Norfolk Southern Executive train by MTH

Jeff my engines came in several months ago and the passenger cars last week. All look very nice and we are pleased. I will take a look at Eric's review again as it has been awhile.

Will try and post some photos later when get back in town. I believe that you will be pleased with the set.

Another added bonus of the 2015 version is that it features Wick Moorman doing the station sound announcements. 

He has since retired but he was the CEO and Chairman of NS at the time the recordings were made. 

The idea to have dedicated OCS power and hence the F units was his idea so it is a very fitting tribute.

Hope someone post images of new units to see if the catalog art is correct?

Ron

Yes... I was surprised the new OCS train hasn't received more attention here too.  My locomotives and 5-car set arrived earlier this year... just haven't had the time to post pictures, and I don't have an operating layout at the moment. 

Also received an invoice from Mr. Muffin's Trains that the separate-sale "extra" passenger cars came in this week... RPO, full vista-dome, diner/sleeper 2-pack, extra coach 2-pack.

This new set should be a winner and at a minimum will relieve the price-pressure on the 2007 DAP sets that had really skyrocketed.  The passenger car names in the 2016 offering are different than those in the 2007 set.  So it's not a complete re-issue of the earlier set.  Good news for operators, since the new set can be had for great pricing.  (Some dealers are now selling the OCS locomotives for less than their pre-order prices.)  But somewhat bad news for those who were hoping to fill in a specific-named passenger car that they missed when the 2007 set came out.

David

No tethers!

Rocky Mountaineer posted:

Yes... I was surprised the new OCS train hasn't received more attention here too.  My locomotives and 5-car set arrived earlier this year... just haven't had the time to post pictures, and I don't have an operating layout at the moment. 

Also received an invoice from Mr. Muffin's Trains that the separate-sale "extra" passenger cars came in this week... RPO, full vista-dome, diner/sleeper 2-pack, extra coach 2-pack.

This new set should be a winner and at a minimum will relieve the price-pressure on the 2007 DAP sets that had really skyrocketed.  The passenger car names in the 2016 offering are different than those in the 2007 set.  So it's not a complete re-issue of the earlier set.  Good news for operators, since the new set can be had for great pricing.  (Some dealers are now selling the OCS locomotives for less than their pre-order prices.)  But somewhat bad news for those who were hoping to fill in a specific-named passenger car that they missed when the 2007 set came out.

David

David, how about posting pictures of the A-units.

Ron

The new version is much better. There are no tethers, and more accurate detailing and sounds. I have the A units, and plan on getting the B units and the passenger cars very soon. 

It's odd that with this such a popular train that no new photos have posted since their release.

here's a vid of the 2015 edition of the F unit with Wick's station sound announcements. 

Can anyone comment if the paint scheme is different on the new version from the 2007 DAP one? I happen to have the 2007 DAP version but would like to add the vista dome car. But was curious if the color scheme is different? 

Ill be doing a vid of the Lionel NKP 765 pulling the NS OCS special.  Should look great.

Thanks

Has anyone posted pics of the new NS passenger cars for a comparison. I just received the Vista Dome from Just Trains. It looks gorgeous. I took a couple of pics compared to the DAP version I have. Looks the same to me and matches perfectly. 

Lines on the new car look thinner than the earlier version.  Then again it may just be me. Nice car!

Sunrise

Sunrise Special posted:

Lines on the new car look thinner than the earlier version.  Then again it may just be me. Nice car!

Sunrise

Sunrise, I agree with your assessment!  Also to me the stripe color looks slightly different.

Ron

Do the new cars really have thumb tacks on the couplers?

bigtruckpete posted:

Do the new cars really have thumb tacks on the couplers?

It appears that the old trucks were used.  Note the old car has springs.  I wonder if the manufacturing plant decided to use up old parts.  Or was that a MTH decision?!

Must find my original full dome to compare.

Ron

Did the six-wheel trucks get an update to the T-bar couplers? That may be why the full-dome has older couplers.

---PCJ

RailRide posted:

Did the six-wheel trucks get an update to the T-bar couplers? That may be why the full-dome has older couplers.

---PCJ

Good point may be.  Do know that the six wheel trucks on my more recent heavy weights are updated.

Must figure out where my original full dome DAP is hiding.

Ron

Does MTH have two versions of the six wheel streamlined truck?

