MTH Remote Commander or DCS?

If you're happy with the DCS Remote Commander, stick with it.

The advantage of the full DCS is you get more control of the locomotives, and you can expand to control switches and accessories from the remote.  You can also run multiple locomotives on the same track or on different tracks, all from one remote. 

I'm surprised that the DCS Remote Commander will provide a usable signal to multiple loops and sidings, do you ever have issues with losing signal?

"do you ever have issues with losing signal?"

No. In my case I sit in front of the Z-4000 but use the Remote Commander (which plugs into the Z-4000) to operate the layout. The reason I do this is so that if I have a derailment or other problem I can walk to the location of the problem fix it and still have control of the Z-4000.

All the Switches and Uncouplers are electric with the controls on a board above my head. The power to the sidings is also controlled by switches above my head. Even devices like the Coaling Station and Water Tower are controlled by switches above my head.

The only problem I have is the Remote Commander, as with the TIU, turns itself off so occasionally I panic until I realize I need to hit a button to reactivate the remote control.

At times I need to move a train to a track with another train but I can usually stay in control by sequencing the directions so that one Loco is a neutral while the other one is moving.

To add to Johns points:

With the Full remote you can call up any of the sounds in an engine at will.

Including some that are never heard otherwise.

DCSRC cannot do that.

Also, Full DCS has far more volume options, you can set Bell, Whistle, Chuffing and Accent sounds at different levels from each other. All will change and keep the relative offset with the master Vol UP and Down buttons.

I keep Whistle Maxed and Set others at 50 to 75%.

Are you talking about the new DCS Remote Commander http://www.mthtrains.com/content/50-1033

or the older DCS Commander http://www.mthtrains.com/news/068

or the older Z4000 Remote Commander http://www.mthtrains.com/content/40-4001

The old Z-4000 Remote Commander. It is pretty much just a simple remote control of the Z-4000 with the Z-4000 functions.

I did not know there were others.

Just about everything on the layout is 15 years old (built when I retired).

http://www.mthtrains.com/content/40-4001

The "Remote Commander" naming conventions are pretty confusing; I was scanning the

thread and I thought that you were referring to the "DCS" Remote Commander, which

is true Command Control - a subset of full DCS. This will do you no good on PS-1,

which was never a CC system - PS-1 is a reversing unit with sound.

I have the DCS Remote Commander; OK in general, and for the money ($50) it

is a steal if you have PS2/3 (at Factory Defaults). But I still use TMCC mostly -

PS-1 locos often make really nice candidates for TMCC upgrades. 

Jerry-RR,

   I like the looks of your layout and if I were you I would invest in the full DCS and purchase a side receiver for the Z4K also.  Set up your switches via the AIU for remote switching also, with this package you control everything from the DCS hand held remote control, if you like to build, you will love expanding your layout, you might even want to add an old ZW, just to power your switches and operating tracks.  Lots of real cool remote control stuff, and the ability to run multipule trains on the same tracks, even conventionals. Invest in Barry's DCS O guage Companion book and the OGR Video Guide to DCS, Rich did a great job with it also.  For me the full DCS package was they only way to go, next because I run on FasTrack the Command Control FT switches will be added, ordered a WYE 072 CC switch today, if my old Tin Plate will run thru the switches correctly, CC FasTrack switches will be added to the new Christmas layout for the coming year.  All kinds of great stuff to engineer & build with, man I only dreamed of this kind of stuff as a boy, now it really exists.

PCRR/Dave 

But not multiple PS1 locos on the same track with DCS right?  They have to be PS2 or better?

But not multiple PS1 locos on the same track with DCS right?  They have to be PS2 or better?

Actually, using DCS you can run conventional and PS2 and PS3 engines on the same track, at the same time.

Personally, I prefer the DCS Commander or "button box" to control my P-2 and P-3 locos. I also use a Z-4000 and a Z-1000 to control both my Lionel and MTH trains.

Couldn't agree more. 

You can even run PS/2, PS/3, and TMCC/Legacy on the same track at the same time if you add a TMCC or Legacy command base to the configuration.

I would invest in the full DCS and purchase a side receiver for the Z4K also.

I have a TIU and DCS Remote but don't remember why I stopped using it in favor of the plain Remote Commander.

There are a dozen or so PS1 locos and only 3 or 4 PS2 locos (no PS3) with no plans for future purchases (no space for anything else).

I could not find what a side receiver for the Z-4000 is.

The truth is that I enjoy running trains but I do not enjoy working on them or building anything (add to this some arthritis and age that limits what I can or want to do these days).

My background is with selling electrical "wire and cable management" products so I tend to have a strong preference for hard wiring over electronic controls.

The result is that I can control everything on the layout by switches that are within arms reach.

Thanks for the suggestions.

Jerry

Barry or others,

Not following you here.  But I am no expert.  Lets say I have two PS1 locomotives on a loop.  They are both cruising around.  I want to stop 1 of them.  How to I address the engine I want to stop.

Assuming the above is possible, is this possible with TMCC or only DCS.

Jerry,

Looking at the pic I would have never suspected your background was in cable management.  LOL  Very Tidy!!

