Lionel Shipping Shows......... DEC.2023
Charles RO Shows................. JULY 2023
Any Comments / DAVE (Lionel)
FREDSTRAINS
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It'll be here, when it gets here, and not a minute sooner.
@Fredstrains posted:Lionel Shipping Shows......... DEC.2023
Charles RO Shows................. JULY 2023
Any Comments / DAVE (Lionel)
FREDSTRAINS
What comments could anyone possibly have to reconcile those two dates, and worse yet, with what we know happens so very frequently (constant push outs)?
Rick was being very diplomatic in his. Most other folks just throw up their hands and shake their heads.
Mike
Dave Olson has already stated here that the current ETA is 4th quarter 2023. We—and Lionel—can only hope that happens. Charles Ro’s July ETA is for the start of swimming season in Boston.
In other words, it's a long ways off! 
I can wait, I have 2 990's and a 993 stocked up before the inflation hit.
@Shawn_Chronister posted:I can wait, I have 2 990's and a 993 stocked up before the inflation hit.
I stockpiled and then sold my extra 993 expansion sets on eBay last year. Started the auctions at $1 and watched frenzy ensue for 10 days. Easily paid for a BASE-3 and plenty of other purchases.
Does anyone know if you can hook up two 990s together? I know you can hook up a 990 and a 993 but can you have two 990s hooked up? I’m curious because I found a 990 for sale at the normal price and not $1000 or more and I’m thinking about getting it if I can run it with my existing 990.
@LionelLegend posted:Does anyone know if you can hook up two 990s together? I know you can hook up a 990 and a 993 but can you have two 990s hooked up? I’m curious because I found a 990 for sale at the normal price and not $1000 or more and I’m thinking about getting it if I can run it with my existing 990.
No, you cannot have 2 990s (Legacy bases) connected together- nor would you want to.
You can use the CAB2 remote (example multiple CAB2 remotes talking to one single Legacy base), and you can setup 2 entirely different layouts on totally different channel IDs for the remote to base coms, but no, putting 2 990s (Legacy bases) and wiring them up- either serial connection or worse radio "U" wire is a conflict.
Again, you can use the CAB2 from the set- but even just using the base as a charging station, you would have to change the channel to not conflict with your existing base- and you would not "wire it" except for power.
@Vernon Barry posted:No, you cannot have 2 990s (Legacy bases) connected together- nor would you want to.
You can use the CAB2 remote (example multiple CAB2 remotes talking to one single Legacy base), and you can setup 2 entirely different layouts on totally different channel IDs for the remote to base coms, but no, putting 2 990s (Legacy bases) and wiring them up- either serial connection or worse radio "U" wire is a conflict.
Again, you can use the CAB2 from the set- but even just using the base as a charging station, you would have to change the channel to not conflict with your existing base- and you would not "wire it" except for power.
So just making sure I’m understanding I can take the CAB2 remote from the new 990 set and put it to the same channel as my existing 990 set. But keep the new 990 base in the box and not use it unless I’m using it on a different layout?
And in that case why would you ever want to get a 993 set and not just get another 990 set?
@LionelLegend posted:And in that case why would you ever want to get a 993 set and not just get another 990 set?
Multiple handhelds can be used to run multiple trains at once with just 1 base, i.e. in a club setting.
On a side note. This also allows club members the ability to bring their own handheld from home. In which case it will display the locomotives stored in the club base.
The 993 is to add an additional handheld when you already have the 990 base. You only need1 base and when the 990 and 993 where still being manufactured, the 993 was less expensive. It's the same handheld with a charging base that has no means to hookup to a layout and control the trains.
@LionelLegend posted:So just making sure I’m understanding I can take the CAB2 remote from the new 990 set and put it to the same channel as my existing 990 set. But keep the new 990 base in the box and not use it unless I’m using it on a different layout?
Yes and yes.
Also is it possible to transfer all the train info from one 990 base to another 990 base so I wouldn’t have to reprogram every train?
@LionelLegend posted:Also is it possible to transfer all the train info from one 990 base to another 990 base so I wouldn’t have to reprogram every train?
Yes, using the Legacy System Utility https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VNljIytqLuQ
Now the date is Mar/2024. One of my definitions for software releases. It may apply to other things also.
- Release dates
- 1Q, First Quarter , April 1, April Fools!
- 2Q, Second Quarter, July 1, See 3Q
- 3Q, Third Quarter, Oct 1, See 4Q
- 4Q, Fourth Quarter, next year sometime
- Coming Soon, See April 1..,
I love how Ryan didn’t mentioned the CAB 3 in the update yesterday. I am betting it’s not even close to release. I feel bad for the people getting into the hobby buying premium trains without a premium control system.
