MTH 50-1038 - DCS Remote Control

I received mine last week.  The package still has the old 50-1002 part number.  The remote is indeed marked 50-1038.  That’s the only difference that I see.

Did you check out the German manual on the product page?  MTH 50-1038 DCS Remote Control.  It's pretty amusing, it's a bad cut-n-paste of poor pictures from the English manual and some German descriptions tossed in.

I guess this is auf Wiedersehen for MTH 

just got word from my local tech raymond Manley at rays electric trains that mine have come in. he loaded the latest software version on to the two remotes I purchased and are on my way to house via mail right now. If they check out ok with ray I suspect they are going to be good. how they hold up long term is anyone's guess.

a quick question for those who would know. since the remotes are in and shipping out are the thumb wheel parts in also for the techs? I forgot to ask ray that one. he stated that he was getting more from mth in this next and last run when I ordered them from him. 

Near as I can tell from my parts shipments from MTH, you'll be lucky to get any parts.  They did state that the thumbwheels would not be available again, I can only assume they actually meant it.

Since MTH is closing its doors and auctioning off everything it owns, I assume they are also going to quit supplying spare parts. 

When it was first announced, they stated that there would be continued availability of at least the electronic parts.  However, since I'm having trouble getting boards for repairs NOW, I don't put a lot of faith in that statement.

Thanks john, thats how it goes. Bummer😠

I just checked the one I received and it does indeed package says 50-1002, but on the back of the remote it does list 50-1038.

I recall hearing Andy E. say it had a newer processor that was compatible, wonder if there is any speed performance increases?   One can hope for a slight increase.

Jim

I just received a call from Jeff McCormick at McCormick's Hardware that mine is in.  I'm going to drive down to Zelienople, Pennsylvania early next week and pick it up.  

Zelienople, now there's a town name that will twist your tongue!

I haven't taken one apart yet to note the chip change.

@gunrunnerjohn posted:

Zelienople, now there's a town name that will twist your tongue!

John, I have to go through Connoquenessing to get there.  

I suppose that's not as bad as Peculiar, MO.   I used to drive down from Kansas City to Joplin for a consulting customer.  It was easier to fly into KC and drive down than find a closer airport and deal with connecting flights.  You passed right by Peculiar on the way, I finally had to stop and see how they got that name.   It is certainly... peculiar!

How Peculiar, MO Got Its Name

John, That one does take the cake for being peculiar.  

@Lionelzwl2012 posted:

just got word from my local tech raymond Manley at rays electric trains that mine have come in. he loaded the latest software version on to the two remotes I purchased and are on my way to house via mail right now. If they check out ok with ray I suspect they are going to be good. how they hold up long term is anyone's guess.

a quick question for those who would know. since the remotes are in and shipping out are the thumb wheel parts in also for the techs? I forgot to ask ray that one. he stated that he was getting more from mth in this next and last run when I ordered them from him. 

Hi there, just wanted to share that I do now see the bottom back of the remotes and they do have the 50-1038 (despite the packages showing 50-1002).  Also to just to note, the remotes did already have 6.10 loaded in them, I just confirmed they did in this case.  (In addition to fully testing, I always check/update the version load on TIUs, Remotes, WIUs, etc before shipping and make notes in the official email for later reference if a question comes up later (years down the road) if we need to update them or not.) 

Now that the new remotes are in, I haven't attempted to order additional complete thumb-wheel assemblies. But like what was already stated here in a later post, I do remember receiving the notification from MTH that they would no longer sell the complete assembly as a part.  Based on that I figured it would still be the case and that I wouldn't be able to obtain additional stock even now.

Ray

Ray's Electric Trainworks

Mark: Only us folks from the Burgh understand some the names in PA.

Thank you for that information, Ray!  I'm looking forward to getting my spare remote from Jeff, who I mentioned above, this week.

thanks ray, I completely forgot to ask you. this is good to know. 