Barry or others,

Not following you here.  But I am no expert.  Lets say I have two PS1 locomotives on a loop.  They are both cruising around.  I want to stop 1 of them.  How to I address the engine I want to stop.  No Ed Norton jokes........Pahleeeze.

Assuming the above is possible, is this possible with TMCC or only DCS.

PS/1 locomotives run in conventional mode, so other than having them run at whatever speed the current track voltage allows, there is no "running together".  The only way I know of stopping one is with my .45 if you want the other one to keep running on that track.

To amplify and hopefully summarize all available products.  Conventional locos without either PS2/PS3, TMCC/Legacy, or Lion Chief/Lion Chief Plus can be operated on a command layout, but it's hardly worth the effort.  You cannot independently control them easily unless they are on an electrically isolated loop or block.  If you lower the voltage to stop them, it also cuts off power to any command or Lion Chief locos.  If operating at more than 10-12 volts you could theoretically operate conventional locos using the voltage and direction capabilities of your transformer without affecting the command locos. In practice, it's not much fun or easy to do, IMO.

That said, you can operate PS2/PS3, TMCC/Legacy and Lion Chief radio frequency command locos completely independently using their respective handhelds (and their respective bases in the case of PS2/PS3 and TMCC/Legacy) on the same layout or even a single large loop of track.

RA,

No one would ever hire me to build their layout for them. I don't have the talent, patience or desire to put in more than the minimum effort required.

On the other hand I have never had a single splice fail in all the years since I built my first layout. I don't know what I would have done without all those IDC telephone and electrical connectors.

Its a good thing I built what I did when I did as I have since forgotten how I wired most of it. 

I could never build this today...

 I do it all the time quite easily.  If you're having issues, then you're doing it wrong.  Too many of you try and MAKE this stuff too hard.

How exactly do you run multiple conventional locomotives on the same power district at the same time, unless you have them in an MU configuration?

PS/1 locomotives run in conventional mode, so other than having them run at whatever speed the current track voltage allows, there is no "running together".  The only way I know of stopping one is with my .45 if you want the other one to keep running on that track."

 

That is exactly the information I was looking for when I started this topic.

With a dozen or so PS1 locos and only 3 or 4 PS2 locos it is now clear to me why I went with the Z-4000 Remote Commander years ago rather than using my TIUs and DCS Remotes. If I cannot control the individual PS1 locos with DCS there would be no benefit for me to use it on the O Gauge layout.

There have been times when the .45 ACP option might have been tempting. 

Thanks for answering my questions for me. I can relax now.

Nothing I said states that.  I was responding to his post about running CC and Conventional at the same time on the same loop, district, block, etc.

Since he has mostly conventional, that's the mode that's probably most interesting to him, and also the one that won't work.

Even conventional with command is pretty problematic.  I'm not saying it can't be done, I know that when I have experimented with it, the results are not all that satisfactory. 

TMCC/Legacy locomotives stop in their tracks whenever you interrupt track power.  You have to get them moving again after the interruption.

It works better for PS/2, as they'll continue at their last setting after a brief power interruption.  Wait too long and they need to be started up and moving.

If you try to run the conventional locomotive slowly, the command units frequently experience sound drop-outs or total brain fade.  Also, a brief interruption in power occasionally kills the sound on TMCC/Legacy units with no battery until you power cycle.

IMO, this is an exercise for masochists, but if you like it, I have no problem with that.   I can say it's not for me.

Masochists?  Hardly.

I can do it all pretty quickly (matter of seconds) just mashing buttons.  Only part on DCS I wish was different is that you could set voltage with buttons as opposed to just the wheel, but still, it's easy.  Being able to quickset the speed with CC locos speeds it up considerably. Typically, unless you have large loops, you will end up stopping both engines even if they are CC as the moving one will run into the stopped one.  So, I don't see much difference and it's certainly easier than trying to do it all in straight conventional mode.  

Of course this only affects those engines running off the same TIU channel.

Yep, no problem to run a conventional off each variable channel, and if you do Z4K tracks, you can run them on the fixed channels as well.

That is what I always thought.

Assuming I want to use your method, would you suggest Black Talons, flying ashtrays or just a good ol' fashion hollow point?

Jerry,

You already have the receiver. It's the same one you have plugged into the Z-4000 transformer you use with your old Z-4000 remote commander.

You can also use your DCS remote, set up with Z4K tracks, to operate the Z-4000 transformer the same way as your old remote without the TIU being installed.

I think for O-scale locomotives, plain old FMJ will do fine, the .45 has plenty of stopping power when matched against an 8# locomotive!

Gentlemen,

    His initial question was Remote Commander or DCS, even with running mostly Conventional IMO the full DCS is the way to go, just so many more things you can do,

including the AIU for controlling switches from the Hand held remote.  The full DCS opens up a lot of options, add the TMCC and some of new Commmand Control switches

and your options expand even further.  He has a real nice layout to run all different kids of remote control with.

PCRR/Dave 

Dave,

If you read the 6th post from the top, you'll see he's talking about the original Z-4000 Remote Commander System. It comes with the remote & receiver and that is what he's using now instead of his DCS system which he has also.

http://www.mthtrains.com/content/40-4001