I watched a review from Eric Siegel (Eric's Trains) on YouTube on the first edition of this loco and he said the reason that the engine jackrabbits is because it has non-flywheel motors. It's an entry-level locomotive so that is one way to cut on production costs.

@Dynamo2112 posted:

I watched a review from Eric Siegel (Eric's Trains) on YouTube on the first edition of this loco and he said the reason that the engine jackrabbits is because it has non-flywheel motors. It's an entry-level locomotive so that is one way to cut on production costs.

They solved that issue with the software on the 2.0 models which don't have flywheels either. Starts and stops were very smooth.

@BobbyD posted:

They solved that issue with the software on the 2.0 models which don't have flywheels either. Starts and stops were very smooth.

Good deal!

I contacted Timkos repair in Beavercreek, OH, they claim to add a pair of flywheel can motors and metal gears for $95.00?

I may have to take them up on their offer.

what is your voltage to the track?

@prrhorseshoecurve posted:

I contacted Timkos repair in Beavercreek, OH, they claim to add a pair of flywheel can motors and metal gears for $95.00?

I may have to take them up on their offer.

That seems like a very reasonable price for that work.  However, after doing that, you'll be in it for over $300 (original price, upgrade, shipping to and from Timko).  Seems to defeat the purpose of a low-cost entry-level locomotive.

@Dave Koehler posted:

what is your voltage to the track?

I have a 1.0 and run it about 8-10 V. It's manageable at that voltage, even with the hard starts/ stops.

@prrhorseshoecurve- thanks for the info about Timko.

There was a post on the 3.0 thread that had an issue with the low hanging pilot.  He stated that it was an easy fix.  You may want to find that posting as it also included photos.  If I can find it, I'll place a link here.

https://ogrforum.com/...9#158251952037525219

@prrhorseshoecurve posted:

I contacted Timkos repair in Beavercreek, OH, they claim to add a pair of flywheel can motors and metal gears for $95.00?

Why not just buy a nice Railking with PS/3?

@RSJB18 posted:

I have a 1.0 and run it about 8-10 V. It's manageable at that voltage, even with the hard starts/ stops.

@prrhorseshoecurve- thanks for the info about Timko.

The Beta 1 does that was corrected with an electronic momentum on 2 or 2.5 , the one that came out in December.  And there is no need for new motors with fly wheels, if your not heavy on the remote

So that begs the question,  if I were to get a 2.0 or 2.5 remote, would my 1.0 Beta version run smoothly using that remote?

I’m with gunrunner.  I don’t understand the fascination with a cheapo engine from Menards.  I can think of better things to do with $300 than be their tester.  Send me the dough and I can probably locate an engine that doesn’t work in a trade.

@gunrunnerjohn posted:

Why not just buy a nice Railking with PS/3?

Cause Railking never made an FP unit. Try to get the 3rd rail FP7 in 3 rail, good luck! Its been reported in the 3 rail scale forum that the molds for the FP unit are gone from changing between various mfgs so there is no reissue of 3rd Rail FP7s anytime soon.

@Mallard4468 posted:

That seems like a very reasonable price for that work.  However, after doing that, you'll be in it for over $300 (original price, upgrade, shipping to and from Timko).  Seems to defeat the purpose of a low-cost entry-level locomotive.

But not compared to the cost of a 3rd rail 3-rail FP7 on the secondary market...if found!

@Allegheny posted:

So that begs the question,  if I were to get a 2.0 or 2.5 remote, would my 1.0 Beta version run smoothly using that remote?

I believe the board in the engine had software changes , not the remote

@William 1 posted:

I’m with gunrunner.  I don’t understand the fascination with a cheapo engine from Menards.  I can think of better things to do with $300 than be their tester.  Send me the dough and I can probably locate an engine that doesn’t work in a trade.

the engine wasn't 300.00!

@Dave Koehler posted:

the engine wasn't 300.00!

The "bayed ones are close or adding the $90+ for new motors to yours. Clearly pushing MTH scale F prices considering the difference in features.

I understand someone may want the cab for a super detailing project. It was mentioned the Sunset mold is no longer available for the "P" model.

@Dave Koehler posted:

the engine wasn't 300.00!

True, but I think GRJ was responding to the posts about spending additional $$ to upgrade the loco. The initial purchase price, plus whatever it costs to upgrade/enhance. I get it.

@William 1 posted:

I’m with gunrunner.  I don’t understand the fascination with a cheapo engine from Menards.  I can think of better things to do with $300 than be their tester.  Send me the dough and I can probably locate an engine that doesn’t work in a trade.

It's because it was being sold for 160 bucks and some folks think it will have Lionel quaking in their boots.  Four "runs" total up to 800 produced.  Hardly competition, particularly as these seem to be scarfed up by the roughly same people and not the general public at large.

There's probably at least another 200-400 sitting at the factory waiting for 4.0 and 4.5 "upgrades."  Cynical, I know but that's how it appears to me.

Rusty

@Dave Koehler posted:

the engine wasn't 300.00!

The engine after sending it for the $90 flywheel upgrade (plus shipping two ways) is easily $300 or more.  Please try to follow the conversation.

For the same money, I can buy a nice Railking PS/3 model with flywheels, cruise, smoke, full command control, etc.  Note the MSRP of $329.95, easily purchased at most dealers for $300 or less.

I don’t get the hard stops/starts comments. I leave the remote at the lowest setting to run the engine. Then throttle the z4000 to 10-11 volts and it’s fine. 3.0 version.