I am somewhat bummed out that the new set has the same road numbers as the DAP set.  I was under the impression that they only made the DAP set never to be made again In the same road numbers. The DAP sets are supposed to be collectors sets only made once. So much for the value of my DAP set. �� Will never buy another DAP set again!!!!! Shame on you MTH...

raildog posted:

I am somewhat bummed out that the new set has the same road numbers as the DAP set.  I was under the impression that they only made the DAP set never to be made again In the same road numbers. The DAP sets are supposed to be collectors sets only made once. So much for the value of my DAP set. �� Will never buy another DAP set again!!!!! Shame on you MTH...

Exactly!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

We were bamboozled!

Ron

New locomotives look really nice and sound great!  I will run with my older MTH NW passenger cars.

I'm disappointed too about the remake of the Dap set. I went to Mike Wolf and asked him would he rerun this set in PS-2. He told me no because he only made 250 copies of the set and that the sets were collectible. He did tell me that he would make the Dap set in a Rail king version but it would not have the detail of the Premier set. I didn't buy my set (Premier) for the collectability, but it was nice to know at one point it had some real value to it!!................rogerw.

PRRronbh posted:

raildog posted:

I am somewhat bummed out that the new set has the same road numbers as the DAP set.  I was under the impression that they only made the DAP set never to be made again In the same road numbers. The DAP sets are supposed to be collectors sets only made once. So much for the value of my DAP set. �� Will never buy another DAP set again!!!!! Shame on you MTH...

Exactly!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

We were bamboozled!

Ron

Seriously, guys??

Of course the new 2016 MTH set will have the same numbers as the 2007 DAP because in real life those are the _only road numbers_ for the actual NS four unit ABBA.  NS has actually purchased additional F-units supposedly for additional OCS engines (See AltoonaWorks site) but only NS knows if that project will see the light of day.  While it would be nice if NS had already added those F-units to the OCS fleet and MTH could have made the new sets to match those F-units, it ain't happened.  If MTH made the 2016 OCS with different numbers, OGR servers would have melted with all the complaining.

Now, if you compare the 2007 DAP A-units and the new OCS A-unit offerings from MTH, you will notice the new 2016 number board lettering is much smaller in font size than the 2007 version.  If you compare the two sets to the actual OCS F-units, you will see that the _2007 DAP set matches the real life number boards_ while the 2016 MTH units do not.

Therefore, you could say the 2007 DAP units do maintain their desirability because they more closely match the real NS OCS F-units than do the 2016 MTH issue side-by-side.

If collectors can overlook the fact that the 2007 & 2016 sets are F-7s and not F-9s like the real OCS, then it seems to me that complaining the new 2016 issue is somehow ruining a "value" of the 2007 DAP units is a bit disingenuous.  Recall that value is in the eye of the beholder.  And then point out the more realistic number boards. 

Cheers,

Bryan

RidgeRunner posted:

PRRronbh posted:

raildog posted:

I am somewhat bummed out that the new set has the same road numbers as the DAP set.  I was under the impression that they only made the DAP set never to be made again In the same road numbers. The DAP sets are supposed to be collectors sets only made once. So much for the value of my DAP set. �� Will never buy another DAP set again!!!!! Shame on you MTH...

Exactly!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

We were bamboozled!

Ron

Seriously, guys??

Of course the new 2016 MTH set will have the same numbers as the 2007 DAP because in real life those are the _only road numbers_ for the actual NS four unit ABBA.  NS has actually purchased additional F-units supposedly for additional OCS engines (See AltoonaWorks site) but only NS knows if that project will see the light of day.  While it would be nice if NS had already added those F-units to the OCS fleet and MTH could have made the new sets to match those F-units, it ain't happened.  If MTH made the 2016 OCS with different numbers, OGR servers would have melted with all the complaining.

Now, if you compare the 2007 DAP A-units and the new OCS A-unit offerings from MTH, you will notice the new 2016 number board lettering is much smaller in font size than the 2007 version.  If you compare the two sets to the actual OCS F-units, you will see that the _2007 DAP set matches the real life number boards_ while the 2016 MTH units do not.

Therefore, you could say the 2007 DAP units do maintain their desirability because they more closely match the real NS OCS F-units than do the 2016 MTH issue side-by-side.

If collectors can overlook the fact that the 2007 & 2016 sets are F-7s and not F-9s like the real OCS, then it seems to me that complaining the new 2016 issue is somehow ruining a "value" of the 2007 DAP units is a bit disingenuous.  Recall that value is in the eye of the beholder.  And then point out the more realistic number boards. 