I want the Base3 here as much as anyone. However, I am willing to wait as long as it takes to make it right. I suspect that the reason it is not on schedule is that they find glitches that need to be addressed.
I say to Lionel, take your time and get it right!
Peter
Ryan Kunkle told me at the LCCA convention last July that the Base 3 had all kinks worked out and was waiting for final FCC approval and would be shipped late December.
@Dave 69 GTEL posted:Ryan Kunkle told me at the LCCA convention last July that the Base 3 had all kinks worked out and was waiting for final FCC approval and would be shipped late December.
Well Dave just said the other day that they have passed FCC testing, the factory is building prototypes now and to expect them in late February.
That means March or April ! O well as long as my CAB2 keeps working!!!
"I feel bad for the people getting into the hobby buying premium trains without a premium control system. "
I do not believe this is an accurate description of what is currently possible and what will be possible after the delivery of the Base 3. The Base 3 adds no new functions, pretty much, but consolidates previous command systems from Lionel. It is directed at those who have multiple different Lionel systems, not the new hobbyist who only has recent Lionel locos.
There are worse tragedies than having to use the app or the Universal Remote for current purchases. That's what one is going to use both now and after the Base 3 arrives, if you don't already have a cab-2 remote (no longer made) or a cab-1L, or purchase the latter. Thus those getting into the hobby are going to be no closer to a premium control system after the Base 3 arrives than they are now. The premium control system Lionel is offering is the app, which requires no other equipment than your smart device, is free and controls everything any new Lionel loco can do. You need another system if you have older TMCC and Legacy locos that don't have Bluetooth. You don't need the Base 3 if you are happy using your smartphone or tablet and the app for the newer locos. Those have been available for some time.
The Base 3, however, makes it possible to control LionChief locos along with TMCC/Legacy locos with one device, which you cannot do now, except for Bluetooth equipped locos. It's evolution, not revolution.
The current apps are not what I would call a premium control system seeing they can’t maximize the features of the new engines.
The cab2 remote was a nice piece of hardware but I’m not one for killing Lionel because they switched to a dedicated app in place of a shiny new remote.
At this point , the base 3 will be here when it gets here…
Please, don't forget that Lionel is fixing the 990 or 993 for free with free shipping. They fixed mine twice (Broken LCD screen and corrosion).
Have a great Sunday!
Best,
" they can’t maximize the features of the new engines."
What features of the new engines aren't addressed by the current app?
@Arcadebrothers posted:The current apps are not what I would call a premium control system seeing they can’t maximize the features of the new engines.
As far as we can tell every feature on every locomotive, and all other rolling stock and accessories, is accessible and functions correctly from the app (as well, of course, as with a no-longer-available Cab-2/Base-2.)
What features are missing?
Mike
Which? I might be missing something…. I just have the Bluetooth Lionelchief app…
I’m waiting on the new TIU. Bought my first DCS engine. It gets here when it gets here.
I recently sold my 990 set and am currently not operating very often. What will I need NOW if I want to be able to operate older Legacy and TMCC locomotives please? I have no Lionchiel units and no intention of getting any. Was at a friend's home and large layout the other day and his MTH setup was able to run my Legacy Mikado just fine with his handheld.
He had at least the old TMCC BASE1 command base connected to his TIU in order to do that.
@Mellow Hudson Mike posted:As far as we can tell every feature on every locomotive, and all other rolling stock and accessories, is accessible and functions correctly from the app (as well, of course, as with a no-longer-available Cab-2/Base-2.)
What features are missing?
Mike
AFAIK you can’t do MUs (lash-ups) with the LC app that is out there now. I don’t even think the app supports things like the set railroad speeds or momentum. Also, there’s no train brake nor brake/boost functions.
@rplst8 posted:AFAIK you can’t do MUs (lash-ups) with the LC app that is out there now. I don’t even think the app supports things like the set railroad speeds or momentum. Also, there’s no train brake nor brake/boost functions.
They should have done the cab 3 as an upgraded cab 2 with an updated hand held unit and backwards compatible with cab 2 and cab 1 handhelds. I agree the LC app is simplistic and not as comprehensive.
Trainworld says end of March 2024. I'll be getting the new Base 3 for the layout I'm building.
I have one on order from Charles RO but I wonder if I assign 4 digit addressing with the LC app will the CAB 2 be able to control the locomotive? I wonder if I will be wasting my money with this thing.
@Dave 69 GTEL posted:I have one on order from Charles RO but I wonder if I assign 4 digit addressing with the LC app will the CAB 2 be able to control the locomotive? I wonder if I will be wasting my money with this thing.
