and tell the caller to hold on a minute until I walk outside to talk to the person. I do use my smartphone in the halls to check my "Want to Buy" list, and inventory list of what I already have.

We should all get back to talking about something important. Like......SCRAPPLE.

Honestly, every time I have read a thread that has information in it about the TCA in the past 3 years or so...... I have read the posts and one of  the remarks Rich stated is exactly the impression I received.

"It almost seems that some of you don't WANT any new blood in the TCA."

Larry