@ChiTown Steve posted:

I don’t get the hard stops/starts comments. I leave the remote at the lowest setting to run the engine. Then throttle the z4000 to 10-11 volts and it’s fine. 3.0 version.

I think they are referring to the 1.0 version. 2.0 was very smooth stopping when we ran it.

@gunrunnerjohn posted:

The engine after sending it for the $90 flywheel upgrade (plus shipping two ways) is easily $300 or more.  Please try to follow the conversation.

For the same money, I can buy a nice Railking PS/3 model with flywheels, cruise, smoke, full command control, etc.  Note the MSRP of $329.95, easily purchased at most dealers for $300 or less.

Scroll up and see what the link was about

@BobbyD posted:

I think they are referring to the 1.0 version. 2.0 was very smooth stopping when we ran it.

Hi Bobby, The original post talks about it with his new 3.5.

@William 1 posted:

I’m with gunrunner.  I don’t understand the fascination with a cheapo engine from Menards. 

I suppose one can be fascinated, but no one seems to remember"you get what you pay for".

Additionally, most folks don't seem to realize Menards isn't a hobby shop or a train manufacturer.

It's a big box home improvement center dabbling in o Guage to pay homage to the days when postwar trains could be bought at the local hardware store".

However there is no means for warranty service or parts. There is no "train counter" and most if not all of the employees, know absolutely zero about this hobby. If it works it works. If it don't, exchange it or get a refund. If it quits in a week,  a year,  or 10 years. Your on your own.

Menards probably nets more profit from  selling honey roasted peanuts, than o Guage trains.

@Dave Koehler posted:

Scroll up and see what the link was about

I did scroll up, too bad you didn't as well...  We were talking about the lack of flywheels and how to fix it.

@William 1 posted:

And what is the fascination with having an FP7 model.  Hope you have room on your shelf to show it off to anyone that knows the difference.

What is the fascination with having any particular model?

I like the FP7 quite a bit and have 3 Sunset ones in PRR.  I also purchased the Menards 1.0 model as a curiosity and it will be a fun future project to upgrade.  The extra 4' of length is a nice compromise between a standard length F unit for a steam generator equipped passenger cab units on smaller sections of track than the larger E units.

The PRR liked them enough to purchase 40 A units and 14 B units.  The first two AB sets were the only PRR F units painted in Tuscan Red paint and were common power for the train to York, PA.  While the majority of them served in freight service, they did last long enough to run during Conrail. 

Of course I do know the difference between the various EMD F units.  The Menards unit is and FP9.

@gunrunnerjohn posted:

I did scroll up, too bad you didn't as well...  We were talking about the lack of flywheels and how to fix it.

Oddly enough I Did, and it was a Listed as

My review and impression of the Menard's Santa Fe Beta 3.5 F unit!   

not a motor replacement thread or a Menard's bashing thread!

@Dave Koehler posted:

Oddly enough I Did, and it was a Listed as

My review and impression of the Menard's Santa Fe Beta 3.5 F unit!   

not a motor replacement thread or a Menard's bashing thread!

OK, read the first post by the OP, I think there's a little bashing going on.  In any case, knock yourself out and have the last word, I'm tired of the game.

@ChiTown Steve posted:

Hi Bobby, The original post talks about it with his new 3.5.

Would be nice to see video of it occuring, the voltage settings, etc. The 2.0 was flawless in no jerky starts and stops using 16V.

Interesting viewpoints on my little review and impressions. Yes, there are a lot of things that one could get for another $100 to $120 but in that thread of commentary then $2k gets even more. I was just pointing out my thoughts and feelings about this engine. I have plenty of F units in other makes to run so why did I get one?

I have read all of comments about the Menards engines and the people that point out that adding or changing the command control parts or motor parts might be going down a fiscal rabbit hole so to speak have a point. I would think that many of us have done this in our hobby life at some point or another.

I wanted to experience one for myself and living on the west coast, which all people either do or want to hate. Simply we do not have a Menards out this way.

My answer to the question is who I think this engine is targeted to? The average hardware store customer that remembers having trains as a kid and wants to get their family and themselves back into the hobby.

This engine works fine for that. Yes, it might break, wear out, have issues......and so does every other manufacturer from Dorfan to Lionel to American Flyer and on. I will continue to use it at train shows and for my personal enjoyment regardless of the shortcomings, or shall I state these as characteristic features of this engine?

Menards has asked people for their opinions and impressions and I wrote MY impressions and feelings. So if someone's feelings are hurt by this, well...tough.

@Allegheny posted:

So that begs the question,  if I were to get a 2.0 or 2.5 remote, would my 1.0 Beta version run smoothly using that remote?

I can confirm that a later remote will eliminate the short horn blast issue on 1.0 Beta, but not the abrupt starts and stops.  Wiring the motors in series and lowering the track voltage will help a bit.

John

Sounds like a keeper!

Where can I get one!  :-)

Mannyrock

Guys....comments about any business, sponsor or not, that suggests that you have gotten "ripped off" or your money was stolen will be deleted.  These are accusatory statements implying premeditation.  If you feel you have made a poor purchase, then take the item back because after all, you were not forced to make the purchase.

I think the excitement about this engine, from a supplier with success in buildings and freight cars, is that it offers hope for a new source for new and different, to fill the gap of vanished or threatening to vanish suppliers.  It was clearly identified as a "toe-in-thr-water"  experiment, and purchasers get to be guinea pigs.  If it was a steamer, l'd want one thrown in my cage.