There's nothing to say you have to use 4-digit addressing for the ID. Also, you can key in cab numbers to the CAB2 and address it that way. 4-digit addressing doesn't change the ability of running those locomotives like you always did with the Legacy system and the CAB2.
@Dave 69 GTEL posted:They should have done the cab 3 as an upgraded cab 2 with an updated hand held unit and backwards compatible with cab 2 and cab 1 handhelds. I agree the LC app is simplistic and not as comprehensive.
If they would just release the CAB3 app, I'll bet that would placate 90% of users, including me. I can wait on the Base3. I want to get Legacy stuff, but I can only use basic features (whistle/horn and bell) via the LionChief app. I don't want to buy a fancy expensive engine and then have it basically be a LionChief 2.0 engine until such time that Lionel sees fit to release a way to control advanced features (and it keeps getting pushed back and back and back with seemingly no end in sight). That is what is frustrating so many folks like me IMHO.
@James Brown posted:If they would just release the CAB3 app, I'll bet that would placate 90% of users, including me. I can wait on the Base3. I want to get Legacy stuff, but I can only use basic features (whistle/horn and bell) via the LionChief app. I don't want to buy a fancy expensive engine and then have it basically be a LionChief 2.0 engine until such time that Lionel sees fit to release a way to control advanced features (and it keeps getting pushed back and back and back with seemingly no end in sight). That is what is frustrating so many folks like me IMHO.
I like where you are going, but I'm afraid that there is some technical detail missed.
Let's play pretend for a second. Let's say they released CAB3 app today.
If you have an existing LCS wifi and matching Legacy 990 base, then in theory, yes, the app gives you equivalent CAB2 Legacy features.
If you don't have a Legacy 990 base, don't have LCS WIFI module and cabling, or say have a lesser base (Base1L or original TMCC Base) I think you might be stuck with bluetooth.
I have no reason to believe, that over Bluetooth- direct to the engine, CAB3 unlocks more features than current Lionchief app. Maybe it does, but that would imply all this time, the Bluetooth interface had features that just were not accessible because of app limitations.
So what I'm saying, is, sadly, I don't see releasing the app as the magic bullet you are implying. For me as an existing legacy owner and our club also both having LCS- it's a nice and welcome app update to tired and outdated iCab.
@James Brown posted:If they would just release the CAB3 app, I'll bet that would placate 90% of users, including me. I can wait on the Base3. I want to get Legacy stuff, but I can only use basic features (whistle/horn and bell) via the LionChief app. I don't want to buy a fancy expensive engine and then have it basically be a LionChief 2.0 engine until such time that Lionel sees fit to release a way to control advanced features (and it keeps getting pushed back and back and back with seemingly no end in sight). That is what is frustrating so many folks like me IMHO.
AFAIK, the Cab3 app has two modes of operation. Cab3B (Bluetooth) and Cab3L (Legacy via WiFi). Cab3L mode requires the Base3 (or the 990 Base and WiFi LCS module) to work. In Cab3B mode, it looks pretty much like the LionChief app with a similar feature set.
It was indicated that the CAB3b side of the app will be able to control up to three engines at a time vs. one at a time in the Lionchief app.
@H1000 posted:It was indicated that the CAB3b side of the app will be able to control up to three engines at a time vs. one at a time in the Lionchief app.
Which just matches what the orange universal remote can do. Yes, an improvement over the existing LC app.
That said, I also begin to wonder- just like the voice streaming conversation- what about 3rd party chipset for the Bluetooth?
I'm sorry, but Lionel failed and is miserably failing to warn users and dealers alike, that advertising voice streaming functionality, without stating explicitly the requirements of a specific chipset, and possibly specific operating system on the 3rd party device, for the function to work 100% as intended. https://ogrforum.com/...2#172611907079938312
Again, where is the flyer or email with compatibility requirements- that probably should be on the box or in documentation- that went to dealers so they can answer that when an angry customer comes in saying I bought this new BT5.0 engine for voice streaming, and it doesn't work with my phone?
Again, are there scenarios where this new 3 engine over Bluetooth control mode (and remember, direct from phone cannot do the older Lionchief RF only- not without a universal remote in bridge mode) requires a specific chipset or OS in your 3rd party phone device and is known by Lionel not to work in certain 3rd party devices or situations?
Good question for the Legacy user's group.
I think the voice command feature is nothing more than a voice recognition routine within the LC app which takes voice patterns and matches them to LC commands and transmits them to the bluetooth equipped locomotive. Bluetooth only allows for connection to one device at a time so multiple locomotive control would have to happen through WIFI. CAB 3 will have WIFI built in. I'm not familiar with LCS WIFI. But from a discussion I had with a sales associate at the Lionel Store in Concord there is something, I can't remember what, that is better about the WIFI coming out in the CAB 3 than the LCS version.