Cheers,

Bryan

 

 

Bryan,

Your opinion is duly noted. Bottom line,regardless of "value" they were only supposed to be a one run one of a kind program and that did not happen. Jus sayin....

Mark

raildog posted:

RidgeRunner posted:

PRRronbh posted:

raildog posted:

I am somewhat bummed out that the new set has the same road numbers as the DAP set.  I was under the impression that they only made the DAP set never to be made again In the same road numbers. The DAP sets are supposed to be collectors sets only made once. So much for the value of my DAP set. �� Will never buy another DAP set again!!!!! Shame on you MTH...

Exactly!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

We were bamboozled!

Ron

Seriously, guys??

Of course the new 2016 MTH set will have the same numbers as the 2007 DAP because in real life those are the _only road numbers_ for the actual NS four unit ABBA.  NS has actually purchased additional F-units supposedly for additional OCS engines (See AltoonaWorks site) but only NS knows if that project will see the light of day.  While it would be nice if NS had already added those F-units to the OCS fleet and MTH could have made the new sets to match those F-units, it ain't happened.  If MTH made the 2016 OCS with different numbers, OGR servers would have melted with all the complaining.

Now, if you compare the 2007 DAP A-units and the new OCS A-unit offerings from MTH, you will notice the new 2016 number board lettering is much smaller in font size than the 2007 version.  If you compare the two sets to the actual OCS F-units, you will see that the _2007 DAP set matches the real life number boards_ while the 2016 MTH units do not.

Therefore, you could say the 2007 DAP units do maintain their desirability because they more closely match the real NS OCS F-units than do the 2016 MTH issue side-by-side.

If collectors can overlook the fact that the 2007 & 2016 sets are F-7s and not F-9s like the real OCS, then it seems to me that complaining the new 2016 issue is somehow ruining a "value" of the 2007 DAP units is a bit disingenuous.  Recall that value is in the eye of the beholder.  And then point out the more realistic number boards. 

Cheers,

Bryan

 

 

Bryan,

Your opinion is duly noted. Bottom line,regardless of "value" they were only supposed to be a one run one of a kind program and that did not happen. Jus sayin....

Mark

That is true Mark, according to what Mike Wolf told me personally!..............rogerw.

Folks, I think the big take-away here is that ALL the stuff produce these days are simply "moment in time" collectables with high desirability levels that in turn command premium prices -- but only for a relatively brief period of time.  We can site dozens of similar "hot products" that cooled down over time.

Selfishly speaking, I was glad to see MTH re-issue this train because the pent-up demand was evident for years.  And I missed out on the original DAP OCS train. 

And then there's always the issue of the technology treadmill, with the new locomotives having MU capability sans the not-so-popular tether.  So I can see the newer F-models being more desirable in the short-term for that reason too.

Bottom line... It was time for this re-issue, and I'm glad MTH did it.

David

Rocky Mountaineer posted:

Folks, I think the big take-away here is that ALL the stuff produce these days are simply "moment in time" collectables with high desirability levels that in turn command premium prices -- but only for a relatively brief period of time.  We can site dozens of similar "hot products" that cooled down over time.

Selfishly speaking, I was glad to see MTH re-issue this train because the pent-up demand was evident for years.  And I missed out on the original DAP OCS train. 

And then there's always the issue of the technology treadmill, with the new locomotives having MU capability sans the not-so-popular tether.  So I can see the newer F-models being more desirable in the short-term for that reason too.

Bottom line... It was time for this re-issue, and I'm glad MTH did it.

David

 

No David, the BIG take-away is Mike Wolf "broke" a trust and/or deceived us with the DAP product(s) or at least this one.  Based on a comment he made to me here during the NS Heritage Event I understand his failure to honor his word.  The word that Roger has stated here.

Ron

PRRronbh posted:

... No David, the BIG take-away is Mike Wolf "broke" a trust and/or deceived us with the DAP product(s) or at least this one.  Based on a comment he made to me here during the NS Heritage Event I understand his failure to honor his word.  The word that Roger has stated here.

Ron

Ron, obviously folks are coming into this with different viewpoints, and that's perfectly understandable.  I'm just trying to look at "the big picture" here.