My LHS has the thumbwheel and cradle

but

it seems the real issue is the reader that the Thumbwheel connects to. 

Imagine if the designers had not tried to make the thumbwheel an “all around cowboy” and let us just be a scrolling-speed adjusting wheel-and put a select push button on the side of the remote. 

Perhaps they wouldn’t have been such a pain in the caboose. 

I was fortunate that shortly after I got my DCS, I heard of the troubles with the thumbwheel and I bought one complete assembly for future use. 
If only I could have gotten the reader also😁

My LHS still had 5 remotes when I bought mine, last week. 

Since I lucked into a second DCS TIU System-I’m considering buying another remote, to keep as a backup, so I’ll have one for each system. 

I do like the WI-FI smart device app

but, there’s something about using the actual remote that is as pleasing as it is familiar. 

If anyone wants to get a remote while they’re in stock, I’d be happy to pick it up and ship it-for a donation to my favorite train fund😁

@Mark Boyce posted:

John, I have to go through Connoquenessing to get there.  

Just be glad you don’t have to say or spell Schuylkill five times fast!

@rplst8 posted:

Just be glad you don’t have to say or spell Schuylkill five times fast!

Yes that is one that you wouldn’t expect to spell that way.  😄  I only have to worry about Allegheny, Monongahela, and Youghoigheny!  

@rplst8 posted:

Just be glad you don’t have to say or spell Schuylkill five times fast!

Schuylkill is easier to say (skoo-kil) than it is to spell.  Just be glad you don’t have to drive on the Schuylkill Expressway every day for 37 years like I did.  Schuylkill is Dutch for hidden river by the way.

While we are at it, I think my all time favorite is Moyamensing (Lenape for place of pigeon droppings).

Guys, let me offer some facts to try and clear up any misunderstandings and shed some light on this matter.

• The 50-1038 (new) DCS remote is essentially identical to the previous remote with the exception of the thumbwheel assembly.  The original encoder (electronic device that tracks rotation)  is obsolete and so, a new encoder had to be identified and used.  The plastic "cradle" the thumbwheel sits in had to be modified to accommodate a physically different encoder.  
• The new encoder assembly is universally compatible with all remotes from day one.
• We brought in about 300 pcs of the thumbwheel assembly with the last batch of remotes and they are all sold out.
• We are making one last final production run of the DCS Remote (50-1038) and along with it, 1K thumbwheel assemblies to support repairs for years to come.
• Along with the revisions to accommodate the new encoder, we beefed up the cradle in the areas where they wear out and break to extend the life significantly.
• Because of the new encoder, the wires must be reversed where they solder on the main remote PCB.  There is a notice in the thumbwheel assembly package explaining this.  Don't worry, if you solder the wires in the original position, the only problem is the screen will move in the opposite direction and you can easily fix it.  

I hope this helps.

MTH RD, Thank you very much for this information!  IT is greatly appreciated!!

Dave, thanks for that news.  Question, what will be the place to order those 1000 upgraded assemblies from "for years to come", since MTH is due to pass away?  What is part number & current price of the revised thumbwheel assembly?  Regards, Bob

I went to Henning’s the other day to get a replacement power cord for one of my ZWs.  I was surprised there were none in stock.  I was also surprised to see some 50-1038 remotes in the display case.  I already have two remotes and I wasn’t really planning on getting another, but as Mike Wolfe (not misspelled) says, “The time to buy something is when you see it.”

@MTH RD posted:

Guys, let me offer some facts to try and clear up any misunderstandings and shed some light on this matter.

