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Need help with MTH F3 unable to contact MTH direct

RO Ray of sunshineOGR Forum Member DIGITAL SUBSCRIBER

I am moving from HO to O gauge 32 rail. I recently purchased an F3 AA Santa Fe set by MTH Number 20-2151-1. Everything seems to work just fine, but it arrived with a loose item inside the powered A unit. Upon opening it up, I find what appears to be an aluminum cylindrical part loose inside the unit. To me it might be a spacer that is used to support the front of the circuit board, but I do not know how to attach it. I wonder if it is attached with double sided tape to the bottom of the circuit board. If it is a spacer to support the circuit board, does it also get attached to the frame of the engine?

 

I called MTH twice, on hold for well over 1/2 hour. Extremely frustrating. Their engines are really nice, but I don't feel comfortable with getting any support. 

 

I also tried signing up for the MTH Yahoo group several weeks ago, in fact I tried 2 different times to sign up but no reply. Is this group dead? If not, how can I get signed up?

 

I am looking for as much info on MTH as I can get, as well as Lionel TMCC. I am not running any post war. For now I have a KW until my DCS system arrives this week. 

 

Thanks for your help.

 

RAY

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pennsydavepennsydaveOGR Forum Member DIGITAL SUBSCRIBER

This is a Proto Sound 1 engine and that 'spacer' is part of the heat sink.  There should be a long screw that secures it to one of the boards and it should go against a flat rectangle electrical item that produces heat.  I forget the exact name.  There should be a white electrical 'grease' to help dissipate the heat.   This is  not the best explanation and hopefully someone with all the right terminology will chime in or better yet, a picture of a normal PS1 board set installed.  

 

The engine was produced in the late 90s so it is at least 10 yrs old. Here is a picture of a complete PS1 system with the heat sink which goes under the bottom board I believe on the right end.  Look for a dark brown/black rectangular piece with a hole in the center for the screw to go through.

IMG_2948

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Last edited by pennsydave
G GGGOGR Forum Member
Originally Posted by Joe Allen:

Ray,

 

There's a hole for the screw in the frame between the fuel tank and the engines truck and goes up from the bottom. I believe the screw is a metric 4/40 and around 30mm long with a round head.

Joe,  It is kind of funny, the threads are US, but the length is metric:-)

 

A good hardware store will have the screw, just maybe not in black.  G

SH Southwest HiawathaOGR Forum Member
No such thing as a "metric 4/40." It's either a 4-40 or a metric screw, which would be an M3 or an M4, not sure which. A lot of trains use a mixture of metric and U.S. threads. Try a 4-40, they are common as dirt; if that doesn't work you'll have to find somebody that carries metric. Ace Hardware is usually a good place to start, or a lot of hobby shops carry them as well. Take along the spacer so you can see what size screw fits in the hole. 
 
The grease isn't essential, but it's a good idea since Proto-1 boards can overheat and the heat sink can use all the help it can get. It's called heat sink grease, heat conducting grease, or some such thing and Radio Shack sells a small tube of it for a few bucks. 
 
Originally Posted by Joe Allen:

Ray,

 

There's a hole for the screw in the frame between the fuel tank and the engines truck and goes up from the bottom. I believe the screw is a metric 4/40 and around 30mm long with a round head.

KerriganKerriganOGR Forum Member
I'm amazed that our new local Ace Hardware has a huge selection of screws, nuts, bolts, etc.
And if they don't have it, Wink's Hardware in downtown Portland has it!
 
Originally Posted by gunrunnerjohn:

GGG, define "good".  I think most of the "good" hardware stores have gone the way of the Dodo bird.  I find it very hard to find a good selection of metric hardware, and we have all the big box stores around.  Best is Ace Hardware around here, but I've had hardware on trains that I can't find there either.

JA Joe AllenOGR Forum Member DIGITAL SUBSCRIBER
Originally Posted by Southwest Hiawatha:
No such thing as a "metric 4/40." It's either a 4-40 or a metric screw, which would be an M3 or an M4, not sure which. A lot of trains use a mixture of metric and U.S. threads. Try a 4-40, they are common as dirt; if that doesn't work you'll have to find somebody that carries metric. Ace Hardware is usually a good place to start, or a lot of hobby shops carry them as well. Take along the spacer so you can see what size screw fits in the hole. 
 
The grease isn't essential, but it's a good idea since Proto-1 boards can overheat and the heat sink can use all the help it can get. It's called heat sink grease, heat conducting grease, or some such thing and Radio Shack sells a small tube of it for a few bucks. 
 
Originally Posted by Joe Allen:

Ray,

 

There's a hole for the screw in the frame between the fuel tank and the engines truck and goes up from the bottom. I believe the screw is a metric 4/40 and around 30mm long with a round head.

This is from the MTH parts site of a 20-2199-1 F-3 engine exactly like the one I own, so then I don't know what these screws are. The length clearly is metric according to them. I guess it's a mix of 4/40 and metric, but I didn't make them.
 
32.) Screw ( 4/40x30.0mm )          IA-0000002          0.15

       ( roundhead )( w/ 14.0mm undersized shank)

G GGGOGR Forum Member
Originally Posted by gunrunnerjohn:

GGG, define "good".  I think most of the "good" hardware stores have gone the way of the Dodo bird.  I find it very hard to find a good selection of metric hardware, and we have all the big box stores around.  Best is Ace Hardware around here, but I've had hardware on trains that I can't find there either.

Taylors, and The Tractor Store are two.  Actually, I am a little further south then you are, and there are plenty of Rural Hardware, and Farmer support stores for a better word, that carry quite a full line of fasteners in all types of materials and sizes.  G

RO Ray of sunshineOGR Forum Member DIGITAL SUBSCRIBER

Thanks to all of you that help with my issues. It turns out that the "spacer" is in  fact a heat sink as so many have informed me. I picked up some thermal grease at Radio Shack and determined that the screw is in fact a 4/40 screw. The length is 30mm or about 1 3/16 inches long.

 

Got it all back together and everything is fine.

 

I will be keeping this forum close to me as I know I will get a lot of information from everyone on the list.

 

RAY

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