Folks who own the original DAP OCS set need to ask themselves why they are so upset over the re-issue.  Are they really buying trains for the investment-value?  Do they want to own something SOLELY BECAUSE it's desired by so many other folks?  And if so, how do they feel when that item isn't hot anymore -- whatever the reason.  Do they lose interest in owning it anymore?

There are no right-or-wrong answers to those questions.  They are what they are.   But sooner or later, ALL this stuff looses its "highly desirable" status...  and when that happens, prices usually drop like a lead ballon.  There are just too many options out there today that distract folks to keep looking for the next newly announced product.  So whether by direct re-issue or a new production run with new features, it's all part of the territory these days.  Seems to be a healthy way to view something we really can't control anyway.

I'm in favor of companies selling whatever they can at a fair price, if they sense there's a good market for it.  Price-gouging (often linked to collectability) we can do without, but delivering excellent value is always welcome.  

Just sayin... 

David

I hope that someday MTH reissues the DAP set of "Yellow Bonnet" Santa Fe F units as well. Lionel will never do them and the 3rd rail set is not my cup of tea. These companies are all struggling to just "stay alive." Whatever they can profitably make and sell they should. 

I'm glad that I brought the 1st issue DAP set PS-2. The total cost for the A-B-B-A set was $859.90 To purchase the 2015 PS-3 version of the same exact set is $1239.80. I saved at today's prices $379.90. The biggest difference between both sets is PS-2 vs. PS-3, no tethers, and you can run each A unit individually or as a lashup (multi unit consist)......................rogerw.

ROGERW posted:

I'm glad that I brought the 1st issue DAP set PS-2. The total cost for the A-B-B-A set was $859.90 To purchase the 2015 PS-3 version of the same exact set is $1239.80. I saved at today's prices $379.90. The biggest difference between both sets is PS-2 vs. PS-3, no tethers, and you can run each A unit individually or as a lashup (multi unit consist)......................rogerw.

Roger, I'm also under the impression that some of the passenger cars in the re-issue have different names on them.  Can't say for certain, but that's what I was told.  I have some of the extra OCS add-on passenger cars sitting at Mr. Muffins that I need to pay for so he can ship them out to me.   I've just been swamped with work recently, since this is one of our busiest times of the year with graduations and such.  I haven't been really thinking all that much about trains.  So hang in there Steve, I'll be tending to those orders this week!!! 

David

ROGERW posted:

I'm glad that I brought the 1st issue DAP set PS-2. The total cost for the A-B-B-A set was $859.90 To purchase the 2015 PS-3 version of the same exact set is $1239.80. I saved at today's prices $379.90. The biggest difference between both sets is PS-2 vs. PS-3, no tethers, and you can run each A unit individually or as a lashup (multi unit consist)......................rogerw.

Roger, to me there is an advantage to the tethered Cab units.  You only need/have ONE ID number used.  For the independent units you must have an ID for each powered unit plus an additional ID for the "lashup."  Plus if you want the units to have a close-couple you must remove the the A-unit's rear proto-coupler and replace  with supplied dummy-coupler.

Ron

Here is a video of the new 2016 cars I took a couple weeks ago, along with the dummy A, behind the J.  I still need to pick up one of the extra 2-car sets from my LHS.

And I personally thanked Mike Wolf for re-doing this set like 2-3 York's ago.  So for everyone who is mad at MTH for doing it, there might be an equal amount happy about it.  

Great video. The cars look very nice. Mine are on layaway hope to get them soon. 

VADarthDad posted:

Here is a video of the new 2016 cars I took a couple weeks ago, along with the dummy A, behind the J.  I still need to pick up one of the extra 2-car sets from my LHS.

And I personally thanked Mike Wolf for re-doing this set like 2-3 York's ago.  So for everyone who is mad at MTH for doing it, there might be an equal amount happy about it.  

 

Did not realize MTH made Dummy A-units for this set.  So that means NO Proto-Coupler on front en of Dummy A-unit.

Selfishly speaking, I was glad to see MTH re-issue this train because the pent-up demand was evident for years.  And I missed out on the original DAP OCS train

ditto, I am not a collector per say, Just trying to get the most toys before I kick the proverbial bucket!    

What does OCS mean? 

Office car special I think

Thanks for chiming in, Jeff.  Yes... I've heard OCS, business train, executive train, etc... all used interchangeably for this train.

David

Thank you Gentlemen, I was guessing as much. I however have been know to be  wrong at times, sometime...