• The 50-1038 (new) DCS remote is essentially identical to the previous remote with the exception of the thumbwheel assembly.  The original encoder (electronic device that tracks rotation)  is obsolete and so, a new encoder had to be identified and used.  The plastic "cradle" the thumbwheel sits in had to be modified to accommodate a physically different encoder.  
• The new encoder assembly is universally compatible with all remotes from day one.
• We brought in about 300 pcs of the thumbwheel assembly with the last batch of remotes and they are all sold out.
• We are making one last final production run of the DCS Remote (50-1038) and along with it, 1K thumbwheel assemblies to support repairs for years to come.
• Along with the revisions to accommodate the new encoder, we beefed up the cradle in the areas where they wear out and break to extend the life significantly.
• Because of the new encoder, the wires must be reversed where they solder on the main remote PCB.  There is a notice in the thumbwheel assembly package explaining this.  Don't worry, if you solder the wires in the original position, the only problem is the screen will move in the opposite direction and you can easily fix it.  

 

I hope this helps.

Thanks for the detailed information.

If 300 pieces of thumbwheel assembly sold out so fast, why is there confidence 1000 will last more than 3 times as long ?

So if I bought a few of the cradles that were still available about a week and a half ago (this was a day or 2 after the full assemblies sold out, I believe), are they matches to the old thumbwheel/cradle design, or the new beefed up design (and therefore not compatible with the old thumbwheel, if I understood the post correctly?)?

I just picked up the new remote, and it has worked well so far.  I did not yet feel motivated to disassemble it to compare to the older ones I have  

So I will take your word for it regarding the upgrades (for now..... ).  But I will likely try to buy a couple of the assemblies if/when they become available, especially if the cradles I bought won't fit my old remotes with the old wheels.

-Dave

@MTH RD posted:

Guys, let me offer some facts to try and clear up any misunderstandings and shed some light on this matter.

• The 50-1038 (new) DCS remote is essentially identical to the previous remote with the exception of the thumbwheel assembly.  The original encoder (electronic device that tracks rotation)  is obsolete and so, a new encoder had to be identified and used.  The plastic "cradle" the thumbwheel sits in had to be modified to accommodate a physically different encoder.  
• The new encoder assembly is universally compatible with all remotes from day one.
• We brought in about 300 pcs of the thumbwheel assembly with the last batch of remotes and they are all sold out.
• We are making one last final production run of the DCS Remote (50-1038) and along with it, 1K thumbwheel assemblies to support repairs for years to come.
• Along with the revisions to accommodate the new encoder, we beefed up the cradle in the areas where they wear out and break to extend the life significantly.
• Because of the new encoder, the wires must be reversed where they solder on the main remote PCB.  There is a notice in the thumbwheel assembly package explaining this.  Don't worry, if you solder the wires in the original position, the only problem is the screen will move in the opposite direction and you can easily fix it.  

 

I hope this helps.

Perhaps we can clear up exactly what fits where.

Will the new thumbwheel assembly with the new cradle fit old remotes? 

Will the new cradle assembly fit old thumbwheels or do we replace the whole thumbwheel?

Is it possible to get replacement displays for the remotes?

Let me try to respond to all four posts since my original here.

Mark - You are very welcome.

RJR - There will be an MTH parts company run by a couple of existing employees.  That will all be announced in due time.  As far as item number and price, I guess wait and contact them about it.

Lehigh74 - Mike's last name is Wolf without the "e".  

Dave45681 - The last batch of 300 thumbwheel assemblies were long overdue.  There was pent up demand that is now largely satisfied.  Also, the MTH closure announcement is contributing to some panic buying.  If purchased at the rate of failure, the next 1K pcs should last for years.  And, if not, the new parts company can always make more.  Also, the last couple batches of remotes already include the improved cradle so, much less likely to wear out as quickly.  The old cradles are not compatible with the new encoder or thumbwheel but, of course, can be used to repair the original 50-1002 remotes.

I think you just answered all my questions except for the spare displays.

@gunrunnerjohn posted:

Perhaps we can clear up exactly what fits where.

Will the new thumbwheel assembly with the new cradle fit old remotes? 

Will the new cradle assembly fit old thumbwheels or do we replace the whole thumbwheel?

Is it possible to get replacement displays for the remotes?

Yes, the new thumbwheel assembly will drop into the old or new remotes.  Again, the position of the three wires from the encoder differ and this is described in a document included with the new assemblies.

We will only sell thumbwheel assemblies which include the cradle, thumbwheel, encoder, PCB, and wires.  The thumbwheel itself was modified to accommodate the new encoder part so, it is slightly different internally from the original.

Replacement displays are tough because of a high MOQ (min order qty).  Also, it takes someone with considerable soldering skills to do the replacement.  So, in other words, no.  

Is the new encoder still contact based or is it optical?

Thank you, MTHRD

@gunrunnerjohn posted:

Is the new encoder still contact based or is it optical?

It's still mechanical contacts with the detents.  Optical would be the way to go if a new remote were to be designed.

Bummer, I was hoping you couldn't get the mechanical ones and had to go optical.

@MTH RD posted:

Let me try to respond to all four posts since my original here.

...............................  

Dave45681 - The last batch of 300 thumbwheel assemblies were long overdue.  There was pent up demand that is now largely satisfied.  Also, the MTH closure announcement is contributing to some panic buying.  If purchased at the rate of failure, the next 1K pcs should last for years.  And, if not, the new parts company can always make more.  Also, the last couple batches of remotes already include the improved cradle so, much less likely to wear out as quickly.  The old cradles are not compatible with the new encoder or thumbwheel but, of course, can be used to repair the original 50-1002 remotes.

 

Thank you for the reply.  I'm feeling better that I bought cradles that will fit at least two (or if I'm lucky all four) of my 50-1002 remotes. 

Two were from original Remote/TIU sets,  one from the very first run in  April 2002, another set I picked up in late 2005.  I'll assume both of those are definitely the old design.

 I bought a few stand alone remotes in recent years (one in late 2017, one in late 2018) after the announcement that all future new product focus would be on the app. 

So it sounds like "maybe" my later remotes may have the newer cradle, if they were within that "last couple batches" (I understand the backed up demand for remotes has been a while, probably at least the last year or so while people awaited the new 50-1038, so could those "last couple batches" of 50-1002 have covered that time-frame?). 

I'm OK with that, but I might pop a newer one and an older one open to see if there are obvious design differences on the brackets now, just so I know what's in them for potential future repair needs.

-Dave

@MTH RD posted:

 

Lehigh74 - Mike's last name is Wolf without the "e".  

Yes.  I know Mike Wolf owns MTH.  But I was referring to Mike Wolfe from the TV show American Pickers who frequently says “The time to buy something is when you see it.”

@Dave45681 posted:

Thank you for the reply.  I'm feeling better that I bought cradles that will fit at least two (or if I'm lucky all four) of my 50-1002 remotes. 

Two were from original Remote/TIU sets,  one from the very first run in  April 2002, another set I picked up in late 2005.  I'll assume both of those are definitely the old design.

 I bought a few stand alone remotes in recent years (one in late 2017, one in late 2018) after the announcement that all future new product focus would be on the app. 

So it sounds like "maybe" my later remotes may have the newer cradle, if they were within that "last couple batches" (I understand the backed up demand for remotes has been a while, probably at least the last year or so while people awaited the new 50-1038, so could those "last couple batches" of 50-1002 have covered that time-frame?). 

I'm OK with that, but I might pop a newer one and an older one open to see if there are obvious design differences on the brackets now, just so I know what's in them for potential future repair needs.

-Dave

No problem.  You're welcome.  

Given the dates of your remotes, I am certain they are all the original design.  That's fine.  If you ever wear out your thumbwheel "spring" (bracket) the new complete thumbwheel assembly will just drop right in.  The idea is that the assemblies are universal but, parts within the assembly are not.

The last couple batches literally means the ones that recently hit the dealers and the new batch that isn't built yet.  Essentially, all remotes shipped prior to 2020 are of the original design.

So, save your time and broken fingernail opening the remotes.  ;-)